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So Im finally putting this motor in the car after refurbing the chassis and rebuilding the rear suspension after refurb. What a PITA job..
I am hoping to get some help with a few questions and check for anything that needs doing before I start building it back up .
This torx (or allen) bolt here? anyone know what its for lol. I was thinking of using it for a breather and block off the one on the exhaust manifold side.
What have others done for breather? I think it could work from the exhaust manifold side but its going to be a bit hot round there...
I was planning, to use the original one, go to an oil catch can, then cam cover breather to seperator also, then I believe I need to link that back to the intercooler pipework from the catch can?
So the questions!! Anyone see anything I am missing except the obvious?
The exhaust manifold is just perched there on the studs atm, and of course engine mount etc to go on, and ancilleries like alternator.
Is the water pump the right one? THis is a silvertop 2 litre so I think it needs the 1.8 zetec water pump that spins the right way?
WHere is the best place to take turbo oil feed? is it from a t piece on the oil pressure switch? anyone got any pictures of their setup
Last off, that turbo seems bigger than I rememberd lol. Its a TO4b, should be more than enough for my goal of 400 ponies. just hope the engine and tubular fit in the mid engine bay, its going to be tight.... so I may need a different manifold if it comes to it. (a cast one or something)
Any other booboos or suggestions please let me know!! cheers
Also, anyone got a picture of the pipework to the thermostat housing? Im guessing thats what that is on the top side?
Last edited by zetecbeast; Apr 24, 2019 at 11:22 PM.
You can get your oil feed for the turbo from the oil pressure switch or the Allen key near it as that's a blank into the oil galleries.
Thanks mate
Just noticed the coolant pipes off thermostat housing are going to be a bit tight too. Hopefully they will fit. Has anyone got any pictures of a built up silvertop turbo they can link me to?
Need to see what goes where ideally.
Also, I bought the turbo off Wilky on here a couple of years ago. Not seen him around looking at his posts. Im trying to find out what it is lol. T46683 and 10784 are the Turbonetics stiickers on it. Info I had when I bought it were it's a 50 trim comp with a stage 3 turbine can run 2.2 bar mate should do 450 bhp - it's there f1 turbine shaft . Numbers were T46683 but the second one was different as I just checked messages
Could you use the cvh thermostat housing on your car? That's what I run on my zt
Cheers mate
Just been out and checked, plenty of clearance, just that picture makes it looks tight! phew
Now I've got to find where the feck I put all the parts I took off!. What motor are you running? silver or blacktop?
Last edited by zetecbeast; Apr 25, 2019 at 04:06 PM.
BTW it looks like you have the 1.8 oil pump but the 2litre sump. In escorts and fiestas people normally use the 1.8 sump as it has clearance for the exhaust passing under the engine. I don't know what route youre exhaust will take but it may be something that needs addressing.
I use the gallery with the torx blank for my oil feed, so do ford with the focus Rs. That leaves the switch free for a combined oil pressure / low pressure warning unit if wanted.
I personally am not a fan of a large brass adapter.
Cheers mate
Just been out and checked, plenty of clearance, just that picture makes it looks tight! phew
Now I've got to find where the feck I put all the parts I took off!. What motor are you running? silver or blacktop?
Cheers mate. Its a mid engine kit car so no worries on exhaust clearance, as its only going to be 3ft long!
I will go that route I think. What have you done for the crankcase breather? Had a bit of a mare with it today. Problem one, Im not sure if I got burned with the exhaust manifold, its had a wastegate pipe added but Im sure I can see a crack in the middle of where the pipes join
To top it off, the turbo sits so low, that making a return enter the sump in the braided line with those beefy fittings seems all but impossible. I am left with about a 2 inch run of pipe that has quite a bend in it (if I make it up).
Not sure what I am going to do, anyone got a T3 exhaust manifold for sale lol? I would like to make this one work, just cant see how at the minute. Ive clocked the turbo every way possible. The only thing I can think of is to get a hose made up by a place like Pirtek that loses all the clumsy elbows and fittings of the aeroquip copy stuff
Also, I think Im going to have to use the T piece as well as its got an oil pressure gauge on the dash.
ALso found out injectors are side feed not end feed, so they dont fit the HO manifold ffs!
Lots of oil pressure switches have the low oil pressure switch built in. So it’s just one port.
Stainless steel manifolds, thin wall stainless will crack. It’s not a case of if it’s a case of when. Just weld it back up.
The in thing for budget Zetec turbo manifolds is the standard mild steel manifold from a crate engine. They are cheap and easy to modify and being steel they should be a little more durable.
Again I am not a fan of the cvh manifold with adapters, will it even flow 400 horses ?
Hydraulic hoses fittings are usually steel. I wouldn’t really fancy using them on your vey soft welded alloy An fitting.
Alloy push fittings are fairly compact.
I thought you said in your other post your injectors fitted fine ?
Cheers mate
Regards the exhaust manifold, I can mig weld but dont have a tig setup, think stainless needs a decent setup? Any ways to check if the manifold is actually cracked? without fitting it on the car, getting the car running and mapped only to find out its got a split? Anyone know someone in south yorkshire who could weld the split for me? It looks like theres a lot of weld inside the collector behind the crack, I just dont know if its a new or an old crack that is sealed. I did think of pressure testing it with water but its really when its hot that a split would open up more I guess?
Not sure on other options, was thinking about focus rs one? would that fit?
My hp goals are 350-400 hp and I will be happy at that, I dont know if cvh would flow that but if I can keep the tubular I will be!
thanks for the pics of your oil drain, Will get some pictures up of how mine is though I was going to take the manifold off again to check this crack.Will take some before I do. Its getting mega tight for clocking the turbo to actually fit so I can get oil feed fitting on and get the drain in a suitable angle of <15 degrees.
good point on hydraulic hoses, will look at push fit ones like yours
About the injectors, that was my mistake. Had a load of stuff going on and thought I had ones that fitted, it turns out they dont. I thought they fit the same as impreza 440s, side feed. Will check again why they dont and take a pic! cheers
Originally Posted by big_wasa
Lots of oil pressure switches have the low oil pressure switch built in. So its just one port.
Stainless steel manifolds, thin wall stainless will crack. Its not a case of if its a case of when. Just weld it back up.
The in thing for budget Zetec turbo manifolds is the standard mild steel manifold from a crate engine. They are cheap and easy to modify and being steel they should be a little more durable.
Again I am not a fan of the cvh manifold with adapters, will it even flow 400 horses ?
Hydraulic hoses fittings are usually steel. I wouldnt really fancy using them on your vey soft welded alloy An fitting.
Alloy push fittings are fairly compact.
I thought you said in your other post your injectors fitted fine ?
you will need a water pump from an escort along with the ribbed pulley, I've herd of people running the smooth pulley but I didn't like the idea of it , breather wise I removed the oe breather and knocked a core plug in the hole. And drilled tapped the rear of the block to use as the breather , hope this helps
Thanks
is Escort and mondeo water pump different then? Why does it need changing?!
about drilling and tapping the other side, thats what I was thinking tbo but i guess would mean opening the engine up to remove any swarf? Not something I want to be doing now its built. Would have been useful if stanwood had done this when they built the engine tbo...
has anyone got a picture of how the dipstick bolts up? Mine seem to want to live 2 inches away from the mount!
Also, is it a rubber pipe usually used on the stock breather -> I can get to it and its ok with the turbo on, as its near coldside of turbo Im hoping heat wont melt it !
Originally Posted by Adder
Re Waterpump,
you will need a water pump from an escort along with the ribbed pulley, I've herd of people running the smooth pulley but I didn't like the idea of it , breather wise I removed the oe breather and knocked a core plug in the hole. And drilled tapped the rear of the block to use as the breather , hope this helps
Silvertop waterpumps, the Escort pump and pulley will allow you run a simple triangle set up. The Mondeo pump will need an idler pulley to drive the pump of the back of the belt. Ie backwards.
Do you need to use the Ho manifold for packaging reasons ? Ie do you need the over the top design ?
The Focus Rs inlet will flow your 400bhp, bolts directly on and can take a variety of injectors. And I would have thought 630cc would have been ample ? They tune the mk1 Rs to the 300’s on the Oem 440’s
The Rs manifold isn’t anything fancy but it does have couple of extra bracing brackets.
your turbo, it looks huge. Isn’t it from a 6L diesel engine. Like the big Holsets ? Hence the external wastegate. What’s the spool and torque curve going to be like ? I am sure it will make the numbers but what will it drive like.
In a mid engine kitcar I would think the last thing you need is large dollops of torque to brake the back end loose. You will be pointing the wrong way on round abouts lol.
I would have thought the tried and tested Gt28 hybrids would be much better suited. Again if You go the Rs route it will all bolt on and have room for the block breather.
Last edited by big_wasa; Apr 27, 2019 at 09:23 PM.
there are three differant ones ones for a silvertop. Its a long while since I played with a silvertop so cant remember what place on what model.
Ah balls, that could be the issue... the one I have is off the old 1.8 zetec ffs.
Silvertop waterpumps, the Escort pump and pulley will allow you run a simple triangle set up. The Mondeo pump will need an idler pulley to drive the pump of the back of the belt. Ie backwards.
Ah yeah I recall this back then. That's a big pain then... so I need an escort water pump basically? I wish I had pictures of the last setup... unfortunately I was a bit hasty in taking it out then selling it as I had no space at the time. I didnt realise this was a mondeo water pump... it was meant to be an escort one to match the last engine .. (which didnt have an idler as I recall. will check my remaining bits)
Do you need to use the Ho manifold for packaging reasons ? Ie do you need the over the top design ?
The Focus Rs inlet will flow your 400bhp, bolts directly on and can take a variety of injectors. And I would have thought 630cc would have been ample ? They tune the mk1 Rs to the 300s on the Oem 440s
The Rs manifold isnt anything fancy but it does have couple of extra bracing brackets
No mate, I dont recall any packaging problems . Its been a while since I had an engine in the car lol but this was the old setup... Should be plenty of room for a different one!
I dont have any big preference about keeping the HO one, other than I have already got it and the focus RS one will cost me to buy... could be an option though for sure.
And my last 2ps worth.
your turbo, it looks huge. Isnt it from a 6L diesel engine. Like the big Holsets ? Hence the external wastegate. Whats the spool and torque curve going to be like ? I am sure it will make the numbers but what will it drive like.
In a mid engine kitcar I would think the last thing you need is large dollops of torque to brake the back end loose. You will be pointing the wrong way on round abouts lol.
I would have thought the tried and tested Gt28 hybrids would be much better suited. Again if You go the Rs route it will all bolt on and have room for the block breather.
No keep the 2ps coming lol
The turbo, does seem huge... Its a T3. I bought it off a guy on here, Its a T04b Turbonetics. that is apparently good for 2.2 bar and 450hp max. DOnt think its a truck turbo like a Holset, its got some F1 turbine shaft and 50 trim comp with a stage 3 turbine .
Agree totally, Might be a better route going the RS focus way. Would save me a pain in the a$$ for sure. But at this stage Ive ploughed a lot in and I cant really afford to buy all new bits unless I got a really good deal on the RS focus manifold and turbo. Anyone know how much they run to?? ŁŁ thanks
Ok, so you have already had it installed and running once ?
Thats a little differant, I was under the impression you had a bunch of random parts that where in theory good for 400+ bhp.
i play with zetecs a lot, I’ve built a few turbo set ups but I am no expert and mine are all at the budget / diy end of things.
I work on the fact if it works for the manufacture it will work for me.
if I google your turbo, Case tractors come up ? I’ve never heard of it in a production car but there are very few production cars of zetec age running 400 horses.
I mention the Rs a lot because I work on the principle if works for Oem it will work for me. It doesn’t mean it’s the only or best way to do things but it does all bolt together like Lego.
I wouldn’t let that sway you into swapping out what you have .
Not had this setup installed and running. The old setup was a silvertop zetec 1.8 t that came with the car. Was a bit roughshod and not quick enough so I took it out and got the new 2 litre lump built a few years ago. But then life got busy and it all sat in the garage so I have forgotten what was on it precisely.
What makes you say this is a truck turbo? The numbers on it are 1074 and T-46683. Its not in a production car, its like a high spec performance aftermarket one. Probably overkill but a GT28 or something costs a packet and this one was less money and brand new from Wilky on here.
I agree for sure on the Rs oem route as being easier. But then this is a kit car with no manual or owners forum so I kind of thought 'feckit' lol. I have built several single turbo supras from scratch so know the principles and methods of what I need to do exactly, but I just dont have any zetec knowledge as yet, but Im getting there lol.
Going to take the manifold off and check for crack and get it rewelded and then go from there, Im thinking of selling my Mig and buying a mig/tig second hand instead so I can do my own downpipe etc but I looked and rsfocus ex maniflold was Ł150, turbo probs Ł500 at least for one that works and then inlet I dont know, probs Ł250? but using the bits I have its free even if I have a bit more lag, it shouldnt be a lot. The engine has an area six ported head on it so should make boost at a sensible rpm I hope!
Originally Posted by big_wasa
Ok, so you have already had it installed and running once ?
Thats a little differant, I was under the impression you had a bunch of random parts that where in theory good for 400+ bhp.
i play with zetecs a lot, I’ve built a few turbo set ups but I am no expert and mine are all at the budget / diy end of things.
I work on the fact if it works for the manufacture it will work for me.
if I google your turbo, Case tractors come up ? I’ve never heard of it in a production car but there are very few production cars of zetec age running 400 horses.
I mention the Rs a lot because I work on the principle if works for Oem it will work for me. It doesn’t mean it’s the only or best way to do things but it does all bolt together like Lego.
I wouldn’t let that sway you into swapping out what you have .
Last edited by zetecbeast; Apr 28, 2019 at 11:22 AM.
Nice one for the water pump pics. It does indeed seem to be the escort pump! nice one. I will get looking for a pulley then and get it swapped over. and nice one for the pic above, mega useful
Last edited by zetecbeast; Apr 28, 2019 at 03:53 PM.
Zetec turbo build advice on whats missing
