bj928

didn't know there was so much knowledge on passion ford, most threads by now would have been handbags at dawn!!!

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Recent passionford was just far too much bitching, although the knowledge was always there too, it started as mild banter and just got too much over a period of a few years.

2011 passionford so far since all the changes to stop the abuse absolutely fucking rocks IMHO

stevieturbo

Again, given the nature of the build and your goals. You need to find them first, and then select an ecu they are happy to work with.

I know of a person who spent ages putting together a massive twin turbo project on AEM ( as they offered a plug in unit ).
It took him over a year to find someone in the UK who would even attempt to tune it, and for whatever reason, it still isnt finished.
So if you arent capable of doing the work yourself....dont dig a hole for yourself.

The DTA I'm using will do everything you need, and has traction control too. But whether you can find a tuner to work with it, I dont know. Despite it being very easy...some tuners just stick with what they know regardless of how difficult or easy another system might be.

I really could have chosen any ecu I wanted, as I'd be doing everything myself anyway. I had been using their old P8Pro for several years, but decided the upgrade to the S80Pro when it was released was the easiest and best value at the time.

I couldnt really justify spending a few hundred or a few grand more, for little benefit.

bj928

my ultimate goal would be to fit the engine into a vehicle to put FORD back on the map for TOTB or something similar, could be anything, i have the kit car with the viper engine in that could be used as i could build it round the engine, would like to fit it in a sierra but don't think i could get a front drive to fit that would take the power or fit it under the bonnet, my personal favorit to fit engine to would be a mk6 transit, but its a bit big to start doing TOTB, transit would be easy to fit the 4x4 setup i want, but could have other problems to over come, i want it road drivable and reliable not a trailer queen, thats one of the reasons i'm looking at a spec for 1500+ hp but only want to run 1000hp, i know these figures sound big, but for the modular v8 quad cam engine they are quite easy, i would say a 1000hp modular 5.4 is equal to about a 400hp cossie

also want to put the skylines in there place looking at the rear of a ford

bj928

don't some research on the COP's and way more people are saying the factory ones are better than the aftermarket, makes me wonder if its just home tunners getting things wrong, or if mulitiple good well known manufactorers can get it wrong, factory COP's are 25000 volts, aftermarket 65000 volts, i can't see anyone being able to fit them wrong, but rednecks are a law unto themselfs

stevieturbo

who says OE COP's are 25k, and who says aftermarket are 65k ? TBH, the chances of a modern COP running only 25k is very slim. Even shitty ancient oil filled coils with points would be circa 25k. Most electronic ignition is higher, with modern coils higher again

Just because a company in the aftermarket makes something, doesnt mean its better, as I already highlighted in the case of some MSD stuff.

bj928

I'm only going by the forums and aftermarket ads, the OEM COP's are said to be 25k and aftermarkets in verying volts upto 65k, about 9 out of 10 people on the forums say after trying aftermarket, they went back to OEM, the ones that said they worked well said trottle reponse was better and engine was smother, i would expect the latter, maybe the people that said they were crap had other issues and blamed the COP's, is there any uk or jap COP's that maybe would be useable, after all the americans aren't very advanced with there automotive electronics

stevieturbo

Youre missing it.

If the OE COP's work fine, then use them. They bolt in, they are neat, they will usually be cheap, and they work. Why use anything else ?

it's like people fitting aftermarket MSD coils to LS engines....yes they may work, for a while.

But they provide absolutely no benefit whatsoever, and they relieve the buyer of several hundred dollars. When the OE LS2 coils have been proven to crazy HP.

Some people just think they need to buy stuff because it is painted bright red.

whizzisat114

iTrader: (2)

Brilliant post

lernt so much Thanks All

bj928

so basicly in real terms they are a con, i'll be getting OEM me thinks


ok, another thing i need to know about is how to decide what plug to use, in the 24v cosworth i have always used VW triple electrode plugs of the correct temp, length and thread because i found them to work better than any other, what makes a good plug, and how do you decide on which one to use, never found the expensive ones to be any better than the triples, but then i have never worked with a boosted engine

stu21t

iridium are supposed to be the ones.
ive got a set in my cossie and i noticed a difference as soon as i fitted them.
car ran smoother just with the better plugs.

stevieturbo

In some cases aftermarket ignition systems may be more powerful.

But many modern OE systems are powerful enough to blow your head off.

When you have a good ignition system, plain cheap copper plugs will work just fine. The only real benefit from precious metal type plugs, is longer life. If your plugs are easy to chance, use cheap copper.
If the are difficult to change, then a precious metal plug could be considered as you can leave them in longer whilst still providing good performance.
Generally I only use NGK, but failing that, Denso.

And again, triple electrode plugs will offer NO benefit whatsoever, other that a slightly longer service life. As there will only ever be one spark per cycle, and it will only ever fire to the closest electrode.

bj928

the only advantage i can see to triples is that the spark will take the path of least resistance, not always the shortest distance, so hopefully it gives a good spark each time as more point to jump accross to.

stevieturbo

least resistance will likely be shortest distance.

multiple electrodes are only for longer service life. Nothing else. It will only ever jump across one gap per spark event.

I'd say they are a waste of money.

SiZT

Bump for a good thread and a question for Stu.

I have a good idea of the software you use to map OE and I was wondering why you chose that particular software

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

God, we use loads mate so you will have to be far more specific.
Which software are you referring to mate?

SiZT

All of the screenshots I've seen on here and FF look like Dimsport to me? Don't know whether it is or not

foreigneRS

there are some very clever italians out there working on engine management, remaps etc +

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Race Pro Evolution is just the best for stuff like this, we also use pretty much every other system on the market too.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Agreed I think that 1000 years of Italian men constantly managing to find their way into other people's mrs's via an unprotected backdoor has left them as life's natural hackers

Rick

I've always wondered why it's the Italians that seem to be leaders in this sort of thing - think Chip has just solved it for me.

GVK.

Funniest thing I've read on here for a while!

jaguar82

DTA S40 - probably the worst ECU that money can buy! After about 2 years my experience is very bad. Cheap plastic box, overheating coil drivers due to no heat sink on them, poor connector, 8-12 turns on cranking before sync standard flywheel, totaly unusable boost control and very poor usable idle control, poor support on web, poor and non updated manual, and even after few months of buying they don't admit any warranty even it should be valid 12 months as said on their web page.

First I think that my loom was not good, so I change it. Then that ECU is not good, but Allan from DTA said that it is ok... thing is that it is just cheap and poor build. My engine is about 500-600 hp capable, I am convicted to run again OEM ecu and adapt DTA only as 5th injector driver until buy something else.

For 500 pounds how much it cost, it is better to find something else... even MS1 for 250 bucks is working better here in one audi.

stevieturbo

The troll returns

jaguar82

Please Steive, stop follow me on every forum in a world. On every my post anywhere you are always first on answer. What is with you, man? Do I need to change nick to hide from you? If I live in UK I would really sue you for disturbing!
This is my experience with that ECU, if you have better say it. It is free!

stevieturbo

I posted in this thread long before you. Do you understand what happens when users subscribe to threads ?
yes, they get emailed when there are updates

Perhaps this lack of understanding is why you were incapable of reading the specs and purchasing an ecu suitable for your needs, then actually being able to use it.

If you purchase a product that isnt suitable then you are unable to use it. Generally that isnt the manufacturers fault.

It would be like a 1 year old buying a bicycle then falling off it, then blaming the manufacturer of the bike.

And this thread is about the best engine management. Not one where users can whinge about their own inability to use or select engine management.

jaguar82

Please, just stop disturbing me on every forum, mail and phone almost every day. What is with you? I told you that you seriously breaking the law, and I will need to take some steps to protect myself and even family.

Could admin please delete posts after my review about mine s40? Forum is place for exchanging experiences nad knowledge, not for personal hunting.

Thanks!

rs-tuner

iTrader: (1)

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Fucking hell, grow up!

If you dont want replies to your posts, then dont post on a public discussion forum.



Stevie, to keep this post more useful and less personal, can you mention the ways in which the S40 was suitable for this persons application, so that others dont make similar mistakes when selecting an ECU?

jaguar82

replays are ok, until they are not personal every single time.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

I dont see how him saying that you used an unsuitable product for your requirements is innacurate?

For example where you hanging a load of low impedance injectors off the drivers in parellel or something completed idiotic like that?

If one of you can detail what you did, then the rest of us can see if Stevie is being unfair, or just making a perfectly valid point that you are a total idiot, which may actually be the case if you were trying something like that for example

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

I'm converted OEM "if it can be mapped obviously" every time !! it takes sometime to get your head round it but by far better than any aftermarket ecu . All the strategies are far better calculated as you would imagine

jaguar82

No, 14 ohm blue denso 450ccm injectors used. My hobby is electronic last 15 years so I know some rules.
Steve thinks that first in line ecu from DTA for 500pounds have excuse to be unreliable as it is not so expensive. My oppinion is that this price is not so low, and if it is designed to use in midle tuned 4 cyliner engine as they advertise it, it should be stable in all functions that it offers like other ecu's in same range. When everything would worked as purposed then it would be ok ecu.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

So how many injectors did you hang off how many injector drivers?

Chip

iTrader: (3)

EDIT, misunderstood the problem, so I was talking about injector drivers when it is the coil driver that has the issue.

Removed so as not to cofuse this topic even further.

jaguar82

I used both setups recomended fom dta. 4 injectors on 2 drivers, and 4 injectors on 1 driver so other is used for idle valve. That is like manual says, and everybody are using on that way if they want to have idle valve. But problem was not injector drivers, it was coil drivers. I tryed sagem and ford zvh coils, with rover, ford and custom build single core spark plug cabels. They are overheating untill you use lower charging time then 3ms, and that is too low for standards in aftermarket managements.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Apologies, misread your rant, so it was the coil drivers that overheated?

And they overheated because you set them to charge for longer than recomended, and didnt change to a suitable coil that is capable of working with the charge times that the ECU is happy to operate with?

I personally would like to see the ECU able to cope with more than 3ms of charge time too (although cant remember the last time I actually needed more than that TBH), but if it couldnt then why not just change to a coil that can charge in that time?

Did you ask before you bought the ECU what coil charge time it could handle?

jaguar82

I know for example that oem zetec coil charge 3ms as standard on NA engine. If I am going on beter ECU, I would like to get some more on turbo engine. DTA software can take 4ms, but hardware struglles even with 2.8
Also, boost control is very poor. I tryed with borowed cheap chinese BCU+ unit and it worked much better then DTA. So, I bought also one.
PID control is almost unusable, and they say that ECU can handle with oem rover 4 flywheel, but it needs 8+ turns on cranking to sinchronize it. It's bad!

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Some of that cranking may be down to signal strength, with the megasquirt you mention there is a hardware potentiometer to allow you to alter the input sensitivity.

I really dont think the issues you have faced are particuarly major or warranting of your joining in this thread just to talk off topic about what ECU you hate TBH

jaguar82

What potentiometer? I never mention any potentiometer or megasquirt.

And sorry, but for me is a major problem to buy a half-finished product and every few months making update of firmware to try patch things. My car is not MS Windows! I just warn possible buyers like I would like that somebody warned me before.