markk

iTrader: (2)

Sounds cool mate, I will have to come over and have a look and get some education from you
Might even have some more work for on the new hardware.

p.s we need to meet up for some excellant food soon - it's been too long !

GaryEvo

depends on how you strapping them,if you pull on shock mount downwards and then 2 straps to stop it climbing its easy

yes i agree getting people to understand mapping dynos but this is real world and EVERY one wants things as cheap as poss

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Yes, will happilly map anything on the rollers but be aware they still need a professional check over on the road as the map will be different once given full airflow and different load. If its actually road legal we will do that no problem and map it via datalogging if its too hairy to tweak live, but if not, its still going to need to be tested and tweaked off road somewhere.

Agreed mate.

Easy to say, incredibly hard to achieve mate, you would be surprised at the lack of cash available in the fast road world, and most people dont know a good dyno from a horrendous one and are happy to pay for anything that makes a graph.


At a brief glance, I dont see anything there at all that OBD2 cant already do?

Very true. The DD high power tie down system hopefully makes all this a thing of the past, but we will see.

Feel free mate, I will show you where the brewing materials are. LOL

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Sounds good to me. What you guys doing tonight?

markk

iTrader: (2)

Going to a family bbq mate

I'll call you to arrange as soon as i can arrange a babysiter

dojj

iTrader: (3)

i seem to recall rod saying that he would only run his car is there was a cage or soemthing to hold it in place? or solid bars or soemthing

is that the best idea then to actually solidly fix the vehicle to the machine?

Carlos-Titx

No worries. If its not long after pay day I'll even bring biscuits

When's it all up an running? Just a thought but how about an opening day in the form of a PF dyno day?

steveboyslim

At a brief glance, I dont see anything there at all that OBD2 cant already do?

I would look again at the TAT web site not just at the data acquisition and control.
TAT make some very capable chassis dynameters in both 2wd and 4wd.
As an example to at http://www.tracknroad.com/
FoMoCo have found this rolling road to be within 1% of their own engine dynos at Dunton.
I must admit I do not full understand all the technicalities.
At least they have a built in barometeric and tempertaure sensors and are able to give accurate power figures including flywheel conversions from the 'run down' using data gained at the time of the session rather than and applied 'constant' for the flywheel power figure calculation.

Steve

T28 RST

I had my S2 on a few rolling roads but only had 1 bad experience and that was with AVA, they had the car to fit a Newman cam and upgrade the fuel system.
I got a phone call to say they had a problem with the car when it was on the rollers, they were doing a high speed run (150 mph quoted by them) when the drivers front tyre blew out

Snapped the bumper, broke the wing, fucked the tyre, rubber marks up the side of the car, chunks of rubber inside the car.

I paid for the repairs

I will post pics soon when I find them.

T28 RST

Nearly new Avon tyres

T28 RST

Had 1 bad experience and 1 shocking experience, my S2 had a bad misfire at 4000rpm, I took it to AVA who changed the fuel pump, fuel lines and metering unit, they charged me Ł600 for the job and it still ran like a tractor

I wasn't in a very good place with my health at the time and this just added to my worries so I locked the car up and in the end broke it up

Over the past few years I've heard so many bad stories about AVA, looks like there slowly getting found out for who they are.

botters

iTrader: (2)

to be fair that tyre could have been split during fitting or had some other problem so you cant blame them for it blowing out and you cant expect them to pay for the damage either

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Another interesting dyno point - I wonder how many dyno operators know that tyre manufacturers specify a maximum time limit for their tyres on a dyno? And its normally measured in seconds...

cossie4i+

iTrader: (15)

I was not aware of this, like many others i expect

Steve

STeve

iTrader: (11)

dont say that steve will be buying special dyno tyres now

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Is this on the tyre somewhere Stu??

scoooby slayer

iTrader: (4)

hub dyno ftw

dojj

iTrader: (3)

is that for normal 2 roller setups then stu?

what about them single contact point roller type setups?

and is it true that if you increase the tyre pressure you can get a higher reading?

T28 RST

The tyre was perfect, they even said themself that they didnt know what happened

My question is, do all rolling road operators do 5th gear flat out runs with there cars on the rollers, who knows how many times my car was run up at this speed

foreigneRS

exactly. i have a pair of aston martin vanquish wheels and tyres in my back garden as flower pots as they had done some dyno time and were therefore useless for anything else.

vroooom ptssssh

You broke that car as it was rotten....what's the sudden issue with AVA anyway? you were quite happy at the time to tell everyone who built/tuned the car, come back over and over for years and put AVA stickers on it etc etc etc....stop acting like a little bitch.

dojj

iTrader: (3)

lots of tuners become popular because they tell you wnat you want to hear

later on when people get smart and figure this out, it's natural to blame the tuner for fucking you over, and even easier when lots of other tales start to come out of the same tuner

my 2 bad tales of tuners could turn this thread all the way around from what it is supposed to be about as in neither case did i use their rolling roads so there i no need to comment

the guy used a set of rollers, this is what happened, totally relevenat to the topic, i've put several cars on several sets of rollers and in my granada i had a variation of around 20 brake which was easily explained by the fact it had an auto box and i've been on 4 sets of rollers with the mondeo and the ones with the standard engine saw it making the only figures they could make count being at the wheels and then after that i had an exhaust and air filter which realeased an extra 40 lbs/ft of torque which was really noticable on the road and was very noticable on the rollers as the power remained roughly the same

and every single one of thee testes were done on a set of dd rollers and all the numbers at the bottom were all the same

T28 RST

The car wasn't rotten, it needed a wee bit of work but thus was because AVA failed to fix the problem and I lost interest

You still havnt answered the question about AVA going down the pan........

T28 RST

Vroompish why are you defending Alan's shoddy workmanship so much

What the topic about, bad experiences at rolling roads..........LOL

TommyB

The Mynes Evo are my friends. We brought that very dyno, single 42 inch roller balanced to 200mph.
It's a mustang dyno and I spend nearly every day tuning and running on it. We found that the 1/4 simulation test is helpfull for a tonne of different things. We have had a couple of big power front wheel drive cars on it making 400-500 hp with zero wheel spin. One of them has gone on to run consistent mid to low 10s which is cool. We also test our nitrous on there without wheel spin which is a bonus.
I once run a escort cosworth on the dyno for a1 rally sport and it went really well. The one thing you have to live with is wheel horse power results which I prefer instead of crappy run down losses which always create a point of discussion. I spoke with mustang alot and they all say to run in lower gear as possible. I run all the mini cooper s in 3rd. We get a nice long run topping around 90+ mph and have no issues.

TommyB

Not to start arguments with but most components for top fuel engines are dyno tested. Blowers,valve gear,heads,injectors , sure they don't run a nitro engine on the dyno. Det will be detected by EGT's, pushed big end bearings and boucing marks where there heads bouce on the deck.

stevieturbo

Why would they say that ? Surely the likes of 1st gear, 2nd gear etc would just be nonsense ?

The torque the lower gears would generate would cause problems with both tyre grip and the dyno's ability to hold it back ?

TommyB

I think there words were avoid 4th and 5th when you can as speeds are real high.
I use 4th for short geared cars and somtimes 5th for some lotus's we have done.

My way of explaining was wrong he he.

dojj

iTrader: (3)

If you read the title of the thread, I think you owe yourself a massive fail

It's about your experience on the rollers, which would assume that it's your car, and it's been on a rolling road

If the thread title was along the lines of "what's the worst fuck up a tuner has committed on your car" this thread would rival steves

vroooom ptssssh

Why don't you give Alan a call or pop in and see him, he's more than willing to talk to you about any issue's you have from the time...which was how long ago now, correct me if im wrong here....round about 9 years ago was it???

He seems to remember all 4 of your tyres were de-laminating when you got them checked....but you won't remember that coincidentally will you?

look forward to hearing from you 0141 848 5257 incase you've forgotten

JamesH

iTrader: (21)

I used to think AVA were good etc, but T28 is not the only person from up north to tell of bad experiences recently! Seems just over the last year or so, quite a few horror stories have come out. My point is, surely they can't all be wrong!

jamie's

i wont go into in this thread as its not the time or place,
but i've used ava several times in the past(never again in the future)
only used them as there was very little 4x4 rolling roads in the area at the time(plenty now)
i've had a couple cosworths there and never left happy for 1 reason or another
had a couple escort turbos there(not mine but i was there with them),
alan did seem to be very good with these and they always left going well, cant fault them with them
but as soon as your not throwing an open cheque book at alan he hasn't got the time of day for you,
he even got my mate to pay Ł125 for a secret mod on his escort that took nearly 5 mins to do and wouldn't tell him what he done and wouldn'd let us see what was being done,
he even said there was no parts involved lol
i thought that was taking the piss a bit
anyhow i've said to much already here,sorry for the tread hi jack

tomoyb

iTrader: (3)

ive had my cars on 3 rolling roads in scotland,and have to say these state of the art dastek big ŁŁŁŁ rollers are rubbish.400bhp in 2wd form needed 2 in the back and 2 sitting in my boot.questions asked to why if such a good rr

ive had nothing but good experiance at ava on various visits.alan is a more than competant operator on his rr and talks you through whats happening/results,and his rr can take big power without the need of 4 fat bastrds in the car.and runs huge fans.

to sum my experiance up in recent years.....theres nowhere else id take my car this side of the border over ava

a friend of mine recently took his car down south for live mapping at a known tuner,fitted new cam,air injectors etc,think he got around 40miles and the belt jumped,.....equaled all bent valves,cracked block etc

had to buy a new engine

hence t28 give it a rest over an old tyre,these things are going to happen

stevieturbo

Who said Dastek were ŁŁŁ state of the art ? They are a good dyno, but they are a more budget setup than "state of the art"

jamie's

what car is this?
i wouldn't for 1 minute say anything about alans ability,
he's a very knowledgeable man and capable of great things
and the roller set up and fans etc are poss the best i've ever seen,
its just his silly prices and his terrible attitude i cant stand
but as i said about the escort turbo's he's a very capable guy

tomoyb

iTrader: (3)

2wd saph

T28 RST

Why you as an employe getting so defensive, out if the whole topic can you see any other employe's getting defensive

Yes it was a few years ago but it was still a bad experience at a rolling road.

If all 4 tyres were delaminating why did only 1 pop and why was he more than willing to run the car a week later with the same 3 tyres on it.

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

have you tried your car on a hub dyno

T28 RST

Alan is always keen to take take your money WITHOUT giving a receipt, how much money went through the book at that place.

T28 RST

Stop arse licking

It happened and they fucked it up