Rolling Roads - Tell us your stories...
06-10-2012, 06:20 AM
#243
Thanks, it will be when its finished. Got quite a few technical headaches to solve yet but I am confident that when its finished its going to be one of the most accurate and repeatable rolling road facilities available. More importantly for us though is that its going to allow "accurate" mapping hour upon hour without requiring excessive breaks. 
bet you cant wait to get this up and running to get the cash coming in rather than bleeding it out hey
20-10-2012, 06:10 AM
#251
After much messing around with spec changes and various other problems over at Dyno Dynamics in Australia, the new dyno is finally on the boat!
ETA for installation in our new dyno cell is 6 weeks.
For further information and the chance to win free power runs and / or tuning, please follow the dyno cell build progress on our Facebook page by clicking the image above.
(Or this link)
I will run some sort of competition on here soon, nearer completion date.
ETA for installation in our new dyno cell is 6 weeks.
For further information and the chance to win free power runs and / or tuning, please follow the dyno cell build progress on our Facebook page by clicking the image above.
(Or this link)
I will run some sort of competition on here soon, nearer completion date.
Last edited by Stu @ M Developments; 20-10-2012 at 06:15 AM.
20-10-2012, 09:56 AM
#258
a few of us went for a open day forget the name of the place now they just had the rolling road fitted so where doing runs for £30 but dont think it was set up right everyone was down about 80 odd bhp from there last print out and we didnt get any print outs
21-10-2012, 10:40 AM
#264
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I suspect I may hold the UK Record for the numbr of dyno runs made by a customer..... I bet I've passed over 300 by now and that's just between my two Subaru's and I've probably tried all the various makes and versions!
What would you like to know about dyno's!
I small proportion of the graphs I have kept.
What would you like to know about dyno's!
I small proportion of the graphs I have kept.
Last edited by Fagin; 21-10-2012 at 11:12 AM.
21-10-2012, 10:58 AM
#272
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What I am saying Is I have personally visited many dynos where the cell and intake temps go so high after just 2 runs that it is absolutely pointless printing a power graph. Also a great many dynos cannot load the tyres well enough at a sufficiently high ramp rate to simulate the correct turbocharger boost curve or even peak boost on many cars.
Fans are another one. how many places really have a fan or fans big enough to turn the dyno cell volume over enough times per minute to keep the whole car cool? For that matter, how many of them just have the fan in the same room as the car and don't use it to feed the cell with FRESH air from outside the cell, thus doing very little to keep intake temps down and cool the cell the car is operating in?
How many fans are rammed right up to the engine and do nothing to cool all the important parts of the drive train that are ONLY air cooled before they soak hundreds of BHP into them?
Gearboxes, transfer boxes, differentials, CV joints, wheel bearings, the Tyres? How many people have had a clutch fail on the dyno but its fine on the road? Heat is a killer of all these components and needs to be monitored adequately to ensure no cumulative damage is done.
Exhaust extraction - cars do not run well on exhaust fumes, and nor do operators, yet the amount of times I have seen dyno cells flooded with exhaust gas is shocking, absolutely shocking mate... you only need to wipe a finger over the window sill in there to see if it suffers from fumes, or pull the CO probe and hang it mid air directly after a 1min power run to read the rooms Co level to see instantly if your dyno run was done with contaminated air levels.
DD's Shootout mode is another great example. its fixed ramp rate is not always good enough to correctly spool the turbo on many cars and its very common you will see perhaps 25psi on the dyno, yet 32 psi peak on the road. So is that particular graph accurate for your car? No, but it does at least measure your car against everyone elses with the same fixed load, which was its intention. its a tricky one to design as if they went too high then low powered cars may not spool up at all, too low and high power turbo cars wont ever come on boost. its a compromise, but not one that many operators, and certainly very few owners, actually understand.
No arguments from me that Dyno's are excellent tools mate, none whatsoever, they are wicked and I have been trying to find a suitable unit in Blackpool to install one for many years.
I am just saying that many operators get poor results because their dyno and / or its operating environment are useless, but they don't really know any better.
I hope that clarifies further my statement.
Fans are another one. how many places really have a fan or fans big enough to turn the dyno cell volume over enough times per minute to keep the whole car cool? For that matter, how many of them just have the fan in the same room as the car and don't use it to feed the cell with FRESH air from outside the cell, thus doing very little to keep intake temps down and cool the cell the car is operating in?
How many fans are rammed right up to the engine and do nothing to cool all the important parts of the drive train that are ONLY air cooled before they soak hundreds of BHP into them?
Gearboxes, transfer boxes, differentials, CV joints, wheel bearings, the Tyres? How many people have had a clutch fail on the dyno but its fine on the road? Heat is a killer of all these components and needs to be monitored adequately to ensure no cumulative damage is done.
Exhaust extraction - cars do not run well on exhaust fumes, and nor do operators, yet the amount of times I have seen dyno cells flooded with exhaust gas is shocking, absolutely shocking mate... you only need to wipe a finger over the window sill in there to see if it suffers from fumes, or pull the CO probe and hang it mid air directly after a 1min power run to read the rooms Co level to see instantly if your dyno run was done with contaminated air levels.
DD's Shootout mode is another great example. its fixed ramp rate is not always good enough to correctly spool the turbo on many cars and its very common you will see perhaps 25psi on the dyno, yet 32 psi peak on the road. So is that particular graph accurate for your car? No, but it does at least measure your car against everyone elses with the same fixed load, which was its intention. its a tricky one to design as if they went too high then low powered cars may not spool up at all, too low and high power turbo cars wont ever come on boost. its a compromise, but not one that many operators, and certainly very few owners, actually understand.
No arguments from me that Dyno's are excellent tools mate, none whatsoever, they are wicked and I have been trying to find a suitable unit in Blackpool to install one for many years.
I am just saying that many operators get poor results because their dyno and / or its operating environment are useless, but they don't really know any better.
I hope that clarifies further my statement.
Personally I don't have a problem with the set-ups I currently use (DD & ROTATEST), with regard to boost ramp rate. The DD set-up I currently use is 100% fine in this area, but that is down to the experience of the operator as the car is loaded up at the start of the run, which enables the boost profile to virtually match the road. I always log on the dyno and have plenty of road logs to cross reference against. Peak boost between the two is nigh on the same, with the ramp rate on the dyno being a few rpm lazy.... I can live with that for the purpose of power runs. 95% of my mapping is road based anyhow, so any of this is never a problem. I've recently switched to playing with the map on a dyno to see about the effects of boost and ignition on MBT, as it's an easier environment to play. The MAHA dyno at Powerstation was nigh on the same as road logs - that's a pretty awesome cell and set-up imo.
But I would agree with your "general" statement on the DD set-ups inc. operator, but on my experience this is whole set-up based and operator knowledge, more than a problem with the base DD set-up itself.
There are issues also with the correction methods and it's inbuilt ability to "warp" figures. Any DD operator worth his salt won't even use the inlet temp probe and just leave it on the wall!! How many times have you seen a DD graph with an inlet temp that is 15degs over the ambient temp.... load of crap. When you look at any of my graphs they are normally within 2degs of each other. Like I say.... not a problem with the rr, but a problem with the operator imo.
21-10-2012, 11:04 AM
#273
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23-10-2012, 10:25 AM
#274
The DD set-up I currently use is 100% fine in this area, but that is down to the experience of the operator as the car is loaded up at the start of the run, which enables the boost profile to virtually match the road.
I've recently switched to playing with the map on a dyno to see about the effects of boost and ignition on MBT, as it's an easier environment to play. The MAHA dyno at Powerstation was nigh on the same as road logs - that's a pretty awesome cell and set-up imo.
There are issues also with the correction methods and it's inbuilt ability to "warp" figures. Any DD operator worth his salt won't even use the inlet temp probe and just leave it on the wall!! How many times have you seen a DD graph with an inlet temp that is 15degs over the ambient temp....
23-10-2012, 11:52 AM
#276
I am aiming for 600 changes per hour.
23-10-2012, 01:39 PM
#277
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That is a minimum though really as I am sure you will agree. And of course it also depends largely on the efficiency of the vehicle systems you are working on and how much heat is radiated from things like exhaust systems etc)
I am aiming for 600 changes per hour.
I am aiming for 600 changes per hour.
sounds like this will be a well thought out test installation, i have seen so many 'bodges' and 'fudges' over the years it would be good to see a proper thought out rig rather than the usual, "it was the only space we had" installation.
you should see AVL's chassis dyno in GRAZ, austria. or mercedes HPE and maclaren uk....
23-10-2012, 04:56 PM
#278
Testing the future
23-10-2012, 08:00 PM
#279
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11-11-2012, 05:29 AM
#280
On my installation the engine bay is getting its own 100mph 20'000cfm cooling fan. The cell air exchangers are totally seperate, as is the exhaust extraction.
In fact, I have upped my spec as have been doing some calculations and I dont think 600changes an hour is going to be enough to keep the cell temps constant when mapping big power stuff at constant load so am now aiming for 900 canges per hour, but am running into resistance with actually getting that into the room without sendiong it too negative.
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