Torque of the Devil RR Day - 6th Oct
07-10-2007, 09:09 PM
#201
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Originally Posted by Alg1k
Originally Posted by dingy
I know exactly what your saying mate, you should try and drive my fucker 
07-10-2007, 09:14 PM
#202
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Originally Posted by dingy
Originally Posted by Alg1k
Originally Posted by dingy
I know exactly what your saying mate, you should try and drive my fucker
07-10-2007, 09:52 PM
#208
dingy If your in Novice, i take it i missed the 'I have not got a clue and no tallent' group box or i would have ticked that.
Be good to see you and the Dolly out again. Hope its not too wet for both of you. Would love a passenger ride in either tbh
Be good to see you and the Dolly out again. Hope its not too wet for both of you. Would love a passenger ride in either tbh
07-10-2007, 09:59 PM
#209
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Originally Posted by Nash
dingy If your in Novice, i take it i missed the 'I have not got a clue and no tallent' group box or i would have ticked that.
Be good to see you and the Dolly out again. Hope its not too wet for both of you. Would love a passenger ride in either tbh
Be good to see you and the Dolly out again. Hope its not too wet for both of you. Would love a passenger ride in either tbh
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I now have treaded tyres
07-10-2007, 10:05 PM
#210
Originally Posted by Alg1k
Originally Posted by Nash
dingy If your in Novice, i take it i missed the 'I have not got a clue and no tallent' group box or i would have ticked that.
Be good to see you and the Dolly out again. Hope its not too wet for both of you. Would love a passenger ride in either tbh
Be good to see you and the Dolly out again. Hope its not too wet for both of you. Would love a passenger ride in either tbh
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I now have treaded tyres
Why do i get the feeling if you had a set of F1 wets it wouldnt help that much?Your car was moral last year mate, had me smiling all day
07-10-2007, 10:25 PM
#213
Christian and Beccy
Go and get Becky mate, then click this link......
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...2&id=718470019
I'll give it 10mins before i get a text
All the photos are here:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...9&id=718470019
Go and get Becky mate, then click this link......
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...2&id=718470019
I'll give it 10mins before i get a text
All the photos are here:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...9&id=718470019
07-10-2007, 10:53 PM
#214
Originally Posted by BillyCabrio
Christian and Beccy
Go and get Becky mate, then click this link......
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...2&id=718470019
I'll give it 10mins before i get a text
All the photos are here:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...9&id=718470019
Go and get Becky mate, then click this link......
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...2&id=718470019
I'll give it 10mins before i get a text
All the photos are here:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...9&id=718470019
Oh, here she comes, QUICK!!! RUN!!!
08-10-2007, 12:10 AM
#215
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Big thanks to Chris, and all the boys for hanging on for one last run.
To those that don't know, Chris made some very nice comments about the car and was expecting more power, but as yet i have not had it maaped on the new turbo.
He leant me a few tools etc, and i took it up the road and give it a bit more boost while checking afr.
On the rollers it showed 3.5 psi ( i think lol) more, and made 70 bhp less
On the way home i think i may have found out why. My Collins monitor showed up a TPS and Cam fault, and also developed a misfire under load in 4th and 5th.
The car will be up to Karl for mapping shortly, and back to TOTD and Noble for a power run to compare figures, as the car has run before at both places with the same spec, albeit i do believe i had an underlying issue yesterday
Once again, many thanks to Chris and TOTD
To those that don't know, Chris made some very nice comments about the car and was expecting more power, but as yet i have not had it maaped on the new turbo.
He leant me a few tools etc, and i took it up the road and give it a bit more boost while checking afr.
On the rollers it showed 3.5 psi ( i think lol) more, and made 70 bhp less
On the way home i think i may have found out why. My Collins monitor showed up a TPS and Cam fault, and also developed a misfire under load in 4th and 5th.
The car will be up to Karl for mapping shortly, and back to TOTD and Noble for a power run to compare figures, as the car has run before at both places with the same spec, albeit i do believe i had an underlying issue yesterday
Once again, many thanks to Chris and TOTD
08-10-2007, 12:26 AM
#216
Originally Posted by Chris@torque of the devil
Linsays car did have a special TOTD power reducing alternator fitted before her run too dont forget, that would explain the difference in power between us and the noble dyno.
Therefore i have done some amendments to my graph, to show what it should have done
But Seriously
i'm pleased with my car, whatever it does - hence why i'll run it anywhere on any given day and be happy with it
08-10-2007, 12:43 AM
#218
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Originally Posted by grey RS
Originally Posted by Chris@torque of the devil
Linsays car did have a special TOTD power reducing alternator fitted before her run too dont forget, that would explain the difference in power between us and the noble dyno.
Therefore i have done some amendments to my graph, to show what it should have done
But Seriously
i'm pleased with my car, whatever it does - hence why i'll run it anywhere on any given day and be happy with it
08-10-2007, 06:45 AM
#220
PassionFord Post Troll
Originally Posted by Chris@torque of the devil
we also proved with both linsay's and john nutter's cars that a 3rd run or 4th gear run made no difference to the peak power shown.
with the 10-20bhp difference (could have been plus or minus for all I care). Inconsistancy in operation parameters to the actual run.I know people are doubting nobles but the standard 512 made about 6bhp less than the book figure on nobles.
Just out of interest has anyone run up a standard S2000 on the DD rolling road? If so what was the power of that....
08-10-2007, 07:29 AM
#221
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Originally Posted by grey RS
i'm pleased with my car, whatever it does - hence why i'll run it anywhere on any given day and be happy with it
I just see RR days as a laugh.There's always someone getting upset about something when they go to a different dyno.
I had a good day anyway, an extra 8bhp for me lol
08-10-2007, 09:12 AM
#225
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Originally Posted by grey RS
Originally Posted by Chris@torque of the devil
Linsays car did have a special TOTD power reducing alternator fitted before her run too dont forget, that would explain the difference in power between us and the noble dyno.
Therefore i have done some amendments to my graph, to show what it should have done
That proper made me chuckle!
08-10-2007, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by dingy
Originally Posted by Chris@torque of the devil
we also proved with both linsay's and john nutter's cars that a 3rd run or 4th gear run made no difference to the peak power shown.
with the 10-20bhp difference (could have been plus or minus for all I care). Inconsistancy in operation parameters to the actual run.I know people are doubting nobles but the standard 512 made about 6bhp less than the book figure on nobles.
Just out of interest has anyone run up a standard S2000 on the DD rolling road? If so what was the power of that....
08-10-2007, 09:43 AM
#228
Originally Posted by Chris@torque of the devil
Linsay, you must try harder when photoshopping graphs, i can clearly see the tip-ex. 
do you like how quick it climbs from 210 to 240 though - goes well!!
08-10-2007, 09:46 AM
#229
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Originally Posted by Christian and Beccy
Also, I am intrigued by the references to OE mapping conditions and what makes me laugh the most about that is wondering why, if OE mapping is so perfect, is there such an abundant business in remapping from the likes of Stu (MSD), Superchips, Dreamscience etc etc. I think comparing OE mapping conditions to those used in the aftermarket is really splitting hairs. Luckily very few of us are looking to do top speed runs in the sahara desert or 1/4 mile runs in -50° conditions on 2 foot of ice.
remapping and getting more power is simple!
You scarfice a little fuel econo and loads of emissions LOL!
08-10-2007, 10:48 AM
#230
Dingy, we run countless B16 Honda's which are listed as 160bhp. They are ALWAYS within 2-3bhp of that. In all honesty, regardless of whether they are standard or whatever mods they have had, because they are simply practically un-tuneable. Often they make less, when the owner has fitted enlarged Throttle Body, Plenum etc on a car that just doesn't seem to need it.
Why don't you just run your car over to ours and we will answer it once and for all.
Chris is right in what he says about fact that you wouldn't have been moaning if the TOTD run was 50bhp more than that taken at Nobles.
AFPMSL @ Linsay.
Why don't you just run your car over to ours and we will answer it once and for all.
Chris is right in what he says about fact that you wouldn't have been moaning if the TOTD run was 50bhp more than that taken at Nobles.
AFPMSL @ Linsay.
08-10-2007, 11:15 AM
#234
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Originally Posted by Christian and Beccy
Your what? B16??
It's NA, so hardly a good comparison in all honesty.
It's NA, so hardly a good comparison in all honesty.
B16 crx vtec
08-10-2007, 11:20 AM
#235
Originally Posted by dingy
Originally Posted by Christian and Beccy
Your what? B16??
It's NA, so hardly a good comparison in all honesty.
It's NA, so hardly a good comparison in all honesty.
B16 crx vtec
08-10-2007, 11:54 AM
#236
Exactly. There is a whole other debate about standard modern cars, some of which make their quoted power and some don't, but this isn't the same thing.
I can't comment on the issue of which gear was used, but the fact that the graph says '3' in the gear box is insignificant. That is simply a text field. However, I can't see a whole lot of relevance in the gear that was used. It does make a difference, but not a whole lot. Infact alot of DD operators still use 4th gear, even though it is against DD's procedure.
As I said earlier, why not come over to ours, we can run it and between us make sure it makes the boost.
It would be quicker for all of us for you to do that, then we can put this tiring debate to bed.
The other thing to consider is that the DD system obviously has its own MAP sensor to measure and subsequently graph boost. We have found that this reads differently to other similar devices. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, just different. It's not a lie that we see a difference between, for example, GReddy boost gauges and GReddy boost controllers in terms of measured boost. What can be believed though is the shape of the boost curve. Many tuners believe that you should increase boost valve duty by around 3% if you have the facility when running on a Rolling Road, that's not something that is restricted to Dyno Dynamics.
I still maintain what I said earlier about the power that I think your car has, based on the boost that it made at the 2 places it was run and I would be intrigued to see how much power it makes on a run where you are happy with the boost.
So, what do you say then?
I can't comment on the issue of which gear was used, but the fact that the graph says '3' in the gear box is insignificant. That is simply a text field. However, I can't see a whole lot of relevance in the gear that was used. It does make a difference, but not a whole lot. Infact alot of DD operators still use 4th gear, even though it is against DD's procedure.
As I said earlier, why not come over to ours, we can run it and between us make sure it makes the boost.
It would be quicker for all of us for you to do that, then we can put this tiring debate to bed.
The other thing to consider is that the DD system obviously has its own MAP sensor to measure and subsequently graph boost. We have found that this reads differently to other similar devices. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, just different. It's not a lie that we see a difference between, for example, GReddy boost gauges and GReddy boost controllers in terms of measured boost. What can be believed though is the shape of the boost curve. Many tuners believe that you should increase boost valve duty by around 3% if you have the facility when running on a Rolling Road, that's not something that is restricted to Dyno Dynamics.
I still maintain what I said earlier about the power that I think your car has, based on the boost that it made at the 2 places it was run and I would be intrigued to see how much power it makes on a run where you are happy with the boost.
So, what do you say then?
08-10-2007, 12:12 PM
#237
PassionFord Post Troll
What do I say to what mate ?
APT is miles from me dude, at the moment i aint got the time as there are 2 many events and not enough weekends to prepare...
I'll let you know after the PF track day mate and come down some time after that...
APT is miles from me dude, at the moment i aint got the time as there are 2 many events and not enough weekends to prepare...
I'll let you know after the PF track day mate and come down some time after that...
08-10-2007, 12:12 PM
#238
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I agree with christian about differences on what the dyno dynamics boost display and customers gauges/boost controllers show, i rarely take notice of the gauges in customers cars read and did not look at dingys on the day.
