Hi guys - I am new to this site - and I need some help with my XR3i EFi 1990 hard top.
I was driving down the road the other day and she just died like someone had cut the fuel. After many hours trying and cleaning sensors and coil and plugs, pressure regulator - I now realise I have been defeated!! I had the RAC man out and he tested everything and he said the everything was fine but the injectors were not opening / or switching. He then told me that it was definately the EDis4 module. I had a spare in the garage and tried it but nothing. It maybe that the spare I have is also a dud but before I go out and buy another one I thought I should ask some advice on the forum! The car cranks, sparks and delivers fuel to the rail but nothing else! It has only done 28,000 miles from new and is absolutely mint but I need some help to get her going again - can anyone help???

 

Cam sensor, I suspect...

Martin

 

Hi Martin - where is the cam sensor?? I had the crank sensor cleaned and checked already but not sure where the cam sensor is??
Thanks
Jonathan

 

Don't think these had a cam sensor.

Are you getting live feed at the injectors? Check with multimeter.

Get a 501 capless sidelight bulb, pull the contact prongs out so they fit in your injector connectors, crank it over to see if they flash, which will see if the ECU is pulsing the injectors.

Does the fuel pump cut in on cranking?

 

Hi Gary - fuel pump primes for a second or two and the n cuts on cranking as it should. The RAC man was sure everything was good - he tested all the feeds and wires and on his report he just said that the Edis 4 was not switching causing the injectors to not open!

 

Been some time since I messed with these but as far as I'm aware the EDIS controls the spark only.
You've tried another EDIS so that kinds of rules it out. (if it was a good one of course)

 

Its' driving me mad and I don't want to take it to a garage for them to try everything, not fix it and charge me 40 quid an hour labour to add insult!
Could the belt have slipped causing the timing to be out?? I had a new belt at the beginning of the year so it should be okay!

 

I would have thought so, else how else would the ECU know how to actuate the injectors?

Is that a good idea re the sidelight bulb, I always like NOID lights personally, as I think a bulb could damage the injector drivers?

Martin

 

It does, hence the name (Electronic Distributorless Ignition System), personally I woulden't go by what recovery operative says.

Martin

 

I prefer a NOID light too, but a 5w bulb should'nt cause any issues.
(How many watts does an injector draw?, serious question, I don't know without looking)

Being a 1990, I guess this is a CVH Efi not a Zetec?

 

It's a CVH -

Everything points to timing but the problem I have is that I end up going round in circles and I am sure there is a simple answer. I have spark and fuel but it will not run!

 

Is there an aftermarket alarm/immobiliser on it? Something else to ponder!

 

Yes there is but It is not connected. Question is - what controls the opening of the injectors - is the the ECU or the Edis or both in conjunction with each other? I am no mechanic but if it were a carburettor car I would have fixed it by now!

 

As mentioned the EDIS controls the ignition, later cars have the EDIS inside the ECU rather than the external module as you have and on early Zetecs. Generally you get power feed to the injectors via a relay then the ECU grounds the injector (pulse width modulated)

I don't have any access to wiring diagrams for something this old or I could have had a look for you.

 

The EDIS is for ignition only, this can be eliminated straight away, what you was told was wrong!

The ECU (EEC IV) does this relative to the information it receives, as I say there HAS to be some form of input relative to speed.

Have you tested you do actually have power to the injectors with the ignition on?

Martin

 

Don't know, but then you have other factors, cheif among which is the impedence.

Martin

 

Martin, I don't think any CVH has a cam sensor, only a crank sensor. (unless it has Cossie management of course but that's nothing to do with this at all)

There's an EEC-IV wiring diagram and some info here.

http://www.fiestaturbo.com/forums/gu...anges-vt77331/

 

As I say, there must be some input, otherwise it would be impossible for the fuelling to be controlled.

I think they refer to it as the 'speed sensor', which from what I can see is like a module.

The OP really needs to start off with the basics though, i.e. confirming there is power present.

Martin

 

Probably 'batch fired' rather than sequential injection as per Zetecs which have a cam sensor?

 

Agreed!

 

Possibly, it did cross my mind, (tbh, I just checked and it's described as Multi point fuel injection) which does tally, even so it must be triggered by something, speed sensor perhaps?

Martin

 

I'm not sure, it's donkeys years since I've seen one of them.

 

Thanks for your help guys - as I am not good with wiring I think I would rather let someone look at it who knows what they are doing! Hopefully there is a nice passion ford member in cornwall who fancies a cuppa and a pasty one saturday! Any more suggestions welcomed!

 

You don't need to be mate, all you need to do is confirm if power is present at the injectors which you can do with a multimeter, etc.

Without confiriming this, you cannot move further forward.

Martin

 

Okay - am I correct in thinking that there is a relay under the dash that controls the injectors? I will check the power to the injectors at the weekend.
Also - would a dodgy ISCV cause the car to not start and the injectors not open?
Thanks chaps

 

There should be.

No it would not cause it not to start, however, how do you know that is not working?

Martin

 

well - whilst I was looking in my spares bucket - I noticed a spare and thought I would try it (I was trying everything at the time) It seemed as though it tried to start a little better but I was probably trying to convince myself. The problem is you end up thinking in circles rather than trying the obvious first.

 

So is it running?

Martin

 

Nope - just been at it with the mutimeter and have power to all injectors and all sensors! Just cranks but does not fire!

 

You really need a 'NOID' light, ideally, as from what you have said it sounds as if the ECU is not switching the injectors.

Thing is I don't know what tells them to do so, I should imagine that is what the speed sensor is for?

Martin

 

Okay - an update -
After weeks of scratching my head and thinking logically (or so I thought) I took the injector rail off, injectors out cleaned them out properly by rigging up a plunger with carb cleaner hooked up to a live feed. Replaced everything, cleaned everything and.....NOTHING - Still won't start. I then sprayed some fuel down the throttle body and away she went and run for as long as the fuel down the chamber lasted.

Back to square one - does anyone think that maybe a weak fuel pump could be to blame?? I only ask because I seem to remember it spluttered momentarily once on the motorway at about 70mph and at the time I put it down to shit in the fuel. It has an 'intank' pump!! Does anyone know where these can be bought new or can you wire up an out of tank one up in tandem??

Any help would be appreciated!!

 

You said there was fuel to the rail!

Now we know that, first off check the cut out underneath the spare wheel has not tripped.

You should be able to hear it 'prime' when you switch the ignition on, failing that the next thing is to check the supply to the pump.

Martin

 

Checked trip in the boot - all fine
Pump primes (you can hear it for a second or so) then it switches at the relay to position 2 as it should.
Fuel to fuel rail but not checked the pressure - am wondering if the fuel pump was tired and the pressure was not great then maybe that may be a cause??

 

There could be something wrong with the delivery, it's worth removing an injector and placing it into a container and then you, or an assistant switch the ignition on. Also you still don't know if the injectors are 'pulsing' ok, so we may be back to square one.

Martin

 

I am going to test the pressure at the weekend so I will keep you posted!

 

Is the battery fully charged with a good earth, and replace fuel filter . Also have you tried another set of plugs. And lastly are you sure the old immob/alarms are definately disconnected?

 

Battery good with good earth - interestingly the day it cut out I did change the plugs but I have changed them back again from motorcraft to NGK ones and still nothing. Alarm I disconnected last week and took all wires out.

Will test fuel pressure and if that doesn't solve it I am lost!

 

Did you try the 'bulb' trick I posted about earlier in the thread, to see if the injectors are being pulsed by the ECU?

 

Checked them with the multimeter but not done the noid light yet - will do it this weekend.
Thanks
Jon

 

Have you actually done any logical tests ??

Is the fuel pump running when it should be ? Very simple test. Listen to it ! Or test for 12v power.

If yes, then you could assume it has fuel pressure, but of course it would make sense to actually check.

Are your injectors getting 12v and signal when they should ? Again, simple test. I dont trust noid lights, and a filament type sidelight bulb suggestion is just daft given the short duration of any pulse.

Test with a suitable meter for pulsewidth ( or duty cycle at a push ), but ideally use a scope so you can actually see if it's a regular and consistent pulse at each injector, as well as checking for PW.

Are you getting spark's as expected ?

If you're doing any other tests given you think you've no fuel, your wasting your time.