BRIGSPORT

iTrader: (2)

I am looking for more power for my sapph track car. It has a 110 bhp 2.0 pinto at the moment,and i have some bike carbs waiting to go on,but i would rather fit them to an engine that will give a lot more power.
I can get hold of a 1.8 blacktop zetec,or an rs2000 I4 engine for reasonable dosh and was wondering which will give the most power?
Both engines will be standard internally,running on megajolt/fireblade bike carbs,and ashley exhaust manifold/system.

Paddy

The I4 is knocking 150bhp standard and the best 1.8 zetec was only 130?

I know better manifolds etc release a bit of power on any engine but on the I4, removing the EGR should give a bigger equivalent hike in itself.

I can't imagine there'll be masses in it after the mods, but I would go for the I4 if it was a straight choice... chain rather than a belt, more torque and the easy option of fitting the 2.3 bottom end from a galaxy for sod all..

Gaz 88

pro not any help but ived got a 1.6zetec for sale 75k miles runs perfect

NEEDFORSPEED

id say zetec for ease and readily available parts 180ish bhps quite easy to get on top of with throttle bodys and some cams

kitchy

i4 they are bombproof, and cheap

neilm

Get an ST170 Focus engine which is basically a Zetec.

Sell the bike carbs and buy Bike Throttle Bodies, they will need spacing but they then sleeve over the standard Ford inlet manifold once the plenum has been removed and use them to control the air then use the standard Ford injectors and fuel rail etc and away you go.

You will need an aftermarket ecu

You'll need a 1.8 Zetec flywheel, re-drilled to take a Pinto Clutch and these are available off the shelf from Retro Ford in Corby (01536 7479780)

170bhp of reliable power.

Add a vernier pulley on the exhaust cam and they are 180bhp


I4's from a MkV RS2000 or the 2.3 from the Galaxy are pants.

They weigh a tonne.. just like an old pintosaurus and they are a nightmare to tune and get decent power out of them cheaply.

Unlike a Zetec.

Put it like this, the black top in my Anglia is running a pair of Kent Cams and a pair of 45 carbs with some head porting and one of our 4 into 1 manifolds and its 187bhp

which is pretty respectable.

NEEDFORSPEED

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

if your gunna go black top,

get a 2.0, more power,

i4's have nothing in common with pintos, and are good engines, and dont break,

zetec pretty reliable to,
and zetec tuning parts are so cheap, rods and pistons are around 600 from america now.

but deffo stretch and get a 2.0,

on the flip side, at least if you go for an i4, you can use standard dohc engine mounts,

if you go zetec youll need custom, and custom fly wheel and clutch

James-W

Go zetec, more readily available performance parts/spares + more knowledge about reliable tuning.
Go for 2.0 though deffo, and bike throttle bodies is the way forward!
James

orion turbo

go for the i4 but get the block from a 2.3 galaxy and with the bike carbs and exhaust system and manifold say hello to 200bhp

tabetha

Why not spend the extra money on the pinto lump as you are not even strething it yet, and when you want serious power, just cossie it.
tabetha

BRIGSPORT

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for the reply's everyone.
This is a budget track car,so throttle bodies/management/yb etc. are a bit out of price range,plus i want to keep it simple with a standard engine that gives good power on carbs,and is easily bolted in the car,and easily replaced if it blows up.
I think i'll go for the I4,as this gives more power as a standard engine,and i have a 1.8 blacktop zetec in my garage that just needs 8 new valves,so i can always change my mind in the future if the I4 doesn't fit in my bubble arched mk1 shell that will be ready soon.
One of them will be at croft for sure though

neilm

In your dreams my friend

I am yet to meet a man with an I4 that gets anywhere that power.

I've seen plenty people on here over the years with their MkV RS 2000's wanting more power and they block off the EGR, they chip them, induction, exhaust the lot and still see about 10-15bhp over standard.


The one thing they share with the pinto is they are heavy old lumps.....

Mark V8

iTrader: (2)

I've done it



2.3 will make over 200 bhp on stock RS2000 cams, stock RS2000 exhaust manifold with pulse air pipes removed and bike throttle bodies.


Best bhp per pound spent has to be 2.3 I4

It weighs no more than the engine he is removing so handling will not be a problem.

Mark

kitchy

well done mark

BRIGSPORT

iTrader: (2)

My car handles very well with the pinto in it,it just gets wasted on the straights.
2.3 I4 sounds good!

dojj

iTrader: (3)

you need the 2.3 from a scoprio as the galazy has the block the other way and the mounts aren't the same

the holes are there but they need fiddling with

besides, the scoprio is much cheaper and if you get a manual you've got the box to go with it and, more importantly, the bigger clutch/flywheel package as well

jim's fitted the 8V head to his and with a bit of thought is knocking out 170 brake with fooked bores

besides that, the other advantage is that you can just say it's a 2..0 and no one will be any the wiser unles they look fo the tell tale casting marks

Big Will_

I know of an I4 engine for sale if you're interested

SapphyMike

the I4 is a square engine which hampers its tuneability.

ShandzS1

Just save up and fit cosworth engine and t5 box, simple and fits straight in

BRIGSPORT

iTrader: (2)

Not exactly "budget" though.
I've owned a couple of cossies,spent loads of money on them,the word "hassle" springs to mind.

ShandzS1

very true, go for zetec then, easily ready tuning parts

orion turbo

[quote="neilm"]In your dreams my friend

I am yet to meet a man with an I4 that gets anywhere that power.

I've seen plenty people on here over the years with their MkV RS 2000's wanting more power and they block off the EGR, they chip them, induction, exhaust the lot and still see about 10-15bhp over standard.

i know about 3 people who have done this

mk2 escort stock i4 with manifold and twin 45s 203bhp at fly


thank you v8 EsCoS

phil_focus

technically if you get the block from a 2.3 galaxy its not an rs2000 engine, just a 2.3 galaxy lump with rs head which is different to the question asked!

Mark_

your better off going the i4 its chucks out 150ps in standard trim where as the 1.8zetec is about 130ps. the i4 is chain driven not belt and i like any one else with an rs2000 knows the i4 can take loads of abuse. it really is a tough unit. only downside is its getting tricky to get ugrades like cams for the i4 as there isnt loads of them around and wasnt really mass produsedlike the zetec. the zetec is more tunable but your better off going for the 2.0 instead of the 1.8. theres loads in the srappy's and there dirt cheap. (from arond Ł50 depnding on where you go)

Mark V8

iTrader: (2)

Given the choice I would not use Zetec or I4, If you're after cheap fun bung in one of these



You can pick up a 3.9 for peanuts and it is lighter than a pinto, I've had a couple of Rover powered Sierras and they are great fun. The one in the pic above was an old rat/sleeper badged as a 1.6

Mark

phil_focus

Now thats a great idea Mark

JesseT

Rover 8s seem to have potential. There's one mental NA&carborettored rover powered sleeper Sierra in our club running 11.5s quarter miles.

http://s115.photobucket.com/albums/n...a_vs_volvo.flv

phil_focus

FCUK me that thing flies!!!!

good vid that JesseT

RSturboJET

Get a 2.0/2.3 from a scorpio. It will have the rwd sump/dipstick/pickup, flywheel, pulleys and belt arrangement. The 2.0 had a twin 48mm inlet. Scorpio 2.0 had lower compression @9.8 and the rs2000 had 10.3 and the scorpio had a cast exhaust manifold. That made them 14ps/15NM lower in power and torque.
If you get a 2.3 you should get a 2.0 engine as well for all the bits. You would want to get rid of the nasty balancer shafts and use 2.0 cams, sump, dipstick, flywheel etc. Visit www.rs2000-16v.com for more info on the conversion.

The engine will bolt right in with sierra 2.0 8v I4 engine mounts. Plus, all the weight is gone into making the unit strong.

Lots more info on the i4 engine on www.fordscorpio.co.uk and the above website.

BRIGSPORT

iTrader: (2)

Cheers for that mate.

thecrust

As Dojj said.

- 2.3 scorpio bottom end (rebuilt, nasty balancers ditched, Sierra DOHC sump in place, bores "slightly oversize" )
- mildly-flowed 8v DOHC head with ground-out combustion chambers to reduce compression to 10.5:1. Ish.
- 250cc / 24Lb injectors.
- Piper 285 cams.
- Janspeed manifold and free-flowing exhaust (if that's what you call an exhaust full of holes!)
- Obligatory cone filter and powerchip.

It does 170 bhp and 171lb f ft of torque - practically 2.9 V6 power but without the weight. Makes it very nimble around town and on dual carriageways - the torque is right there off idle and right the way across the rev range.

Power's not quite what the 2.3 16v RS boys get I admit, and nothing like even a half-shagged YB but I'm using the 8v head and the stock Sierra management which isn't as aggressively tuned as the RS item is "out the box" so I'm a bit hampered in that respect.

Megasquirt is now in the car so I can run EDIS and a coilpack to give better control over the timing. Just wish the fooking thing would start.

From my perspective you'd probably get more out of a tuned 2.0 zetec but you have to think what it will cost you to do get it, and the costs to get it in in the first place. As others have said already: custom mounts, water rail to relocate thermostat, never mind playing mix-and-match with clutches, flywheels and starters to fit your gearbox.

It cost me less to build the 2.3 8v from scratch than it would have to rebuild the 2.0 that was in there which surely deals with your "cheap as chips" budget doesn't it?

BRIGSPORT

iTrader: (2)

The I4 i picked up today for Ł80 deals with the budget issue pretty much i think.
Getting it in its new home (mk2 escort),is another thing entirely.

16vzetec

deffo rs2000 lump.
they are a great lump, despite what some say, most that slate them have never had one!
ive had 8 and i have one now, i also have had about 20 zetecs and have 2 now.
the rs is more aggressive, ive had to spend alot on my zetec to get more than rs2000 performance

RSturboJET

the vauxhall xe redtop is square (86x86) too and that didn't stop them from making big power

RSturboJET

More info on the difference between Zetec and DOHC I4 16v. The I4 has a big, heavy block and is very strong whereas the zetec block was based on the cvh block. The I4 has bigger valves than the Zetec, +1.5mm(33.5mm) on inlets and +2mm(30mm) on exhausts and the ports are a lot bigger in the I4 so naturally it will produce more power.

Wardy257

Most people bodge the tuning of a ZETEc with induction kits, exhausts and crap like that. They then go on about how you cant tune it withotu spending thousands.

The 2 most restricted area on the ZETEC in the original car is the mapping and the inlet manifold. Change those 2 first and you can then start tuning. An internally standard 2 ltr ZETEC can produce 170 bhp with twin 45 carbs or twin 40 TBs. Add cams and head work and you have 200 bhp from a light, revy, cheap and reliable engine. You just have to do it properly.

FiTekno

This caught my interest. What injectors are those? And where to get? Were they bolt-on ?

jonnyc

I couldn't feel a noticable difference between zetec 130 and I4 rs2000 engine. Put i4 into my esc cabriolet and diddn't chech oil pick up and engine went pop. put zetec back in all ok. I would never use I4 again. difficult and expensive to find/replace knackered parts. Zetec cheap and cheerfull