Zetec 2.0
12-12-2005, 08:33 PM
#1
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Zetec 2.0
How much bhp can the standard rod's in a mondeo 2.0 zetec take??
I am thinking for using one for a zvh conv on my s2 rst any help would be great.
Thanks,
Jim
I am thinking for using one for a zvh conv on my s2 rst any help would be great.
Thanks,
Jim
12-12-2005, 08:52 PM
#2
Professional Waffler
A good friend of mine who posts on here from time to time did 316 bhp on his stock rods without a problem. I have, however, heard of peoples rods failing well before that level
13-12-2005, 09:36 AM
#6
IME rods are more likely to die from revs than torque.
Ive happily put 400bhp through rods that ive been "reliabley informed" by people that they cant take more than 350 (vuaxhall 2.0 16v ones)
So its all about HOW you get 250bhp or 300bhp etc
Ive happily put 400bhp through rods that ive been "reliabley informed" by people that they cant take more than 350 (vuaxhall 2.0 16v ones)
So its all about HOW you get 250bhp or 300bhp etc
13-12-2005, 09:47 AM
#7
PassionFord Post Troll
Totally agree with chip on this one.
To put it simply in a high revving NA engine the most extreme forces on the rods will be at the top of the stroke when it is trying to return the piston back down the bore.
If you turbo an engine you do not effect the forces at this point, but simply put the rod under more load (in compression) in the middle parts of the compression and ignition strokes.
So a 300bhp NA zetec might need to rev to 9000rpm and will certainly spell the end for the stock rods, however a 300bhp forced induction zetec will prob be ok on stock rods.
To put it simply in a high revving NA engine the most extreme forces on the rods will be at the top of the stroke when it is trying to return the piston back down the bore.
If you turbo an engine you do not effect the forces at this point, but simply put the rod under more load (in compression) in the middle parts of the compression and ignition strokes.
So a 300bhp NA zetec might need to rev to 9000rpm and will certainly spell the end for the stock rods, however a 300bhp forced induction zetec will prob be ok on stock rods.
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13-12-2005, 09:57 AM
#8
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Originally Posted by Escort-Ian
sorry to butt in, but what sort of revs can the stock rods take?
i had been thinking about putting bigger cams on mine, hard limiter is currently at 7000rpm but have been told that anymore than this and i'm tempting death
13-12-2005, 09:59 AM
#9
Standard rod bolts on most engines fail before the rods themselves, so might be worth asking that question of someone, ie what actually fails?
Also might be worth looking into deseaming them and shotpeening them, as thats worth an extra 500-750rpm on most rods!
Or just get a few people together and group buy some sets of steel rods at under 300 quid each, problem solved
Also might be worth looking into deseaming them and shotpeening them, as thats worth an extra 500-750rpm on most rods!
Or just get a few people together and group buy some sets of steel rods at under 300 quid each, problem solved
13-12-2005, 10:00 AM
#10
PassionFord Post Troll
Ian,
What sort of induction are you running?
I notice you sig says 165bhp. Was that on the satandard intake or throttle bodies?
Strange figure that. Bit more than i would expect with standard intake and bit less than i would expect with well mapped tbs.
What sort of induction are you running?
I notice you sig says 165bhp. Was that on the satandard intake or throttle bodies?
Strange figure that. Bit more than i would expect with standard intake and bit less than i would expect with well mapped tbs.
13-12-2005, 10:20 AM
#12
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Originally Posted by Garage19
Ian,
What sort of induction are you running?
I notice you sig says 165bhp. Was that on the satandard intake or throttle bodies?
Strange figure that. Bit more than i would expect with standard intake and bit less than i would expect with well mapped tbs.
What sort of induction are you running?
I notice you sig says 165bhp. Was that on the satandard intake or throttle bodies?
Strange figure that. Bit more than i would expect with standard intake and bit less than i would expect with well mapped tbs.
13-12-2005, 10:30 AM
#13
PassionFord Post Troll
Do you have non stock cams?
problem with the weber TBs / ECU setups is that they are supplied with maps that have to cater for a fairly broad state of engine tune. One engine might be 10:1 with a stock exhaust manifold and the next might be 12:1 all singing, all dancing.
If you have a decent exhaust manifold design, i would think about upping the CR to 11-11.5:1 to gain 4-5 bhp and a bit more grunt in the middle, seeing if you can get the software to allow you to look at / adjust the mapping and get on a dyno and have a play with your induction legnths.
I would reckon on 180-185 bhp being more near the mark.
problem with the weber TBs / ECU setups is that they are supplied with maps that have to cater for a fairly broad state of engine tune. One engine might be 10:1 with a stock exhaust manifold and the next might be 12:1 all singing, all dancing.
If you have a decent exhaust manifold design, i would think about upping the CR to 11-11.5:1 to gain 4-5 bhp and a bit more grunt in the middle, seeing if you can get the software to allow you to look at / adjust the mapping and get on a dyno and have a play with your induction legnths.
I would reckon on 180-185 bhp being more near the mark.
13-12-2005, 12:07 PM
#14
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anyone know if these rods (made by cosworth in USA for the focus 2.0 zetec american version) would fit in the UK 2.0 zetec silvertop engine?
http://www.focussport.com/cosworth_connecting_rods.htm
they are about Ł500 for a set.
and if i put them in with decent rod bolts, and i was running say 300bhp at flywheel (supercharger and nitrous) max 7000rpm, are the pistons or rings likely to fail?
http://www.focussport.com/cosworth_connecting_rods.htm
they are about Ł500 for a set.
and if i put them in with decent rod bolts, and i was running say 300bhp at flywheel (supercharger and nitrous) max 7000rpm, are the pistons or rings likely to fail?
13-12-2005, 12:59 PM
#15
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Originally Posted by Garage19
Do you have non stock cams?
problem with the weber TBs / ECU setups is that they are supplied with maps that have to cater for a fairly broad state of engine tune. One engine might be 10:1 with a stock exhaust manifold and the next might be 12:1 all singing, all dancing.
If you have a decent exhaust manifold design, i would think about upping the CR to 11-11.5:1 to gain 4-5 bhp and a bit more grunt in the middle, seeing if you can get the software to allow you to look at / adjust the mapping and get on a dyno and have a play with your induction legnths.
I would reckon on 180-185 bhp being more near the mark.
problem with the weber TBs / ECU setups is that they are supplied with maps that have to cater for a fairly broad state of engine tune. One engine might be 10:1 with a stock exhaust manifold and the next might be 12:1 all singing, all dancing.
If you have a decent exhaust manifold design, i would think about upping the CR to 11-11.5:1 to gain 4-5 bhp and a bit more grunt in the middle, seeing if you can get the software to allow you to look at / adjust the mapping and get on a dyno and have a play with your induction legnths.
I would reckon on 180-185 bhp being more near the mark.
spec is stage 1 head (ported/polished), fast road cams (but with standard pulleys, would verniers benifit alot?), trust electrical 4 branch manifold and the 45's
also engine was fully rebuilt, new everything so power figure was on a tight engine
13-12-2005, 01:37 PM
#16
PassionFord Post Troll
Ian,
A couple of things spring to mind.
A perfectly smooth power graph cannot be used as an indication that an engine has been mapped to its potential. I could create a smooth power graph with all the wrong figures. It might not make much power, but it would be smooth. Who mapped your engine?
The other thing is that, on a zetec you don't actually need vernier sprockets to adjust your cam timing. The stock sprockets are held on a taper with no key way so can be adjusted at your peasure. The verniers will just make the adjustment a little bit easier and you will have marks for reference if you need them.
Also, out of interest, who did your headwork?
Cheers,
Doug.
A couple of things spring to mind.
A perfectly smooth power graph cannot be used as an indication that an engine has been mapped to its potential. I could create a smooth power graph with all the wrong figures. It might not make much power, but it would be smooth. Who mapped your engine?
The other thing is that, on a zetec you don't actually need vernier sprockets to adjust your cam timing. The stock sprockets are held on a taper with no key way so can be adjusted at your peasure. The verniers will just make the adjustment a little bit easier and you will have marks for reference if you need them.
Also, out of interest, who did your headwork?
Cheers,
Doug.
13-12-2005, 01:40 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by Garage19
Ian,
A couple of things spring to mind.
A perfectly smooth power graph cannot be used as an indication that an engine has been mapped to its potential. I could create a smooth power graph with all the wrong figures. It might not make much power, but it would be smooth. Who mapped your engine?
The other thing is that, on a zetec you don't actually need vernier sprockets to adjust your cam timing. The stock sprockets are held on a taper with no key way so can be adjusted at your peasure. The verniers will just make the adjustment a little bit easier and you will have marks for reference if you need them.
Also, out of interest, who did your headwork?
Cheers,
Doug.
A couple of things spring to mind.
A perfectly smooth power graph cannot be used as an indication that an engine has been mapped to its potential. I could create a smooth power graph with all the wrong figures. It might not make much power, but it would be smooth. Who mapped your engine?
The other thing is that, on a zetec you don't actually need vernier sprockets to adjust your cam timing. The stock sprockets are held on a taper with no key way so can be adjusted at your peasure. The verniers will just make the adjustment a little bit easier and you will have marks for reference if you need them.
Also, out of interest, who did your headwork?
Cheers,
Doug.
appreciate your input btw
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