smitsturbo

what kind of inlet was that & how much do they cost then?

Chip

iTrader: (3)

They were magnesium WRC ones, known as an "MIS inlet" if you drop SteveBoySlim on here a PM I think he still has a couple, they go for anything from about 2200-3000 quid normally.

JonnyBravo

I don't think were WRC anything Chip as they were specced for rallycross iirc

Either way a good manifold if your building a big power engine

rog

iTrader: (2)

Can't you get similar ones to the MIS manifold, seem to remember reading about that sometime in the past (and significantly cheaper?)

Ryan

as above im pretty sure they were developed for rallyecross where restrictions werent an issue at all, im pretty sure wrc just used the escort or ecciv inlet.

think the mountune roller barrel was purely an NA application aswell for the zetec for the s2000 possibly, but has been adapted with machinine to suit a YB.

think yum used a MIS inlet and martin used a MIS plenum but then adapated it to suit throttle bodies rather than the single one suited to the MIS.

Rog, yes i believe they've been named HART inlets? i think which is basically a mix of MIS and standard cover, as its designed to fit on standard YB inlet runners

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Im sure you are correct there mate, I merely referred to it that was as its a "WRC style" inlet (lots wrc cars now have similar sidefeed mechanisms into the plenum), I wasnt attempting to claim they were actually used on any YB powered car in the WRC as im sure they werent.

Apologies for any confusion caused by my surcomeing to the common naming convention.

Ima Racing

iTrader: (1)

...wrc style to me is side by side injectors on the YB....i hear that hart one is all the rage nowadays

smitsturbo

"hart" what is this you speek of?

Chip

iTrader: (3)

I think that may also be a common misconception and is also more intended for rallycross use.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

See MadRod's build thread for an example of what it looks like and how it performs.

Resembles the standard inlet, but with what I am referring to as a "WRC style" tapered feed into the whole length of the plenum (although its actually not one continuous slot IIRC its a dotted line internally)

rs-tuner

iTrader: (1)

Dident rod use a standard rs500 inlet for his first engine

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Yes, then a "Hart" / "joe stevens" / "bluesprint" or whatever the official name is on the more recent one

TimC

iTrader: (1)

The injectors side by side where known as siamese inlet manifolds and where 100% used on WRC cars.

Ima Racing

iTrader: (1)

...yep they certainly were...sorry chip

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Cool, the group A ones Ive seen didnt have them but I know that lots of revisions were made for WRC.

What plenum covers did they use on the cars with the siamesed inlets then out of interest mate as Ive always ascociated the two developments (the MIS cover and the siamese inlet) as being from a similar time period? although ive never claimed to be any sort of good source of ford trivia so I stand happy to be corrected, lol

Pics would be cool if you have any

Chip

iTrader: (3)

You have nothing to be sorry about mate, I only said I didnt *think* that was the case, WRC cars of that era are way off my radar hence why my post wasnt worded in a way intended to be definitive in the first place, im more than happy to be corrected when i'm unsure on something

TimC

iTrader: (1)

TBH im not 100% sure on the Plenum itself.
I can get you the 909 finis code for it but I have jack shit info on it

Ryan

standard ecciv or escort ones as far as im aware chip, just o ringed i would imagine.

never seen a genuine wrc engine with anything other than those.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Cool, you learn something new every day

Wonder why they felt the need for twin injectors given how little power they made though? I know injectors at the time werent as well developed now, but even so it seems excessive?

TimC

iTrader: (1)

Ryan thats all I seem to be picking up on too. Everything looks to be O-Ringed instead of material gasket.

Chip - There are no notes as to why 8 injectors where used over the 4 of Group A

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Wonder if it was for flow, or wether the ecu was sophisticated enough to treat them as "spares", ie if one stopped working to double the duration on the other, often things in rallying are done with finishing the stage in mind rather than just out and out power from what i have seen.
What ECU's did the WRC cars run?

Or maybe the distribution is considered better for the dividided section of the inlet ports in the head?

Ryan

pectel t6

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

Im surprised someone hasnt recast the MIS one in alloy. sure lots of people want an uprated manifold but upto £3k just doesnt seem good value even if your spending £20k on engine work!

Rod-Tarry

This the Hart with WRC inlet & RS500 throttlebody.

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

Your turbos just not big enough Rod

the hart manifold does seem much better value for money if it flows well enough for your usage!!

Did you have to flow it or was it good to go as you recieved it?? Also does it flow better than the end fed log type plenums?

Rod-Tarry

Mark had the Hart cleaned up by his head man as its a bit rough as supplied. On the same engine Spec it made 47bhp more than an RS500 plenum which had obviously reached its limits. Certainly the equal of the MIS at these levels in fact i believe it made its Power with lower boost than Daves when on the same Turbo.

smitsturbo

how much rod??

hicost

As Rod said, I did some back to back testing on Joe’s dyno with the Hart unit before they were sold; I saw the near exact gain in BHP against a Swedish plenum.

I am running a ported head with Siemens and a T38 + a few other bits and I am putting out around 470bhp and boosting to 30psi. The throttle response is much better also.

stu21t

it not only flows better giving more bhp
but it also distributes more evenly to the cylinders, and gives more even egts across the board

M K

iTrader: (9)

as rods pic is a little hard to see the inlet clearly here is a few more pics, as rod said the inside is still rough cast so really needs to be polished up,









cost £460 with reversed throttle linkage, and i paid £50 for a new injector manifold section, so an absolute bargain compared to MIS version

iftikhar

bttt

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

does look a bargain for those figures!!

How bigs the spacer plate and did it make much difference??

Garage19

I like that manifold. Well designed and a nice piece of kit.

Who was it originally produced for? Why is it reffered to as a Hart manifold?

RSCossieGaz

iTrader: (6)

this hart manifold is it only suitable if your chasing big bhp? or would you see any benefits on a lets say stage 3 spec'ish engine??

Rod-Tarry

I had one of the first batch & paid £500 + £35 for a front pull bracket, think they may be a tad cheaper now, it really is the bargain of the century. My WRC inlet was £180 if i remember correctly so about £700 for an inlet/Plenum that appears to be best of breed. Mark was shocked & have talked to Joe so was he that he seemed to have hit on such a winner.
I also use a 14mm spacer.

steveboyslim

Magnesium has a different shrinkage rate when compared to aluminium, it would cost too much money to alter the pattern, adding to the cost of the MIS manifolds, the cost of either metal is not much different.
The originals were mag to keep the weight to a sensible level, although I understand that there were some cast in aluminium which had trouble with snapping the lower inlet part of the YB head even, with a vibration damper fitted.
The cost of MIS type manifolds is nearer £2k.

Steve

Ima Racing

iTrader: (1)

...the reason they used the siamese setup in wrc even though they only needed 4 injectors (than ran 8 x greens!) was spray pattern i was told...so i assume they ran all 8 constantly!?

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Makes sense to me, as per my comment earlier:

Would be interesting to know for sure though, the ability to include an element of redundancy is also potentially a very good plus point in rallying of course!

Ryan

yeah seeing as most ran twin map sensors, twin crank sensors, for this very reason.

RANJ

lol mis inlets are so 7 years ago ... lol