whats the greatest car engine ever
04-01-2010, 06:38 PM
#81
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Engine will be standard internals on Jenveys and also dry sumped, nothing outrageous but damn cheap to replace IF it ever went wrong where as the 3 previous engines I had planned for the car would of left me severly skint if they had of ever gone wrong.
A guy over on Turbosport is running one and after a few chats with him it seemed the right way of doing things as the cars cost enough to build without needing a 10k+ engine under the bonnet
If things go well there will be progress this year though...
04-01-2010, 06:55 PM
#83
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Its a F20C, will be going in my Mk2 but currently I'm trying to clear my feet before carrying back on with the project.
Engine will be standard internals on Jenveys and also dry sumped, nothing outrageous but damn cheap to replace IF it ever went wrong where as the 3 previous engines I had planned for the car would of left me severly skint if they had of ever gone wrong.
A guy over on Turbosport is running one and after a few chats with him it seemed the right way of doing things as the cars cost enough to build without needing a 10k+ engine under the bonnet
If things go well there will be progress this year though...
Engine will be standard internals on Jenveys and also dry sumped, nothing outrageous but damn cheap to replace IF it ever went wrong where as the 3 previous engines I had planned for the car would of left me severly skint if they had of ever gone wrong.
A guy over on Turbosport is running one and after a few chats with him it seemed the right way of doing things as the cars cost enough to build without needing a 10k+ engine under the bonnet
If things go well there will be progress this year though...
In all honesty though mate, why the hell did you pick a F20C? It has no torque at all throughout the WHOLE REV RANGE! No! Really!!
04-01-2010, 07:55 PM
#87
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That sounds bloody brilliant! Do you have a thread up at all? I take it you wouldn't be silly enough to put FWD drivetrain onto that and have stuck with the RWD drivetrain, so is the Escort a MK1/MK2 or is it a later one converted to RWD?
In all honesty though mate, why the hell did you pick a F20C? It has no torque at all throughout the WHOLE REV RANGE! No! Really!!
In all honesty though mate, why the hell did you pick a F20C? It has no torque at all throughout the WHOLE REV RANGE! No! Really!!
Car is a 1979 Mk2 Rs2000 Grp 4 prepped shell
The engines are fantastic in NA trim, more power can be had for not huge amounts of money, find me any throttle bodied 255hp dry sumped engine for less than 5k ?
In turbo form they have made over 500whp by simply adding a turbo and the correct injectors etc.. !
Anyway back on topic although the graphs I am sure some will find interesting.
04-01-2010, 07:55 PM
#88
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if mass produced anyone from the main american V8's all have done something ground breaking !!! the A series prob first most flexible engines as was fitted to many FWD and RWD formats and same reason the Xflow should be in there too !!
04-01-2010, 07:59 PM
#90
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Pound for pound got to be the Yb cossie lump hasnt it?. You remember when everyone used to go to car shows just to catch a glimpse of these cars?. Everyone of my mates wanted a cossie it was THE car to aspire to if u loved motors. On a standard engine a stage 3 was what 330 bhp?, and in the early 90's that was a shit load of power. Look at the cars that were around at the time, a peugeot 205 gti 1.9 only had 130 bhp, escort turbo same, astra gte 16v bit more. Pound for pound its got to be the cheapest ever for horsepower in this country. Dont get me wrong, with cars like evos and scoobys the games moved on, but that was the golden age of tuning in this country, and the cossie ruled.
04-01-2010, 08:49 PM
#95
agree with most of the above 
and although its not the greatest engine ever, from ford i think the BOA V6 is a good design, at the time ford thought it was unmachable. find another N/A V6 that can match 207 ft/lb on pump fuel and witha cat and be able to meet all the american emmision crap and still manage 28mpg. u can pick them up for pennys, u get cosworth twincam heads, mahle pistons and a fillet rolled crankshaft uprated rods. and providing u put decent oil in them and change the cam chain tensioner every 80K i know of engines that have coverd 300K and u can hammer the bollox of them and they will take it.
the new boxer diesel is a bloody good motor aswel, but not really old enough to know.
and although its not the greatest engine ever, from ford i think the BOA V6 is a good design, at the time ford thought it was unmachable. find another N/A V6 that can match 207 ft/lb on pump fuel and witha cat and be able to meet all the american emmision crap and still manage 28mpg. u can pick them up for pennys, u get cosworth twincam heads, mahle pistons and a fillet rolled crankshaft uprated rods. and providing u put decent oil in them and change the cam chain tensioner every 80K i know of engines that have coverd 300K and u can hammer the bollox of them and they will take it. the new boxer diesel is a bloody good motor aswel, but not really old enough to know.
04-01-2010, 09:38 PM
#97
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i remember reading that the nissan v6 that came in many variations in maximas/350's won an world institute of engineers engine of the year award for ten years in a row from 95 on. they tested engines on power output/ecomony/build quality ect
04-01-2010, 09:39 PM
#98
In all fairness, it is quite hard to find other other N/A 2.0 engines that are pushing out 250hp. I did find one though.
http://www.carfolio.com/specificatio...ar/?car=119262
Just wanna say though, I don't think you get what i was trying to say mate. I don't mean they lack torque completely, or throughout the whole rev range. My point was that LOW DOWN (Read it again chip. LOW DOWN. Did you get that?), i personally think they don't have as much torque as other engines with the same ammount of cylinders and similar cylinder capacity, which is MY opinion. I'm sure either one of us could be proved wrong or right, but i suppose the only way to find out would be with graphs, but i truly don't give a fuck whether you agree with me or not, so I'm not gonna bother going into that ammount of detail.
I suppose we will have to agree to disagree eh??
http://www.carfolio.com/specificatio...ar/?car=119262
Just wanna say though, I don't think you get what i was trying to say mate. I don't mean they lack torque completely, or throughout the whole rev range. My point was that LOW DOWN (Read it again chip. LOW DOWN. Did you get that?), i personally think they don't have as much torque as other engines with the same ammount of cylinders and similar cylinder capacity, which is MY opinion. I'm sure either one of us could be proved wrong or right, but i suppose the only way to find out would be with graphs, but i truly don't give a fuck whether you agree with me or not, so I'm not gonna bother going into that ammount of detail.
I suppose we will have to agree to disagree eh??
But they do have good low down torque, thats the whole point of vtec!
It allows them to run a lairy cam up top for peak power, but a milder one at lower RPM to still make good torque lower down.
04-01-2010, 09:45 PM
#99
Fully ally construction, half a million mile reliable, they are so smooth that you can bounce them off the rev limiter and still stand a coin up ON ITS END on top of the engine and it wont fall off, the internals are good for massive power in standard form, they have one of the flattest torque curves of any engine ever, the standard internals are capable of approaching 9000rpm.
They are just truely epicly awesome "money no object" engines.
People look at the shitty looking exhaust manifolds and think "what a load of crap" cause they dont realise they have been specifically designed like that to smooth the torque curve, if they were equal length sexy tubular race ones then they would gain up top and lose down the bottom, which isnt what lexus wanted.
You get something like 85% of peak torque from 2K rpm till nearly the rev limiter, when you accelerate it one it feels almost like driving an electric car, its just totally linear.
One of my favourite engines of all time without a doubt, wonderful combination of 8 cylinders and high technolog, its crazy to think the design dates back to the late 80s!
04-01-2010, 09:46 PM
#100
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thats quite interesting to see.. not seen an overlay graph like that before of the same engine... I was always assuming that a standard plenum setup would give better low down torque than the TBs due to air speed etc..
I guess that graph shows the torque on the TBs engine building initially very slightly slower than the plenum engine.. but thought the gap would be slightly more noticable than that... maybe at very low engine speeds it would.. but then, when would that actually matter in the real world!
Last edited by pee vee; 04-01-2010 at 09:47 PM.
05-01-2010, 10:05 AM
#104
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05-01-2010, 10:19 AM
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Wasn't the Rover V8 only popular to a lack of feasible alternatives at the time, e.g compact and relatively light V8's.
However its wasn't actually that light as it was been compared to engines such as the B series which is extremely heavy. It is also extremely expensive to tune to a reasonable power output in na form e.g. 350+bhp and prove extremely unreliable at such outputs, so it isn't therefore that great really is it? (or am I missing the point entirely?)
However its wasn't actually that light as it was been compared to engines such as the B series which is extremely heavy. It is also extremely expensive to tune to a reasonable power output in na form e.g. 350+bhp and prove extremely unreliable at such outputs, so it isn't therefore that great really is it? (or am I missing the point entirely?)
06-01-2010, 10:55 AM
#107
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Wasn't the Rover V8 only popular to a lack of feasible alternatives at the time, e.g compact and relatively light V8's.
However its wasn't actually that light as it was been compared to engines such as the B series which is extremely heavy. It is also extremely expensive to tune to a reasonable power output in na form e.g. 350+bhp and prove extremely unreliable at such outputs, so it isn't therefore that great really is it? (or am I missing the point entirely?)
However its wasn't actually that light as it was been compared to engines such as the B series which is extremely heavy. It is also extremely expensive to tune to a reasonable power output in na form e.g. 350+bhp and prove extremely unreliable at such outputs, so it isn't therefore that great really is it? (or am I missing the point entirely?)
06-01-2010, 10:58 AM
#108
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06-01-2010, 11:20 AM
#109
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the b16a honda vtec engine, was in production in 1990 and managed to produce 150bhp from a n/a 1.6 engine and still be 100% reliable even at 200k miles.
Might not seem that impressive as it is only a 150bhp motor but compare it to any other 1.6 n/a engine even modern ones and it is still a cracking little motor
Might not seem that impressive as it is only a 150bhp motor but compare it to any other 1.6 n/a engine even modern ones and it is still a cracking little motor
06-01-2010, 11:35 AM
#111
the b16a honda vtec engine, was in production in 1990 and managed to produce 150bhp from a n/a 1.6 engine and still be 100% reliable even at 200k miles.
Might not seem that impressive as it is only a 150bhp motor but compare it to any other 1.6 n/a engine even modern ones and it is still a cracking little motor
Might not seem that impressive as it is only a 150bhp motor but compare it to any other 1.6 n/a engine even modern ones and it is still a cracking little motor
06-01-2010, 11:53 AM
#113
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b16a was 150bhp
b6a1 was 160bhp odd i think
b16a2 was 160bhp i think
The b16b is an even better engine but less produced,, thats the one in the ek9 civic type-r 185bhp from a 1.6 n/a which is very very good going imo.
edited to say my old crx made 152bhp and had 140k on the clock and still on the standard engine, head gasket everything. Me mate bought it off me and did a few bits to it and it made 176bhp on a completly standard engine with 170k miles and nothing but breathing mods nothing internal at all
b6a1 was 160bhp odd i think
b16a2 was 160bhp i think
The b16b is an even better engine but less produced,, thats the one in the ek9 civic type-r 185bhp from a 1.6 n/a which is very very good going imo.
edited to say my old crx made 152bhp and had 140k on the clock and still on the standard engine, head gasket everything. Me mate bought it off me and did a few bits to it and it made 176bhp on a completly standard engine with 170k miles and nothing but breathing mods nothing internal at all
Last edited by Alps Pacino; 06-01-2010 at 11:55 AM.
06-01-2010, 12:00 PM
#116
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ye i know i love me hondas, best front wheel drive performance cars out there imo obviously across the whole range compared to other makes whole range. I like them cause i was blasting about in them when everyone just thought they were a poxy 1.6 and didnt realise they rev to 8500rpm standard and make 150bhp, whicj means they have the same sort of pace as an xe nova
06-01-2010, 12:25 PM
#117
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this forum is weird... everyones joined, because at one time or another they liked the good old fords and there engines.. but now it seems its all the rage these days on here to slag them off...
imo the yb is the greatest engine, simple because it is so simple and basic and a brain dead diy mechanic can get them to 350bhp and be unbelievable reliable.
also there also a very small engine, so they can fit in many different cars...
how people can compare a honda engine is behond me punching a perfetic 200bhp, compared to yb with a couple of cheap mods and have 350bhp 320lbft and it will be very strong... lets face it thats the same bhp as a e46 07plate m3. and a yb with that kind of punch is what £1700 what a bargin... probly less than the price of throttle bodies for a different engine..
my yb has seen of porsche boxters, carrera s, and a carrera 4s, targa e46m3. i fancy my chances on a gt3 too when i come across one... thats some serous cars my old yb has pulled from.. let alone everyone says there shit??
imo the yb is the greatest engine, simple because it is so simple and basic and a brain dead diy mechanic can get them to 350bhp and be unbelievable reliable.
also there also a very small engine, so they can fit in many different cars...
how people can compare a honda engine is behond me punching a perfetic 200bhp, compared to yb with a couple of cheap mods and have 350bhp 320lbft and it will be very strong... lets face it thats the same bhp as a e46 07plate m3. and a yb with that kind of punch is what £1700 what a bargin... probly less than the price of throttle bodies for a different engine..
my yb has seen of porsche boxters, carrera s, and a carrera 4s, targa e46m3. i fancy my chances on a gt3 too when i come across one... thats some serous cars my old yb has pulled from.. let alone everyone says there shit??
06-01-2010, 12:30 PM
#118
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I'd back the Rover V8. Not particularly powerful, but it is my second favourite car noise. Got a treat yesterday as everyone was bringing out their old Range Rovers and Discos for the snow
Any engine that remains in production for nealy half a century can't be all that bad...
Any engine that remains in production for nealy half a century can't be all that bad...
06-01-2010, 12:34 PM
#119
this forum is weird... everyones joined, because at one time or another they liked the good old fords and there engines.. but now it seems its all the rage these days on here to slag them off...
imo the yb is the greatest engine, simple because it is so simple and basic and a brain dead diy mechanic can get them to 350bhp and be unbelievable reliable.
also there also a very small engine, so they can fit in many different cars...
how people can compare a honda engine is behond me punching a perfetic 200bhp, compared to yb with a couple of cheap mods and have 350bhp 320lbft and it will be very strong... lets face it thats the same bhp as a e46 07plate m3. and a yb with that kind of punch is what £1700 what a bargin... probly less than the price of throttle bodies for a different engine..
my yb has seen of porsche boxters, carrera s, and a carrera 4s, targa e46m3. i fancy my chances on a gt3 too when i come across one... thats some serous cars my old yb has pulled from.. let alone everyone says there shit??
imo the yb is the greatest engine, simple because it is so simple and basic and a brain dead diy mechanic can get them to 350bhp and be unbelievable reliable.
also there also a very small engine, so they can fit in many different cars...
how people can compare a honda engine is behond me punching a perfetic 200bhp, compared to yb with a couple of cheap mods and have 350bhp 320lbft and it will be very strong... lets face it thats the same bhp as a e46 07plate m3. and a yb with that kind of punch is what £1700 what a bargin... probly less than the price of throttle bodies for a different engine..
my yb has seen of porsche boxters, carrera s, and a carrera 4s, targa e46m3. i fancy my chances on a gt3 too when i come across one... thats some serous cars my old yb has pulled from.. let alone everyone says there shit??
