Is there a better designed plenum than this?
what a superb topic, and as regards to MADRods 150+ shot of Nos, I am 99% sure that the 500 plenum dosn't need to be able to flow extra air, as I thought the whole point of Nos was it is OXYGEN RICH air, not extra VOLUME of air 
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Originally Posted by RWD_cossie_wil
what a superb topic, and as regards to MADRods 150+ shot of Nos, I am 99% sure that the 500 plenum dosn't need to be able to flow extra air, as I thought the whole point of Nos was it is OXYGEN RICH air, not extra VOLUME of air learn all you want here or ask
http://www.noswizard.com/bboard/
[/quote]
nos has no oxygen content until the chemical reaction within the combustion camber then it releases oxygen[/quote]
so the compound Nitrous OXIDE (hint there ) dosn't consist of 2 nitrogen atoms and one OXYGEN atom then? please explain where the oxygen magically appears from if its not in the N20??
nos has no oxygen content until the chemical reaction within the combustion camber then it releases oxygen[/quote]
so the compound Nitrous OXIDE (hint there
) dosn't consist of 2 nitrogen atoms and one OXYGEN atom then? please explain where the oxygen magically appears from if its not in the N20??
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You are both correct, interpreting each other wrong though.
The oxygen gets RELEASED from the N2O during combustion, forming 02-molecules, adding these to fire creates... Well INTENSE energy to say the least. Everything burning requires a supply of oxygen, the more the better it burns. The same with combustion, the more oxygen you add the more efficient the combustion will be.
The oxygen gets RELEASED from the N2O during combustion, forming 02-molecules, adding these to fire creates... Well INTENSE energy to say the least. Everything burning requires a supply of oxygen, the more the better it burns. The same with combustion, the more oxygen you add the more efficient the combustion will be.
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nos has no oxygen content until the chemical reaction within the combustion camber then it releases oxygen[/quote]
so the compound Nitrous OXIDE (hint there ) dosn't consist of 2 nitrogen atoms and one OXYGEN atom then? please explain where the oxygen magically appears from if its not in the N20?? [/quote]
hey dude thats quite a reaction
the post that i was commenting on was disscussing airflow through the plenum. nos would not pass any oxygen at this point oxygen would be released in the combustion chamber only
if nos was released to air then there would be no oxygen content.
so the compound Nitrous OXIDE (hint there
) dosn't consist of 2 nitrogen atoms and one OXYGEN atom then? please explain where the oxygen magically appears from if its not in the N20?? [/quote]hey dude thats quite a reaction
the post that i was commenting on was disscussing airflow through the plenum. nos would not pass any oxygen at this point oxygen would be released in the combustion chamber only
if nos was released to air then there would be no oxygen content.
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Originally Posted by Kev.H
Originally Posted by EscortWRC
NOS is for people who can't build motors anyway......
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And when the bottle runs out...you're stuck with what's left
If your engine can take the cylinder pressure from the nitrous, it can take it from a bigger turbo....so make more power and don't worry about the bottle being empty
If your engine can take the cylinder pressure from the nitrous, it can take it from a bigger turbo....so make more power and don't worry about the bottle being empty
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Originally Posted by hexxon
Originally Posted by Kev.H
Originally Posted by EscortWRC
NOS is for people who can't build motors anyway......
And I thought it was created by the director of fast n furious for chavs in Novas 
Originally Posted by EscortWRC
And when the bottle runs out...you're stuck with what's left
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From: Northants
Pics cropped and resized slightly, hopefully the attention to detail
can still be seen.
Hexxon
Heres the pictures of my runners and trumpets. Pay notice the textural differences on different parts of it as an example. This is a early version, in the final version there will be some fabrications on the contact surface with the plenum box, to ensure radiused surfaces everywhere inside the plenum, no sharp corners. 200 hours or so in total will be required for the final version.
The piece which the pictures display has been totally reworked on all of the surfaces being internal. All of the surfaces has been smoothed out and reformed where there was gain in doing so. The basic surface smoothing, that is, making sure that no nasty bumps and holes are present (such as relics from casting), is performed to eliminate turbulence inside of the intake, optimizing the volumetric efficiency of the engine at ALL revs and loads.
The trumpets were then polished to further remove turbulence, but the part of the runners where contact with fuel is present was left with a rougher texture, to optimize fuel atomizing. All of the inside of the plenum will be polished when finished actually.
The runners were reformed to suit the characteristics i wanted in my engine, theyre bigger in the cross sectional area as you might have noticed.
Heres the pictures of my runners and trumpets. Pay notice the textural differences on different parts of it as an example. This is a early version, in the final version there will be some fabrications on the contact surface with the plenum box, to ensure radiused surfaces everywhere inside the plenum, no sharp corners. 200 hours or so in total will be required for the final version.
The piece which the pictures display has been totally reworked on all of the surfaces being internal. All of the surfaces has been smoothed out and reformed where there was gain in doing so. The basic surface smoothing, that is, making sure that no nasty bumps and holes are present (such as relics from casting), is performed to eliminate turbulence inside of the intake, optimizing the volumetric efficiency of the engine at ALL revs and loads.
The trumpets were then polished to further remove turbulence, but the part of the runners where contact with fuel is present was left with a rougher texture, to optimize fuel atomizing. All of the inside of the plenum will be polished when finished actually.
The runners were reformed to suit the characteristics i wanted in my engine, theyre bigger in the cross sectional area as you might have noticed.
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Who is this Nick Waple? Remember, not increasing the outlet, as well as the outlet would generate gas velocities worse than original at same gas flow... Nick has done that though Well, nice enough, besides that i dont like the idea of o-ringing against the head, all of the heat from the head is transferred via the material into the intake.
Well, nice enough, besides that i dont like the idea of o-ringing against the head, all of the heat from the head is transferred via the material into the intake.
Originally Posted by Doug Stirling
Thanks for posting pics Bill
Just for comparrison, Nick Waple flowed inlet pics:
Just for comparrison, Nick Waple flowed inlet pics:
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Patrik, Nick Waples is a well respected 'head man' - did Mike R's head and quite a few others, he's ex-F1.
I think neoprene is the material used for the O rings, but Doug can confirm....
I think neoprene is the material used for the O rings, but Doug can confirm....
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Oooh Hexxon, not allowed to diss Mr Waple in the UK cosworth scene, hes "god" you know
I think he did RS500 race head porting, and we know nothings faster or better than RS500 spec, ever, ever
I think he did RS500 race head porting, and we know nothings faster or better than RS500 spec, ever, ever
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Originally Posted by Billabong
Patrik, Nick Waples is a well respected 'head man' - did Mike R's head and quite a few others, he's ex-F1.
I think neoprene is the material used for the O rings, but Doug can confirm....
I think neoprene is the material used for the O rings, but Doug can confirm....
Dont like the idea regardless of material actually, since the aluminium surfaces will be in contact...
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LOL - Steve, that's not how I meant it!
Patrik, I *think* the O ring is just instead of the std paper gasket - better at preventing leaks, but again, I'll await Doug to confirm that.
Patrik, I *think* the O ring is just instead of the std paper gasket - better at preventing leaks, but again, I'll await Doug to confirm that.
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Originally Posted by Billabong
LOL - Steve, that's not how I meant it!
Patrik, I *think* the O ring is just instead of the std paper gasket - better at preventing leaks, but again, I'll await Doug to confirm that.
Patrik, I *think* the O ring is just instead of the std paper gasket - better at preventing leaks, but again, I'll await Doug to confirm that.
But, every technique has it applications...
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Who is this Nick Waple? Why has he just been increasing the area of the "outlet" of the intake? Or am i blind? Would generate gas velocities worse than original at same gas flow that... Well, otherwise nice, besides that i dont like the idea of o-ringing against the head, all of the heat from the head is transferred via the material into the intake.
Hexxon,
Nick supplies the flowed YB head and inlet as a matched set. The "O" rings are indeed neoprene as Bill said.
The problem with the standard gaskets is firstly they have to be "opened up" to match head/inlet.......and with big (ish) boost engines (2.5 BAR) they can blow apart/break up over time
Hexxon,
Nick supplies the flowed YB head and inlet as a matched set. The "O" rings are indeed neoprene as Bill said.
The problem with the standard gaskets is firstly they have to be "opened up" to match head/inlet.......and with big (ish) boost engines (2.5 BAR) they can blow apart/break up over time
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Yes, it was easy to make that assumption based on the surfaces... But i was wrong in seeing that
The only thing i might want to argue is the size, in volume, of the runners, what are the application of these? What amount of power will it be extracting? What boost?
The only thing i might want to argue is the size, in volume, of the runners, what are the application of these? What amount of power will it be extracting? What boost?
Originally Posted by Itsmeagain
I know YOU didnt mean it Bill, but i bet a lot of people think that!
And looks like Pat' was being a bit blind and it was good afterall
And looks like Pat' was being a bit blind and it was good afterall
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Originally Posted by hexxon
The only thing i might want to argue is the size, in volume, of the runners, what are the application of these? What amount of power will it be extracting? What boost?
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Originally Posted by Doug Stirling
Who is this Nick Waple? Why has he just been increasing the area of the "outlet" of the intake? Or am i blind? Would generate gas velocities worse than original at same gas flow that... Well, otherwise nice, besides that i dont like the idea of o-ringing against the head, all of the heat from the head is transferred via the material into the intake.
Hexxon,
Nick supplies the flowed YB head and inlet as a matched set. The "O" rings are indeed neoprene as Bill said.
The problem with the standard gaskets is firstly they have to be "opened up" to match head/inlet.......and with big (ish) boost engines (2.5 BAR) they can blow apart/break up over time
Hexxon,
Nick supplies the flowed YB head and inlet as a matched set. The "O" rings are indeed neoprene as Bill said.
The problem with the standard gaskets is firstly they have to be "opened up" to match head/inlet.......and with big (ish) boost engines (2.5 BAR) they can blow apart/break up over time
I still dont like that solution with the sealing
My final solution will also be involving making a grove in the runners head-contact-surface, then applying a custom ptfe/teflon-based 3 mm spacer onto that, the spacer having a grove in it as well. Two o-rings on each side of the spacer, twice effective, sealing away leakage and temperature.
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Originally Posted by Doug Stirling
Originally Posted by hexxon
The only thing i might want to argue is the size, in volume, of the runners, what are the application of these? What amount of power will it be extracting? What boost?
With the runner size, judging by the eye(which yet again may be blind), you will have a fairly low gas velocity at low revs combined with low boosts. The fact that using a t4, which is a fairly slow spool-uper, will probably create a very manly, but inefficient according to me, ketchup-effect as we call it in sweden. Im hoping on the opposite for you anyway, with my bad eyes, probably will be the case
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Yeah sure youll get some fruity power with that one... HUMOUR CHECK -> BREAKDOWN... Haha!
Originally Posted by paddy1977
I read how to design a plenum and did my own, it's good for 500bhp. And it's also not bad for slicing up and putting on breakfast cereals.
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Originally Posted by hexxon
With the runner size, judging by the eye(which yet again may be blind), you will have a fairly low gas velocity at low revs combined with low boosts. The fact that using a t4, which is a fairly slow spool-uper, will probably create a very manly, but inefficient according to me, ketchup-effect as we call it in sweden.
I think youl find (from what i understand thats been going on, lol) a lot of the new wave of huge power YBs in the UK have less huge ports but much more power (ie the ports could be smaller and still give the power, tho maybe not on the exact same spec), and drive pretty damn nice too cause of the smaller ports.
LOL@Paddy too
Has mike asked if he can sell it yet?