ECU's from level 1 to P8
07-10-2008, 10:45 AM
#1
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ECU's from level 1 to P8
i often read how rubbish a level1 or 6 is compared to the level 8,please enlighten me as to why they are so much different,are you saying the better the ecu the less likely your engine will blow up?All i can see is that the only benefit of upgrading (i am staying on level 1!) is if you want good fuel economy off boost (understandable if you use the car alot) or you want anti-lag?I understand level 6 can run dizzyless can level 1?Is level 8/p8 easier to map?Please explain
07-10-2008, 11:11 AM
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Trotter,
The guy you need to talk too isnt on here anymore as he was banned.
His name was Phil, (Ima, Boschtwat) ... a complete f*cking idiot but was the DIY king and expert who new nothing in reality !
The guy you need to talk too isnt on here anymore as he was banned.
His name was Phil, (Ima, Boschtwat) ... a complete f*cking idiot but was the DIY king and expert who new nothing in reality !
07-10-2008, 11:34 AM
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do i really need to know that?Keep on topic please,if you dont know yourself dont reply.many thanks.
KSA-cossie yes i agree evolution but is it simply more functions and/or better control to the point of having a safer engine on boost?
07-10-2008, 12:06 PM
#6
- L1 has a little less injector control than L6
- L1 is a little more unreliable than L6
- L1 & 6 have various issues with internal componentry that sees them burn out internally.
- L8 has more control calibration available.
- L8 runs a knock strategy on teh Std YB program.
- L8 has the ability to run in closed loop.
- L8 has enough ROM space to run a serial datastream programs.
- L8 has enough ROM space to run wasted spark programs.
- L8 has enough ROM space to run Launch Control programs.
Last edited by Stu @ M Developments; 07-10-2008 at 12:15 PM.
07-10-2008, 12:09 PM
#7
I'm going to approach this reply from the perspective of 'if it aint broke, don't fix it', so I don't expect to by lynched by the L8 fanclub...
The L8 is a development of the L6, which was a development of the L1. As you've noticed, the whole 'better' concept is subjective - if you don't need or want to use the capabilities of the later ECU, then they're not going to give you a benefit, and are therefore no better and no worse. The L1 is perfectly capable of running a YB engine, otherwise it wouldn't have been put there.
The L8 can make use of a lambda sensor out of the box without modification, so long as the chip in the ROM socket knows how to use one. The L8 can also be modified by the nice chaps at MSD to accomodate Antilag and Launch Control. Currently there's no commercially available offering for the same features on the L1 or L6. If those are things you'll want to use, then the L8 is of benefit to you, and is better than the other two.
Bear in mind that some other 3rd party ECUs can probably do these features (and more besides) out of the box, they just require a lot more effort to install, compared to a simple replacement of the unit.
And after typing all that Stu beats me to it with a more concise response! Damn it. 
The L8 is a development of the L6, which was a development of the L1. As you've noticed, the whole 'better' concept is subjective - if you don't need or want to use the capabilities of the later ECU, then they're not going to give you a benefit, and are therefore no better and no worse. The L1 is perfectly capable of running a YB engine, otherwise it wouldn't have been put there.
The L8 can make use of a lambda sensor out of the box without modification, so long as the chip in the ROM socket knows how to use one. The L8 can also be modified by the nice chaps at MSD to accomodate Antilag and Launch Control. Currently there's no commercially available offering for the same features on the L1 or L6. If those are things you'll want to use, then the L8 is of benefit to you, and is better than the other two.
Bear in mind that some other 3rd party ECUs can probably do these features (and more besides) out of the box, they just require a lot more effort to install, compared to a simple replacement of the unit.
And after typing all that Stu beats me to it with a more concise response!
Damn it.
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07-10-2008, 01:45 PM
#14
lol
the info was for chip so he will understand ,I didn't need to write an essay to answer his question
and i was on the phone at the time so I was multi tasking.
as an additional note more brake points can be added ie a 13X16 fuel map can be made into a 16x16
the info was for chip so he will understand ,I didn't need to write an essay to answer his question
and i was on the phone at the time so I was multi tasking.
as an additional note more brake points can be added ie a 13X16 fuel map can be made into a 16x16
07-10-2008, 02:17 PM
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Chip,
From a maps point of view ...no !
This is because the map entrys are all single bytes.
However, the interplation resolution is higher on the P8 due to extended 16 bit instructiosn of the cpu.
Also the timer system in the L1/L6/L8 is at the same internal clock rate of 2 microseconds per timer bit. (16 bit timer)
On the P8 this is 4 times the speed at 0.5 microseconds per timer bit.
The cpu on the P8 is also 4 times faster.
From a maps point of view ...no !
This is because the map entrys are all single bytes.
However, the interplation resolution is higher on the P8 due to extended 16 bit instructiosn of the cpu.
Also the timer system in the L1/L6/L8 is at the same internal clock rate of 2 microseconds per timer bit. (16 bit timer)
On the P8 this is 4 times the speed at 0.5 microseconds per timer bit.
The cpu on the P8 is also 4 times faster.
07-10-2008, 02:20 PM
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Well my doorstep runs my car very well with switchable maps,but I have no clue of spec on the other map so just putting an msd single map in instead LOL
.
07-10-2008, 02:32 PM
#21
Chip,
From a maps point of view ...no !
This is because the map entrys are all single bytes.
However, the interplation resolution is higher on the P8 due to extended 16 bit instructiosn of the cpu.
Also the timer system in the L1/L6/L8 is at the same internal clock rate of 2 microseconds per timer bit. (16 bit timer)
On the P8 this is 4 times the speed at 0.5 microseconds per timer bit.
The cpu on the P8 is also 4 times faster.
From a maps point of view ...no !
This is because the map entrys are all single bytes.
However, the interplation resolution is higher on the P8 due to extended 16 bit instructiosn of the cpu.
Also the timer system in the L1/L6/L8 is at the same internal clock rate of 2 microseconds per timer bit. (16 bit timer)
On the P8 this is 4 times the speed at 0.5 microseconds per timer bit.
The cpu on the P8 is also 4 times faster.
07-10-2008, 02:46 PM
#22
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Jay,
L8 has closed loop as standard.
Most tuners prefer L8 as this has the most tuning software tools available for it and has probably had most time spent on reverse engineering it !
There are also far more L8's out there than P8's !!!
I personally would go for the P8 myself but alot of P8 chips have bugs in them of which only a few tuners have removed.
One such bug was the first time you started the car in the morning, it wouldnt start or would take an excessive time to start.
L8 has closed loop as standard.
Most tuners prefer L8 as this has the most tuning software tools available for it and has probably had most time spent on reverse engineering it !
There are also far more L8's out there than P8's !!!
I personally would go for the P8 myself but alot of P8 chips have bugs in them of which only a few tuners have removed.
One such bug was the first time you started the car in the morning, it wouldnt start or would take an excessive time to start.
Last edited by ECU Monitor Enthusiast; 07-10-2008 at 02:50 PM.
07-10-2008, 02:49 PM
#23
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Jay,
L8 has closed loop as standard.
Most tuners prefer L8 as this has the most tuning software tools available for it and has probably had most time spent on reverse engineering it !
There are also far more L8's out there than P8's !!!
I personally would go for the P8 myself but alot of P8 chips have bugs in them of which only a few tuners have removed.
L8 has closed loop as standard.
Most tuners prefer L8 as this has the most tuning software tools available for it and has probably had most time spent on reverse engineering it !
There are also far more L8's out there than P8's !!!
I personally would go for the P8 myself but alot of P8 chips have bugs in them of which only a few tuners have removed.
07-10-2008, 03:01 PM
#27
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That refers to many problems like the one I mentioned above.
Also another was the fuel trim learning function could learn the wrong way I.E. a long term lean off would actually richen.
Most chip tuners turned off that function as they didnt have the skills or knowledge to sort it out, whilst other used the correct base program and sorted it.
Also another was the fuel trim learning function could learn the wrong way I.E. a long term lean off would actually richen.
Most chip tuners turned off that function as they didnt have the skills or knowledge to sort it out, whilst other used the correct base program and sorted it.
07-10-2008, 03:02 PM
#28
That refers to many problems like the one I mentioned above.
Also another was the fuel trim learning function could learn the wrong way I.E. a long term lean off would actually richen.
Most chip tuners turned off that function as they didnt have the skills or knowledge to sort it out, whilst other used the correct base program and sorted it.
Also another was the fuel trim learning function could learn the wrong way I.E. a long term lean off would actually richen.
Most chip tuners turned off that function as they didnt have the skills or knowledge to sort it out, whilst other used the correct base program and sorted it.
07-10-2008, 03:27 PM
#31
p8 syndrone was actually a ford fault and was rectified with the 18106 strategy
pectel had their own fault but this was more complex as there is more than one p8 ecu
there's was a processor timing synchronisation error that only affected certain p8 ecu's that ford had fitted
pectel had their own fault but this was more complex as there is more than one p8 ecu
there's was a processor timing synchronisation error that only affected certain p8 ecu's that ford had fitted
07-10-2008, 07:46 PM
#38
Testing the future
there may be more L8's in the ford world as the 4x4 sapph was the big seller, but the P8 is used in many things italian and is very common in certain circles (including lots of motorbikes)
07-10-2008, 08:03 PM
#39
the P8 has been completely reverse engineered and can be reconfigured to be live mappable by ordinary laptop by RP Lab
there may be more L8's in the ford world as the 4x4 sapph was the big seller, but the P8 is used in many things italian and is very common in certain circles (including lots of motorbikes)
there may be more L8's in the ford world as the 4x4 sapph was the big seller, but the P8 is used in many things italian and is very common in certain circles (including lots of motorbikes)