FAO PHIL M - zetec turbo dyno results?
08-11-2004, 01:44 PM
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FAO PHIL M - zetec turbo dyno results?
Phil,
Have you had the beast on the rollers yet?
Still after a dyno print out for a zetec turbo to help me work out a base VE table for my megasquirt.
Cheers,
DC.
Have you had the beast on the rollers yet?
Still after a dyno print out for a zetec turbo to help me work out a base VE table for my megasquirt.
Cheers,
DC.
08-11-2004, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Garage19
I thought it was all in the car and ready to run?
).
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08-11-2004, 03:32 PM
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No Div......the 2.1 zetec has been completed in 6months. Actual build took 3 days, with lots of testing and waiting for parts to be sourced/fabricated 
Will help sort you a VE table as soon as I can. Do you have yours running? Theres a program on the web to generate a very rough VE table, though I think its for NA engines more than anything....ill dig it out.
Will help sort you a VE table as soon as I can. Do you have yours running? Theres a program on the web to generate a very rough VE table, though I think its for NA engines more than anything....ill dig it out.
08-11-2004, 04:37 PM
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Phil,
I think it might be the one I'm lookin at, but you need power and torque @ rpm figures to input. I could guesstimate but lookin at an actual print out of a similar engine would be better.
Just been checking out the latest code for the megasquirt unit. It looks pukka... so many features. Launch control, traction control, boost control, mapable nitrous/water injection, knock control, multiple configurable maps..... and loads more!
I think it might be the one I'm lookin at, but you need power and torque @ rpm figures to input. I could guesstimate but lookin at an actual print out of a similar engine would be better.
Just been checking out the latest code for the megasquirt unit. It looks pukka... so many features. Launch control, traction control, boost control, mapable nitrous/water injection, knock control, multiple configurable maps..... and loads more!
08-11-2004, 05:16 PM
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@ all the tossers If you download the SECS S8 software, it has a demo "Greens" map for a cossie, and you can convert the fuel table into VE units, id try that for a base mate......you have a WB lambda sensor you can work from?
I know the MS has a "target" AFR table also, so you can enter those there and run it closed loop.
08-11-2004, 05:17 PM
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Phils car will be running this weekend if all goes to plan 
As for "predictive" tuning......
You tune an engine for what it needs at the time of mapping NOT what you think
it needs or what some computer program has calculated for you
There are FAR TOO MANY variables to take into account in order to
"calculate" fuel / ignition maps.
If it was possible, there would be NO need for rolling roads or dyno's.
Please put that book down, wake up and come on in to the real world !
As for "predictive" tuning......
You tune an engine for what it needs at the time of mapping NOT what you think
it needs or what some computer program has calculated for you
There are FAR TOO MANY variables to take into account in order to
"calculate" fuel / ignition maps.
If it was possible, there would be NO need for rolling roads or dyno's.
Please put that book down, wake up and come on in to the real world !
08-11-2004, 05:25 PM
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Sounds good to me Simon
Basicly mate, Garage19 has the same engine spec as me......and has MS engine management, and needs a "base map" so he can get his car running!!! Not for rnning the car on propperly, just a map to get his engine going. His fuel scale is in VE Units.
Fingers crossed we will have a "base map" good enough to make that engien spec drivable for low-load/rpm sites
Basicly mate, Garage19 has the same engine spec as me......and has MS engine management, and needs a "base map" so he can get his car running!!! Not for rnning the car on propperly, just a map to get his engine going. His fuel scale is in VE Units.
Fingers crossed we will have a "base map" good enough to make that engien spec drivable for low-load/rpm sites
08-11-2004, 05:29 PM
#16
DEYTUKURJERBS
So how WOULD you work out a base map if you didnt have one to go by normally?
Or can a mapper roughly work one out well enough to make the engine start?
I dont know how good it has to be to get the car to even run you see, and il be in this boat when my cars ready...
Or can a mapper roughly work one out well enough to make the engine start?
I dont know how good it has to be to get the car to even run you see, and il be in this boat when my cars ready...
08-11-2004, 05:36 PM
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Mapping does not need to be that accurate to get a car to start and idle.
As long as you have plenty of fuel and a spark near TDC it will run !
( Will probally stall when the plugs are fouled )
It takes experience to know what is exactly required but as I said above, tuning
is about what an engine needs at the time of mapping.
There are a few tuners who can pretty much predict what is required but they
have experience on similar engines and/or managment requirements.
There will ALWAYS be a need for adjustments of some kind even on an identical
engine already mapped and then duplicated.
As long as you have plenty of fuel and a spark near TDC it will run !
( Will probally stall when the plugs are fouled
)It takes experience to know what is exactly required but as I said above, tuning
is about what an engine needs at the time of mapping.
There are a few tuners who can pretty much predict what is required but they
have experience on similar engines and/or managment requirements.
There will ALWAYS be a need for adjustments of some kind even on an identical
engine already mapped and then duplicated.
09-11-2004, 08:38 AM
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* Rudey *,
He wants 5000 bhp but i have told him it wont be that much probally nearer 4000 bhp
In reality, Its a case of we will take what ever it gives ! I guess around 270-300 bhp.
He wants 5000 bhp but i have told him it wont be that much probally nearer 4000 bhp
In reality, Its a case of we will take what ever it gives ! I guess around 270-300 bhp.
09-11-2004, 01:33 PM
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Just put it in WB-closed loop and it'll nearly tune itself (datalog and correct accordingly using one of the tuning tools). Good values for the target AFR map are:
14.7 at idle region
15.5 below 80 kPa
14.0 from 80 kPa to 120 kPa
13.0 till 180 kPA
12.0 till 250 kPa
14.7 at idle region
15.5 below 80 kPa
14.0 from 80 kPa to 120 kPa
13.0 till 180 kPA
12.0 till 250 kPa
09-11-2004, 05:23 PM
#24
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Originally Posted by SECS
There are FAR TOO MANY variables to take into account in order to
"calculate" fuel / ignition maps.
If it was possible, there would be NO need for rolling roads or dyno's.
As Phil says, I just want to knock up a base map so that I can start her up and safely reach as many load sites as possible to start tuning.
A big thanks to Phil and Jesse for all their input so far.
DC
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