Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

If building a track toy would you rather have

A, A good power car ( say340/350 bhp ) that was reliable and looked good , ie, nice paint etc , well speced suspension etc etc

or

B, bit of a shitter that was 400/450 bhp , possible a little less reliable

Started my new 3 door today and dont know which wat to go

I do like my cars to look good and at the same time be reliable tho

whats your choice ??

COMEDY DAN

Less bhp for me and more money spent on chassis, brakes and suspension.

Munch

A please sir!

Tangodeltasierra3

Looks more important i think.

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

3 replies and you all choose the same as me

Rhys

Less power and spec suspension better imo. Will prob be quicker on track and more reliable.

Stu.H

an extra 50bhp for it to be unreliable?

Bit of a no brainer really

plynchy

Shitter. Thats what I use.

GARETH T

brakes and suspension is EVERYTHING on the track

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Seems there are more people that think the way i do ,, there is more to cossies than just bhp

I will build it as usuall then ,,looks , good sus and reliable power

All i need now is to learn to drive

Anonymous

Why are the looks and reliability linked?

I would go for 400bhp and spend the time you were going to spend painting the other one and polishing it every week etc keeping on top of the maintainance on the more powerful one.


For me the order of importance would be:
Handling
Brakes
Reliability
Power
Looks

Richie.

iTrader: (5)

Thats the problem Paul its so easy to upgrade everything else

rstoughy

iTrader: (5)

Deffo A Paul

Power is nothing without control now where the hell have i heard that before

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

how many times av u said that u cant beat a stage 3 cossie on as track




you have the answer monkey boy

Stavros

everyone does it with cossies, power power power and dont even use decent tyres and proper diff, never mind geometry etc.

and thats why they a bit shit apart from in a dead straight line, in the dry, from a rolling start.

dont worry about the engine, stg3 is jus fine, stg3, a decent diff, good tyres, and itd be awesome

SteveB

iTrader: (3)

My old Fiesta RS1800 was 135bhp but handled like a go cart thats the only reason it pushed Stg3 Cossies around on the tight sections of tracks.... straight line it got wasted then it started all over agian on the corners!!!!
No point having 450bhp if the suspension/brakes can only just handle 250bhp


Steve

fezzajsy

iTrader: (9)

A.. deffo for me

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Chip

i always thought you were a clever fella

Your list states
1,handling
2,brakes
3,reliability
4,power
5, looks

I would have thought
Reliability must be number 1,

My list would be

1, reliability
2,handeling
3, brakes
4, power
5,looks

No point in having any of the above if it isnt reliable , no point having a fast car that stops well handels superb looks stunning if it only does half a lap and breaks down

I know you dont bother much for looks either ( i have seen your cars ) But to me it is a very big part of things

1, i am a painter by trade , so its in my blood
2, my cars are an advert for my business
3, i have a lot of pride in everything i do , not just under the bonnet

Plus i am a secret bufty

cossiecrew

go with lower bhp and nice looks or you could just go mental bhp and let me drive then youd get the good looks aswell

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

Paul,
It is SO important to get the chassis right, and good handling doesn't mean super-stiff either .

I think it is amazing how many people just get the handling SO wrong on the Cossies, and then as Steve says, this perpetuates the myth that Cossies are shit on track.

On ROAD tyres, mine out handles and out-grips an Evo VIII FQ340 (tuned to 370bhp) on CUT SLICKS (Dunlop D01Js)! And I have driven them back to back at the Ring to confirm this (thanks Andy R ) .



Any help or advice you need, then it would be my pleasure . I agree with your idea, as the 380lb ft you get with a good 350bhp conversion, is more than enough to have fun with in a 2wd car .

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

I prefer the way a car handles , But how reliable is a track car.. If you abuse it everytime it gets used...


I may only be going stage one in mine at the moment, As it'll have the chassis to do anything

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Mike

I 100% agree with handeling being top of the list ,,BUT behind reliability

as said its no good going round a track fast and smooth but for half a lap

Part of building the car reliable tho is shurly building it correctly and with the right parts anyway . so realy the two go hand in hand

I will take you up on your offer when i am ready for the suspension and give you a call for some advice ,

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

Well I have driven my car to every track day and back again, so if built right, NO PROBLEM WHAT-SO-EVER.

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Mike

My point exactly

Reliability comes hand in hand with all the listed factors if we think about it ,Other than looks

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

I was thinking of your car when I posted..


How often do you check it over?

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

Paul,
To make my car reliable, I built everything to be run at 75-85% or less of it's capabilities....

For example:
Turbo capable of 520bhp, but run at 480bhp.
Fuel system capable of 550bhp, but run at 480bhp
Transmission capable of 700bhp+ (without launching), but run at 480bhp
Biggest brakes physically able of fitting behind wheels
Expensive (by comparison to most) suspension tuned to the car.

etc etc.

The only failures I have had have been drive shaft related, due to the excessive front camber I now run on the front. I have now remedied this as well with longer drive-shafts.

I would suggest that if you want reliability, so over engineer everything on the car in the same way .

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

He doesnt ,,he gets his bitch to do it

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Mike

I always go over the top with my cars

I fit the best i can afford even tho it is over the top , i have always been let down with silly issues like , amal valves , etc never anything serious , just the shitty things that spoil your day .

I sort of built to your theory anyway , as with the sweedish i buy from you , no real powewr gain just better more even air flow , so must be better than std ,,also you can get you fat arms and hands in better to work ont the thing

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

It gets oil, plugs, pads and tyres when-ever I feel it needs them. Other than that it only gets checked over if I perceive there to be an issue with something, or an issue (such as the drive-shaft problem), is brought to light.

For example, I will be fitting an air to air oil cooler on the new engine, as that issue is still causing me concern, with water temps in excess of 110°C on 30°C ambient days (not a BIG issue as such, as the coolant is safe to 129°C before it boils due to the pressure the cooling system runs at), just to remove another item from the water system (the turbo has already been removed from the water system). Just because I want to see 100°C max for no loss in engine power.

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

Mike, In my S2 I was planning of running a stage 3 set-up.. But not running it at its full potential?! But I do want 300 at the rear wheels!

(300 is all I want at the wheel power)

Possible?!


LOL!

R5FORD

iTrader: (1)

deffo A

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

Given your target weight and the fact that you will probably struggle with decent size wheels / tyres, if it was my car, I would be trying it at stage 1 first, developing the handling to suit the car and only THEN going for an increase (if I felt it was warranted). It's not some big heavy Sapphire, so why do you feel the need for 300bhp ATW . It would probably make it undriveable (as in wheel-spinning everywhere - fun, but not quick).

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

After being in a few 300bhp rst's (FWD) I dont see why 300 at the rear wont be an issue? Weight will be about 900/950kg

wheels will be 16's, I have no inner arch on front or back, So im ok for any width on the back

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

You said at the wheels, which would equate to 350-380ish at the fly, I doubt you have been in any RSTs with that .

I have been in Christian's at 300-320bhp @ fly, and IMO, that was undriveable until 4th / 5th. Exciting, but the power was not going anywhere other than up in smoke until the higher gears .

As I said, I'm quite methodical and think that chasing numbers is completely pointless . It's easier to go forwards and develop the car bit by bit, than jumping in at the deep end and having to adapt things around what you have ended up with.

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

Good point

This is where im stuck , And like you say, I'll have to wait until its running..

Anonymous

I am a clever chap, clearly more so than you from how you have read my reply

You are saying that list like its binary, that the items on it will either be 0 or 1, thats a nonsense.

I dont care if a trackday car isnt 100% reliable, capable of 330D BMW style trips across the globe and back.
Of course i wouldnt want a car that is permenantly giving problems and wont start when you turn the key, but on a trackday car it wouldnt bother me if there was the occasional niggle with it, well not as much as it would if the brakes didnt work for example!

A trackday car needs to be reliable 95%+ of the time in my opinion, its brakes need to work every fucking time though, lol

If i did 20 trackdays and i had some mechanical problems at one of them, i would be perfectly happy with that situation.

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Chip your replies make me giggle so much

you always turn every post into some serious Fact finding mission to which you have all the logical answers

A simple post turned into a major issue

im shure you will have some sarcastic reply

Anyway ,,A, it is then ,,350 bhp , with good looks , handeling , and reliability, oh and brakes