Canada1

I am looking for a little help regarding a timing map for my 1.9turbo engine.
Camshaft has almost identical opening and closing events to Newman solid cam. (276 duration .440" lift)
Compression Ratio 8.0:1
93 octane fuel
I know that the cvh combustion chamber is not the greatest as far a efficient combustion.

I would like to see a few examples of ignition timing maps.
I have seen other engine examples where maximum timing was only 18 degrees at 15 psi boost. This seems like a recipe for very high exhaust temperatures.

any MS tables?
The table used for a Haltech is similar - it is a 24 x 24 map load and rpm on axis

Karlos?
Others?

Cheers

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Here's mine...



Load is in kPa, 1psi = 6.8kPa.

18deg is not that retarded for 15psi, assuming your talking about the 6-7000rpm load sites?

G2RSR

interesting i want to learn about ignition tables i know about afr, so what does the numbers mean at the side going from 25.0 to 280.0 ?

BRAM

iTrader: (1)

I would like to learn about this aswell.

My brother has just bought haltech for his rs turbo.

Canada1

Hello Karlos

Thank you for your timing map.
What compression ratio does your engine have? I seem to remember it was less than 8:1?
It looks like your map shows 20 to 23 degrees advance between 4000 and 7000 rpm at 15 psi boost.
Have you monitored exhaust gas temperatures? Do you have a knock sensor?
Did you have to take any timing out at the engine torque peak rpm?
I have heard that is where an engine is very sensitive to ignition timing.

Cheers

Perry

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

Pretty sure Karlos is running standard CR Perry, IMO peak load is always timing critical.

Rob,

chaffe

another point is the base timing of your engine may have a few degrees variation, thus making the exact timing numbers non transferable

chaffe

look on msefi homepage

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

MAP
Slightly higher than stock CR (8.5:1) as I've had the head skimmed twice and the block decked too.
No EGT monitor, no knock sensor (mapped with Det Cans).
I gradually increased timing to the point of Det and then pulled back a couple of degree's, have no way of mapping to MBT as I dont have a Dyno.
Yup!
Peak VE is where is where you will get Det and so timing is critical, unless you have a massive boost spike early in the revs of course lol
You can see where peak VE is by your fuelling table, where it needs the most fuel.
Shouldnt be, not if you have set it correctly.
But it's still always a good idea if you are going to rob my table (or anyones) to retard 5 or so degrees before you start mapping anyway, far too many variables between engines!

chaffe

differences in sensor positions, flywheel castings, crank boltholes can all ad up to a degree or two, as you said karlos, use this map as a guide to work from only, anyone got any v6 turbo ignition maps please lol

Canada1

Many thanks all!

I do appreciate all the help.
Camshaft choice will also have an impact on ignition mapping.
Karlos, do you have the Newman (276 degree) solid lifter camshaft?
I will start with a map that is very similar to yours, probably start with a degree or 2
less advance to start with.

Cheers

Perry

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Yes mate I have the only cam shaft that Newman do for the CVH RST.
Oh very important to note!!! I mapped on 99RON fuel, on 97RON I had to pull out 4 degree's of timing to stop Det, so on 93RON your going to have to pull out even more! I would start with at least 8 degrees retarded from my map maybe even 10 to be safe, then work forward.

chaffe

lol, i read that at the begining of the post then forgot all about it! 93 ron is like parafin

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

The octane rating over there is different to ours guys.

For articles relating to mapping, EGT, AFR etc see here:
http://www.motorsport-developments.co.uk/stus.html

chaffe

not the same scale? i would think you would struggle to stop a turbo engine pinking with our equivelent 93 ron

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Oh, I didnt know that either!
How does it compare?

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Just had a quick read up and if he's talking about 93 AKI,PON or RdON fuel then thats ok as it's the same as our 99RON over here, if of course it is 93RON then what I said above still applies.

Canada1

Hi Karlos,

The best fuel I can get here is 93 AKI.
I believe that is very sililar to your 99RON.

Cheers

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Yes it is, thats fine then, but IMO retard at least 5 degrees from my map and work from there.

project rs

just had a look at mine for you and i've got 16 degrees at 320kpa's and at 100kpa as boost starts to build i run around 38 degrees dropping to the 16 but thats with a t34 on a comp of around 7.8 and my egt's never go over 800 degrees c on boost and afr never goes bellow 11.5 on full boost i don't know how to put up full table and i've broken my camera phone but if i figure a way to get it on here i will do

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

Hiya project, hows it going mate? hit the print screen button (top right of you keyboard) open paint and hit paste, save it and wang the picture on photo bucket.

Rob,

Canada1

Hello Project RS,

I would love to see your timing map.

I also assume that everyone checks timing marks on the crankshaft pulleys
to verify TDC positioning. And verifying that an ignition map set to 36 degrees advance
at 3500 rpm does exactly that.

Cheers

Perry

Its starting to get cold here

project rs

thanks rob hope this works

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Thats quite a bit more advanced than mine midrange, I guess because of your lower compression ratio, although saying that I have not tried that much advance to see if I get Det, might be worth a play!
Do you know why your overrun at 0 deg, do you have a massive fuel cut?

chaffe

think it makes it pop and bang on overun

project rs

as above karlos makes it pop and bang when ever you lift of the throttle and i also run the fuel saving on the ecu so it also cuts fuel when i'm slowing down or off the throttle