Hi guys does the st170 head fit into a blacktop block? As people say they are one of the better heads to use for zetec turbo. Am I right or is it better to stay with the blacktop head??? Any help welcome

 

 

thanks mate. I'm looking around the 400 mark. But with the option to go more later on

 

 

 

thanks Paul. I did read your other post on the chi block one too. Would you go for the 170 head if you where doing a full build?

 

 

il be going for eagle rods je pistons full arp maby m12 conversion. Just trying to decide on the head work and opposing components. Exhaust is going to place turbo over gearbox.and equal length. Inlet will try and think of maby get one made

 

Could you please tell me about the CR you've got?
I'm doing a similar job, but i've got myself a 1.8 block bored to better suit for my pistons (84.75mm bore in result) as the original block got a nasty step in it's cylinders.
The head (black top 2.0) and block were faced down a bit and i was surprised i've got piston-deck clearance of positive 0.55mm even though it should be a negative 0.46 or even 0.65. May it be 1.8 blocks are a tad taller then 2.0s?
Head chamber i've measured was 43cc and valve reliefs were ~1cc for a piston.
Now i find myself in a crucial situation as i'd be fine with a 1.8 gasket (that is probably impossible to find here) and 9.6 CR or screwed with a 10+ CR on a thinner gasket. This won't allow me to really boost it on local petrol so i'm looking for any info, please advice me

 

That's to many variables.
The 1.8mm gasket is no longer available from Ford. There is a 1.78mm gasket made by Cometic but it's for an over bore so there isn't a lot of meat left between bores.

What power are you hoping to make ? Higher Cr and low octane fuel really will limit this no matter how much you spend on it or how you map it.

Is it a road car or a race car. Can you use methanol ? What octane is the fuel ? What pistons ? What rods ? What engine management ?

 

I'll call 250 crank hp a success, but 280+ would be great. Turbo is Garrett 2860 and ecu is standalone January 5.1. It's not widely known worldwide but it's basically a ln old motronic hardware and a very nice software to control it.
It's a road car on a regular gas. St170 conrods and pistons.

 

forged or cast pistons an rods?

 

Stock st items. We have no tuned zetecs or parts for them here. I've put conrod arp bolts in though. Everything else is expensive and has to be custom made.

 

forged rods and pistons are about 1000 pounds here so I dont know what the rate would be for you. Ars you using a decomp plate then?

 

1000 Pounds is a lot of money here. More than my whole sierra would sell for, actually.
No, I don't use a plate and that's why I'm worried.
Also I've found some non-original head gaskets listed as 1.8mm, but I suppose they'd be more like 1.5 mm installed/squished.

 

when turboing a none turbo engine you need to lower cr. So when not using turbo pistons you will need a decompression plate and 2 head gaskets. Another slightly cheaper way would be to find a set of mk1 focus rs pistons and rods

 

The silvertop gasket is 1.8mm give or take.

So you have over bored a 1.8 to take st pistons and rods but have gained 1mm in deck hight and the st head will ad a bit.

What octane is the fuel ?

Turbo may be a touch large for the power.

At 9.6:1 I would think you will have to be very careful with mapping to avoid det but it does not sound out of the question.

I would love to know how you get on

 

That's the great news i've been hoping to hear! But how thin is it compressed?

I'm still unsure where this 1mm came from. I hope it's really the block height and not crankshaft bolts untight
Sadly, i couldn't find a worthy ST head. They all are busted by now out here... I've thrown away one with wasted cam surfaces and another one i have is fitted with cracks. So i use a blacktop head, measured ~43 cc's in it:

a bit skimmed black top zetec head volume measured ~43cc

1.8 blacktop block a bit skimmed and bored to accept st170 pistons.


Regular. It's 95 here but another scale. It's not that bad, but it's worse then worldwide 91-92 AFAIK. We also have 98 and 100 here but these are less common and they wouldn't give me a lot of gains i believe. I'd miss 20 hp for more stable gas TBH.

I'm not quite capable to say something about but i have 2 hot sides: 21u (0.46) and Ор6 (0.58). If i'm correct, they'd allow for ~250 and ~300hp before shutting the flow. However i'm really stretching my knowledge here, can't say anything apart from this.



I will not map it myself for sure. Gotta a get some dyno time. Oh i can feel how scared i'll be of that day.

Well, i really hope i'd get a good engine/car. Nobody knows a duck about fast ford phenomenon here and i fell like i need to represent it here.

 

That's the great news i've been hoping to hear! But how thin is it compressed?

I'm still unsure where this 1mm came from. I hope it's really the block height and not crankshaft bolts untight
Sadly, i couldn't find a worthy ST head. They all are busted by now out here... I've thrown away one with wasted cam surfaces and another one i have is fitted with cracks. So i use a blacktop head, measured ~43 cc's in it:

a bit skimmed black top zetec head volume measured ~43cc

1.8 blacktop block a bit skimmed and bored to accept st170 pistons.


Regular. It's 95 here but another scale. It's not that bad, but it's worse then worldwide 91-92 AFAIK. We also have 98 and 100 here but these are less common and they wouldn't give me a lot of gains i believe. I'd miss 20 hp for more stable gas TBH.

I'm not quite capable to say something about but i have 2 hot sides: 21u (0.46) and Ор6 (0.58). If i'm correct, they'd allow for ~250 and ~300hp before shutting the flow. However i'm really stretching my knowledge here, can't say anything apart from this.



I will not map it myself for sure. Gotta a get some dyno time. Oh i can feel how scared i'll be of that day.

Well, i really hope i'd get a good engine/car. Nobody knows a duck about fast ford phenomenon here and i fell like i need to represent it here.

 

That's the great news i've been hoping to hear! But how thin is it compressed?

I'm still unsure where this 1mm came from. I hope it's really the block height and not crankshaft bolts untight
Sadly, i couldn't find a worthy ST head. They all are busted by now out here... I've thrown away one with wasted cam surfaces and another one i have is fitted with cracks. So i use a blacktop head, measured ~43 cc's in it:

Regular. It's 95 here but another scale. It's not that bad, but it's worse then worldwide 91-92 AFAIK. We also have 98 and 100 here but these are less common and they wouldn't give me a lot of gains i believe. I'd miss 20 hp for more stable gas TBH.

I'm not quite capable to say something about but i have 2 hot sides: 21u (0.46) and Ор6 (0.58). If i'm correct, they'd allow for ~250 and ~300hp before shutting the flow. However i'm really stretching my knowledge here, can't say anything apart from this.

I will not map it myself for sure. Gotta a get some dyno time. Oh i can feel how scared i'll be of that day.

Well, i really hope i'd get a good engine/car. Nobody knows a duck about fast ford phenomenon here and i fell like i need to represent it here.

 

For some reason the forum didn't put my post in but i'll try again. The 3rd or even 4th time lol

This is great. What size is it compressed?
Would you recommend bothering ARP bolts/switching to studs or just stock items will do?

Apparently the block is taller on 1.8. I have shim-measured it again and the clearance is 0.6mm. I've also just found out the piston's got a bit of an inward dome- that's even better for me! Did you have any luck measuring it's volume? I'd guess it's not much at about 1 additional cubic centimeter but even this 1 c^3 really help in my case!



I'd hope to use "regular" which is 95 octane here, but i believe it's not the same scale worldwide, may be it'd cope with 91-92 worldly-known octanes or something. This one is the most stable here though. 98 and 100 grades are also available but quality may vary and actually i don't think these would give a lot more timing advance for the hassle. I think i'd trade ~20hp off for less chance getting bad fuel and ease of finding a pump.

Sorry i'm totally unconfident in turbos. The only thing i know is it's from some nissan (probable VQ or VG) and i've got to hot housings: 21u (0,46) and op6 (0.58). Later one is now bolted in. Am i good?

I'm 100% not gonna map a boosted setup myself. I'll have some dyno time and a man with an idea how to map cars do it

Thanks, i'm really watching forward this as it's my first engine build (although not fully done by myself) and also this might be the only tuned zetec in this huge country, not to mention there's about 5 zetec powered sierras and most of them got running with my build advices after i've got mine going