havv

hi all, i am in desperate need for help.

i have a 89 escort, which has a rs 1.6T engine replaced form a 1.3.

when i bought the car it had a slight oil leak, from the sump gasket. i drove it home, as i got home the ticking from lack of oil got louder. i ended up pushing the car beacsue i was scared to drive with such low oil. but i think i may have just drivin it to far!

i changed the gasket, and 2.5liters of oil came out, which made me think there must have been enough for the engine to run, as the 1.6Ts need 3.5 litres aparentlly.

so once changed, i started up the car, (which had to be jump started as i have a completly dead battery now) and all sounded well, the ticking dissapeared as the oil set through the engine.

however, as i reved it up to about 3000, a ticking/knocking sound came from the engine, i have been told this could be explosions in the engine from bad timing???

i revved it a little higher and the car backfired quite loudly, the engine dipped in revs majorly, and i heard a whistle sound from the engine. kinda sounded like the dump valve, but im sure it wasnt. i did it again, and the radiator blew, a small hole appeared and spray of coolant came out. (i dont think the radiator has been upgraded to a 1.6T from the 1.3, if thers any differance).

as i revved it btw, the battery light came brighter and brighter. so i know i need a new battery, the question i really need to know is what is making those explosions/knockings.

could it be the timing? sparks? lack of coolant and right radiator, just a dead battery which is not providing the right current to the ignition?? i really dont know!

any help would be MOST aprecialted, i really dont want to spend pointlless money if the eingine has blown or something :S

thanks in advance! HAv.

antony215

Is it ticking or knocking your getting because if it's ticking then it may just be the tappets which is a fairly easy job to do if it's knocking then it may be bottom end and thats means the engine has to come out for a rebuild

escrst

if it runs that bad and you havent got a clue about these problems best to take it to someone that knows. if it back fires when you rev it and there is a ticking noise at the same time the cam belt could be a tooth out but all in all it dont sound good

havv

well i dont really know. how can i tell if its a ticking or knocking. it sounds like knocking... i think. like something is loose. ive been told its explosions??

ive also read a lot in the forums that it could be the dissy??

if the bottom end was out, would the engine even run?

havv

in fact, a good way to describe it would be that it sounds like a really loud wastegate. but at low revs(3000rpm).

antony215

The dizzy could make it backfire if it's on it way out it aint got a cable tie round it by any chance has it?? or as said if the timing is out that will do it too or if the spark plug gaps are wrong

It will still start and drive if the bottom end is gone but it will knock it's nuts off

Is the noise coming from the bottom of the engine or the top(if you can tell)

escrst

you need to know if its knocking or ticking. it could be so many things without looking at the car its hard to do diagnostics over a web forum

havv

right, it seems as though the knocking (which i am pretty sure it is) is coming from the top. like underneath the rocker cover. it also feels like it is, when i put my hand there, i felt a kind of knocking. it was faint, but syncronized with the knocking sound.

however, i cant be 100% sure. is there a way to check properly if its from top or bottom? anything i can listen for?? id say 90% its from there. it defintly sounds like, and feels like.


i didnt see a cable tie anywhere aroud the dissy. i bought the car from portsmouth, you may have seen it around antony215, will put pics up soon.



another question, can a 1.3 radiator be used on a 1.6 RST.? i just inspected my radiator, and it has had repairs done to it before, maybe 6 or seven times! think it could be related?

antony215

You could do a compression test on it that may tell you if the bottom end is gone but as escrst said it's hard to tell what it is without hearing it my self. As for the radiator if it's a series 1 engine thats been put in there then i think you can use a rad from a 1.3 if it's a series 2 engine then the turbo on it will be water cooled so you need a series 2 rad. If it's a series 2 rad it will have a small pipe coming out of the lefthand side as you look at the engine from the front of the car.

havv

i have just been told by a mechnic that it could just be the sump and the sump gasket. there is a big oil leak, coming from there. he says that if air is getting drawn in with the oil, the oil isnot doing its job as it should be air tight. also found one bolt missing form the sump. think it could be the problem? or just another mechanice trying to rip me off?

antony215

I cant see that making it knock (if thats what it is doing) but if it's leaking then id get it fixed anyway but there a pain in the ass to do

havv

im trying to think of a way to describe the sound. thinkning about it, you know the rattle you get when your in a too low gear for the speed and you try to accelerate but just get a jingle from the engine, it sounds like that and kinda like a wastegate.

if i think about it like this, it does relate back to the sump;

i bought the car, it was fine, with a small oil leak from the gasket. nothing to major. drove it home at about 80mph for an hour or so, as i got close to home i heard a loud ticking (the low oil ticking you get) so i got out, and there was defintly a major oil leak. i must have destroyed the gasket or the sump. or both. so i changed the gasket, but it was a diy job, still a bolt missing, and i pobably didnt get it perfect, and yea they are hard! filled with oil, jump started the car, and all was good. reved it and i heard this knocking noise from underneath the rocker cover! the only think changed is the sump gasket, so that must be the problem right? i would have head or felt something else if the bottom end was going??

antony215

Does it sound like a clock ticking realy fast???

havv

no, its a non consistant knock. but only starts around 3000revs. below its perfectly fine.

antony215

Well it sounds like the bottom end to me maybe because you drove it with little/no oil in. I had an orion that the bottom end went in and it was fine ticking over as soon as you reved or tryed to drive it it knocked its nuts off i took the sump off and had a look and the shells were fucked and that was down to driving it with hardly any oil in

SafeChav

Being perfectly honest, if you bought a car with an oil leak, chances are the car was put up for sale because of this.

2.5 litres of oil isn't ideal but, like for example when i bought my gold turbo orion, after a couple of weeks my mate said u should check the oil, there was no cause for concern, just out of good practice.

I said to him "nah she used to look after this car it will be fine", in the end i thought fuck it, may aswell check it, DIDNT EVEN REGISTER ON THE FUCKING DIPSTICK The engine ran for ages after though! Its now in cabriolet although i rebuilt it for piece of mind!

You've got to run them seriously low before things get that bad! It was probably on its way out when u bought it..........

havv

ok im going to have to accept that the bottom end has gone

so i found a guy who says that the ford fiest rs turbo h reg, is the exact same engine as the ford escort g reg (mine) and is willing to sell me the bottom end for £150, or the whole engine for £200. is he talking out his ass? or is it something i should go through with.

ethe engine is out of the car, so how can i see iff the bottom end / engoine is fine. ?

antony215

If you cant hear the engine running in the car then i wouldn't bother buying it mate as you might end up buying another fucked one. Try and find one that you can here running. If your not to clued up on the cars have it checked over by a mechanic as it migh not need a bottom end but the way you have described it thats what it sounds like to me.

SafeChav

As said second hand engines are pretty touch and go, but a fiesta engine is the same thing, and will make your life easier should you decide you want to run EFI int he future.

Im sure if you removed your engine and stripped it back to the block with pistons/rods/crank and gave it to an engine shop it would'nt cost much to have it reconditioned, total piece of mind then aswell

havv

alright, i tok it to a mechanic, he said that its defitly not the bottom end!!

he said the noise would be consistant through all the revs if it was the bottom, and it would not idle steadily, which it does.

the noise was coming from underneth the rocker cover, so they are going to take it apart, and just tell me whats wrong. the think it is the tappets, but they will investigate tomroow morning at 8am! they say in one hour £60, they will tell me my problem. if its in the top end of the engine, which sounds like just one side, its only a limited amount of options it could be... so i will keep all posted!!

thanks for the help so far!!

SafeChav

Thats a bit of relief then!

If its the top end you want to buy yourself a nice new camshaft kit, and whatever else it needs if anything else is broken

antony215

So it's not a knocking noise as you said it must be a tapping noise if they are saying it's coming from under the rocker cover then it can only be a fucked cam/tappets realy which is alot less agro/money than to replace than a bottom end

havv

more news... all good so far!

took the car to the garage today, they took off the rocker cover, and found two off the tappets (cam followers) were pushed all the way out and that was what was rattling!

managed to find a company that still supplies the tappets ( only 1 out of 6 major stores have them now! so they are getting very very rare), and they are getting fitted on now. i decided to replace all of them, which makes more sense as the others could go at any time if two already had.

total cost.. £60 hours labour just cheking what the probelm was, £80 for 8 cam followers, and another £60 for the fitting. total bang on £200, which is a LOT better than losing a car

the car should be done within a couple of hours, so ill get back to you all to let you know if that was the only problem. the only thing im worried about is the backfiring and the wierd noise just before the revs dropped. im hoping its related to the cam followers, but i dont really know...

SafeChav

£80 for followers

And what brand were the followers, there is one particular type i have seen in numeroous engines, and they always fall to pieces

Glad its nothing to serious though

havv

ok. got followers in. that tapping went. now its easy to hear that there were two noises. the bottom end has officially gone! i wish i could show how pissed off lol. i need a bottom end, if anyone has one, please let me know.

base190380

hello, i once had a car go the same way. it was the bottom end that was buggered and the big end bearings went. when idling there was nothing to be heard, although as soon as you got it up to just around 2000 revs upwards there was a loud metalic knocking noise throughout the revs. If it sounds the same as this then most likley big ends are worn

havv

yea sounds like big ends. im just going to replace the bottom end, thats pretty much a new engine as i have fixed evrything else! should have a nice running car after this. Better do! im going back to the guy who wold me the car to see what he has to say for himself!

antony215

Thats a bit of shit news mate like i said before try and get a bottom end out of a car that you can here it running before it comes out

SafeChav

havv

yea prretty shit ey! thing is, im a bit confused. it the bottom end was gone, if a piston was broken or loose, would the engine even run? also, i have a 31 actuator, and am running at 8psi. is that too much for the eninge?

ive got 2 options, recondition the whole engine, so itl be prettly much fresh, (£1200, which inscluedes everything) and when it comes to sell it, ill have hopefully get a nice amount of money for it.

or

find a bottom end, and pray that that will fix it (bottom end around £200, labour £250 = £600 cos theyl try n scam me one way or other.. )

what should i doo!!! i do have £1200, but would it be worth it?

antony215

Dont think a piston is broken it's probably the big ends gone

No a more or less standard engine will take more than that if the timing and fueling are set right

If you can afford to rebuild it then thats what i would do as then you have more or less a brand new engine and it will make a difference when you come to sell the car if it's all looked after

SafeChav

£1200 is a lot of money to rebuild an engine IMO

antony215

I agree but he's got to pay someone else to do it thats where all the money is going

SafeChav

hmmmmmmm

I paid someone else to do mine, cost me £200! I supplied the pistons and valves, think that was a VERY good price in hind sight

antony215

Yeah but was that a mate/someone you know?? £200 to rebuild an engine is a good price. If he could do it him self or get a mate to do it he could knock a fair bit off that amount (obviously depending on what parts are used)

SafeChav

Brother in law had someone he knows in Birmingham do it, he did the full works on it aswell!

havv

thought id just do an update on my car!

Decided to go for the full rebuild. its been a month now and they are just finishing up, brakes are getting replaced, but they are having a very hard time finding a rad. They are getting very very rare. Im not even sure i need one, it looks like the 1 i have had has been patched up many times, about 6 mayby, and the leak i had was very very minor, it was litterally spraying a very thin mist of coolant out. i think i might just repait that with that loctite stuff on ebay or equvilant? any views?

So i have been told that the crankshaft was hammered. Firsly, one of the 4 holes had been complelty blocked up alloing no oil into that part, which could have caused it to sieze up if i drove it anymore... and the bearings were the wrong type and put in the wrong way...if that makes ANY sense..

It was basically the bottom end, which is what a lot of people had said.. thanks for that! anyway the total bill came to £1400! but igot a new clutch, grooved and drilled brakes, a full engine respray and obviously a fresh rebuild. Ripped off... yea, but i think itl be worth it in the end. The rest of the car is in prestine codition, except the dash, which might need replacing, so i think i can make some profit on this.

Will take some pics, and show you just for anyone who may have the same problem!

Thanks all!

SafeChav

Whoever built the bottom end wants a slap then if they fitted the shells the wrong way round and they were thre wrong ones

What was the holed blocked up with?

At least now you can have piece of mind.........

havv

the hole was blocked up with heated metal! it literally welded the hole shut. the guy doesnt need to be slapped, he needs to be fired as a mechanic and knocked out!

yea piece of mind ... i think i should get the car tuned, now that its had a rebuild. think thats a good idea? or a waste? apparently it should be pushing 200bhp at 8psi.. and around 230is at 15.

also, i had a 5th injector directly on the charge carrier. is that safe or ridiculous. whats the verdict on 5th injectors in general??

SafeChav

get it set up if its meant to be a high power motor, but from the problems you've already had i would prepare for a bit of dissapointment when you get the actual power figure

5th injectors are fine nothing wrong with them