M4DRST "The Trolley" - Ford Fair 2013
21-06-2011, 02:15 PM
#3724
Bulletin Board User
Luke do you have any comeback on that?
21-06-2011, 03:05 PM
#3726
10K+ Poster!!
Gutted for you though Luca, thats a fooking expensive item to have to replace.
21-06-2011, 03:27 PM
#3727
Bulletin Board User
Bit unfair, from what I gather its the sump that was at fault as it doesn't have the 2 required fixings, Vauxhalls to name another manufacturer don't use that setup on early setups and I've not known of a failure like Luca has had.
Gutted for you though Luca, thats a fooking expensive item to have to replace.
Gutted for you though Luca, thats a fooking expensive item to have to replace.
If I'm paying money for a service then I would expect a decent level of understanding - which there clearly wasn't here. It's all too common on the 'modifying' scene. I feel for Luke as surely he expects the same?
FYI Most manufacturers started to consider the sump an integral part of the engine assembly as CAE took over design in the 90's. There is a measurement called 'powertrain absolute bending', you can imagine what that means. It's very relevant on something as powerful as Luke's car.
21-06-2011, 03:56 PM
#3728
10K+ Poster!!
I totally agree with what your saying and it is a error on behalf of whoever decided to do it that way, that said I don't know the ins and outs of why it was done that way so I'm not going to start pointing the finger at anyone.
As for the last bit, yes makes perfect sense, would explain why Vauxhall changed their setup on the later engines/gearboxes.
As for the last bit, yes makes perfect sense, would explain why Vauxhall changed their setup on the later engines/gearboxes.
21-06-2011, 04:26 PM
#3729
Who's to say I didnt knock a tooth of in 1st off the line...The chipped tooth then smashed the gears which then smashed the casing which led to the issue - and wasn't even related to the missing mounts for the lower section on the sump.... We will never know! 
Either way it broke and needs replacing - all we can do going forward is to ramp up the strength of the casing and the lower casing would be advised upon looking into this further.
However im not here to point the finger at anyone and have no intentions to get all petty with companies over the breaking of a part which is down to my own usage!!! It worked fine before with 3 previous trips to Pod and track use.
I launched a car with a genuine 470 hp off the line like it should and gave it everything it had.... if it breaks thats my problem.
Either way it broke and needs replacing - all we can do going forward is to ramp up the strength of the casing and the lower casing would be advised upon looking into this further.
However im not here to point the finger at anyone and have no intentions to get all petty with companies over the breaking of a part which is down to my own usage!!! It worked fine before with 3 previous trips to Pod and track use.
I launched a car with a genuine 470 hp off the line like it should and gave it everything it had.... if it breaks thats my problem.
21-06-2011, 04:28 PM
#3730
10K+ Poster!!
Fair enough Luke.
Atleast if you need to source a new casing you can maybe spend some time polishing this one as the last one personally wasn't upto standard.
Atleast if you need to source a new casing you can maybe spend some time polishing this one as the last one personally wasn't upto standard.
21-06-2011, 04:32 PM
#3731
LOL - that was painted gloss black in keeping with the theme
Box is already sorted from the lovely cudley Will Pedlay
Sourced a sump now so plan to fit this eventually but hopefully have the new box in time for FORDFAIR.
Not sure i'll run at Pod IN ANGER again until my time gets beat - im scared now!
21-06-2011, 04:34 PM
#3732
10K+ Poster!!
Gloss black eh, hmm I hadn't thought of that for my mates bit of a change from the typical alloy wheel silver paint lol
Be good to see it at Ford Fair, weather permitting I'll be popping along that
bit of a change from the typical alloy wheel silver paint lolBe good to see it at Ford Fair, weather permitting I'll be popping along that
21-06-2011, 04:35 PM
#3733
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Who's to say I didnt knock a tooth of in 1st off the line...The chipped tooth then smashed the gears which then smashed the casing which led to the issue - and wasn't even related to the missing mounts for the lower section on the sump.... We will never know!
Either way it broke and needs replacing - all we can do going forward is to ramp up the strength of the casing and the lower casing would be advised upon looking into this further.
However im not here to point the finger at anyone and have no intentions to get all petty with companies over the breaking of a part which is down to my own usage!!! It worked fine before with 3 previous trips to Pod and track use.
I launched a car with a genuine 470 hp off the line like it should and gave it everything it had.... if it breaks thats my problem.
Either way it broke and needs replacing - all we can do going forward is to ramp up the strength of the casing and the lower casing would be advised upon looking into this further.
However im not here to point the finger at anyone and have no intentions to get all petty with companies over the breaking of a part which is down to my own usage!!! It worked fine before with 3 previous trips to Pod and track use.
I launched a car with a genuine 470 hp off the line like it should and gave it everything it had.... if it breaks thats my problem.
thats some wheel hop you had in 2nd and 3rd gear mate . how are you going get rid of it ?
you building a new st170 box or somthing else
21-06-2011, 04:44 PM
#3734
Box wise I really only have two options -
1- Fit standard st170 box back in.
2- Buy a standard st170 box and send to Elite for gearkit again.
(I've opted (2) for the replacement as I loved it while it lasted)
I cant and dont see the point in fitting an MTX due to having so much money tied up with a twin plate clutch / shafts etc..
The ratios in the mashed box were spot on for the car/power I just need to be a tad cautious when at POD as I proved to myself the bombproof box isn't that !
Fit the "correct sump" it may do the same again... knowone knows for sure. Just try what we feel may help going forward.
21-06-2011, 05:11 PM
#3735
Advanced PassionFord User
hi luca , sorry to hear about the box issues and well done for taking it on the chin , its all to easy to forget that your pushing the boundries of each component , even uprated to the limits , even ffd cossie boxes that cost Ł20,000 break . excursion you sound like you have a good engineering background and knowledge but in motorsport theres not many top firms that offer warranty. its fine if youve got time on your hands to look at every aspect of a detailed build , but the truth is most people who spend alot of cash simple want to drive them.
if nothing on your car break i will be amazed with 550 bhp running through the front wheels.
with the cash your spending , why dont you get mk motorsport to machine you a custom case out of t6/7 alloy with all the webbing holes being solid and not machined out , he very reasonable with his prices.
cheers paul
if nothing on your car break i will be amazed with 550 bhp running through the front wheels.
with the cash your spending , why dont you get mk motorsport to machine you a custom case out of t6/7 alloy with all the webbing holes being solid and not machined out , he very reasonable with his prices.
cheers paul
Last edited by zetaboostboy522bhp; 21-06-2011 at 05:13 PM.
21-06-2011, 05:54 PM
#3736
10K+ Poster!!
Are the front wishbones still rubber bushed ?
If so that will cause a lot of tramp, apart from that pressures maybe.
Getting a gearbox casing made in billet is madness, you need to eliminate the problem, I would imagine even a billet case could snap still as thats a fook load of shock going through everything.
If so that will cause a lot of tramp, apart from that pressures maybe.
Getting a gearbox casing made in billet is madness, you need to eliminate the problem, I would imagine even a billet case could snap still as thats a fook load of shock going through everything.
21-06-2011, 05:56 PM
#3737
hi luca , sorry to hear about the box issues and well done for taking it on the chin , its all to easy to forget that your pushing the boundries of each component , even uprated to the limits , even ffd cossie boxes that cost Ł20,000 break . excursion you sound like you have a good engineering background and knowledge but in motorsport theres not many top firms that offer warranty. its fine if youve got time on your hands to look at every aspect of a detailed build , but the truth is most people who spend alot of cash simple want to drive them.
if nothing on your car break i will be amazed with 550 bhp running through the front wheels.
with the cash your spending , why dont you get mk motorsport to machine you a custom case out of t6/7 alloy with all the webbing holes being solid and not machined out , he very reasonable with his prices.
cheers paul
if nothing on your car break i will be amazed with 550 bhp running through the front wheels.
with the cash your spending , why dont you get mk motorsport to machine you a custom case out of t6/7 alloy with all the webbing holes being solid and not machined out , he very reasonable with his prices.
cheers paul
21-06-2011, 06:01 PM
#3738
Are the front wishbones still rubber bushed ?
If so that will cause a lot of tramp, apart from that pressures maybe.
Getting a gearbox casing made in billet is madness, you need to eliminate the problem, I would imagine even a billet case could snap still as thats a fook load of shock going through everything.
If so that will cause a lot of tramp, apart from that pressures maybe.
Getting a gearbox casing made in billet is madness, you need to eliminate the problem, I would imagine even a billet case could snap still as thats a fook load of shock going through everything.
I'm thinking possibly tyres YES!
I need to start making notes on each run as at first we ran with around 15psi then dropped later in day as they were reading higher due to being hot. This in essence would give tramp like you say.
The gearbox casing would be a huge expense agreed - interested more on price to see what it would cost rather than actually going ahead.
Sump and sorting tramp are the only realistic options for prevention of the issue.
21-06-2011, 06:05 PM
#3739
10K+ Poster!!
When we ran my mates drag car we would monitor tyre pressures, tyre temperature and air temperature and keep a log of all of it.
Going from that and the time slip and ofcourse how it felt you could make improvements and keep the car consistant.
Its amazing on some tyres how little a burnout you need to get optimum pressure to get a cracking 60ft
Going from that and the time slip and ofcourse how it felt you could make improvements and keep the car consistant.
Its amazing on some tyres how little a burnout you need to get optimum pressure to get a cracking 60ft
21-06-2011, 06:08 PM
#3740
When we ran my mates drag car we would monitor tyre pressures, tyre temperature and air temperature and keep a log of all of it.
Going from that and the time slip and ofcourse how it felt you could make improvements and keep the car consistant.
Its amazing on some tyres how little a burnout you need to get optimum pressure to get a cracking 60ft
Going from that and the time slip and ofcourse how it felt you could make improvements and keep the car consistant.
Its amazing on some tyres how little a burnout you need to get optimum pressure to get a cracking 60ft
Might start to work and save me some damage
(il text you then
)
21-06-2011, 06:11 PM
#3741
10K+ Poster!!
A test and tune day would be a good move mate, get loads of runs in and a proper prepped track.
I'd quite happily take some readings for you and write them down, you can valet my astra for me
I'd quite happily take some readings for you and write them down, you can valet my astra for me
22-06-2011, 06:38 AM
#3744
1/4 mile beasty!!!!
Gutted to hear about the box mate :-(
I had some issues with tramp on my fiesta at the end of last year turned out my suspension the tramp was so harsh I cracked my windscreen and ripped a fist size hole in my craddle!
I set my suspension softer on the front and raised my back end slightly and I solved it!
not saying this is your problem but maybe worth a quick looking over
a friend of mine also had the same issue with his escort cosworth which also turned out to be suspension related !
I had some issues with tramp on my fiesta at the end of last year turned out my suspension the tramp was so harsh I cracked my windscreen and ripped a fist size hole in my craddle!
I set my suspension softer on the front and raised my back end slightly and I solved it!
not saying this is your problem but maybe worth a quick looking over
a friend of mine also had the same issue with his escort cosworth which also turned out to be suspension related !
22-06-2011, 09:07 PM
#3746
Never give in!
Gutted to hear about the box mate :-(
I had some issues with tramp on my fiesta at the end of last year turned out my suspension the tramp was so harsh I cracked my windscreen and ripped a fist size hole in my craddle!
I set my suspension softer on the front and raised my back end slightly and I solved it!
not saying this is your problem but maybe worth a quick looking over
a friend of mine also had the same issue with his escort cosworth which also turned out to be suspension related !
I had some issues with tramp on my fiesta at the end of last year turned out my suspension the tramp was so harsh I cracked my windscreen and ripped a fist size hole in my craddle!
I set my suspension softer on the front and raised my back end slightly and I solved it!
not saying this is your problem but maybe worth a quick looking over
a friend of mine also had the same issue with his escort cosworth which also turned out to be suspension related !
26-07-2011, 10:05 AM
#3759
Ben
26-07-2011, 10:14 AM
#3760
It will be fine once re-fitted again.
It has taken the abuse of circa 50 drag runs without issue. Knowing the reason behind the break we can ensure this is ticked off the list and sorted.
Also I have custom made shafts which can withstand high HP, along with a clutch set up and flywheel so it would cost circa 6k to change myset up to a compairable Focus RS 5 speed box which then would not be favourable for a top speed run.