saph4be

as i just rang a compenay up and they said they don't reccommend it and i should not do and when i said why, they said lots of reasons so can anyone tell me what is bad about it as i thought is was best way to go

SassyRS

I'd get them to answer that as they seem to think they know so much ..

COMEDY DAN

Why did they say it was bad.?

Post the reasons and we will tell you if they talking crap or not.

I had mine done and it was the way to go, makes the gasket sit flush when fitting the head and stops the risk of the head distorting under large load.

Everybody is going to have a mixed opinion. Steve Scott advised me to do it so I did when he built my engine. If its good enough for him then it was good enough for me.

saph4be

he did not really say cos i did not bother to ask maybe some one on here will know

col cos1

iTrader: (5)

i know the reason



cause the guy you spoke to is a fuckin idiot

COMEDY DAN

I didnt want to post that but was thinking along those lines.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

What company was it?

saph4be

er no he is not hence the reason i am confused

COMEDY DAN

If he is not, why are you asking for further advice on here?

If I wish to know someting engine wise and speak to Steve, I dont then question his reply on a forum and make him look an idiot.

Doesnt really make sense does it.

If he is not a cock then maybe you have misunderstood his answers, for example maybe longstudding is not needed in your case.

saph4be

not tryin to make any one look an idiot i have always been led to belive that long studding your block is the best way to go as every top car you see seems to have it done so when i call a well known tuner up and ask if he can do this and he says no cos we don't reccomend it don't do it i thought i would try and find other peoples views on it ,

ellicoss

Had all my engines long studded with no probs are you sure you or he has not got mixed up with stud and nut kit as many people do not like these but if you are going to run high boost i would have it done cheers james

COMEDY DAN

Maybe your well known tuner either doesnt know how to do it or hasnt got the faciliities to do it.

Either way I think you need to ask them again.

saph4be

no cos i said machine the block to except long studs

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Things to clarify:

A) did you definately say a LONG stud conversion, not just studs

B) is it for a YB

C) who was it?

saph4be

no he can't do it and said he does not know anyone who can do it then he said i would not do it if i were you , so if any one knows a reason why not to long stud the block please enlighten me cos that is all i asked in first place

COMEDY DAN

What Chipston Hypercolour Shirt said

saph4be

chip yes ,yes and it was nms

col cos1

iTrader: (5)

if your getting it done its best to get 6 long studs and 4 standard stretch bolts

i got arp for the other 4 and was advised against as too hard and can crack block

and my cars been spot on so far

ellicoss

All i can say is i have only heard good things about longstudding and if you want it done steve from a1 rallye sport can do it

nilrem

is nutters not long studded? he swears by NMS doesnt he?? well you would have though so with the stickers... lol

SassyRS

Ours is long studded and been so far

COMEDY DAN

NMS think long studding should not be done on a YB?

Very bizarre.

Deleted by Request

...its true folks Karl Norris does not recommend it!


...normally i'd say what a crock of shit...but you cant knock Karl

NEIL A

iTrader: (6)

Think i mind seeing a post on here where one of the NMS guys said Karl is running standard bolts without problems.
My new engine is being built with uprated longstuds after hearing of mountune ones stretching slightly.

Deleted by Request

..all long studs are semi stretch.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Would be interesting to hear Karl's opinion on it, especially if engines like alg1k's arent on long studs!

Alps Pacino

Dingy said he wouldnt long stud if he was doing his engine again. I know he uses Karl but dont know if his opinion was influenced by him.

I dont think people say long studding is shit, i just hear people saying its not neccasery and a waste of time.

JonnyBravo

What did the wrc engines use ?

Everyone has their own opinion which is fair enough.

Personally I wouldn't use A1 after the shit rebuilt engine they sold a mate of mine

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Doesnt long studding mean drilling close to the water jackets and so making a 200 block weaker than a 205 block ?????

So i have been told

This is why some people say that buying a 200 block is a waist of cash if you long studding it

Again , so i have been told

bigad4x4

I hope this thread isnt going to go the way i think it may go

Would also be intrested to hear Karl's opinions on long studs, must say

Karl knows his stuff when it comes to how the cossie engine works

and what works and what doesnt work

rapidcossie

AFAIK ALL big power engine are long studded.

JonnyBravo

There is such a ongoing argument to what the difference between the 205 block and 200 block is.

I have been guaranteed that there is a lot more than just extra webbing at the bottom as I have heard said before.

Even with the few years that I have had a interest in Cosworths I like others can think of a fair few 500+ hp engines that were built from 200 blocks with long studs and haven't failed, and thats just local to me.

Funny how all of a sudden everyone is on the bandwagon saying that 200 blocks are crap, long studs dont work etc.. yet for the last 20 years people have been using them with no problem whatsoever. (apparently)

IMO there is a lot more people around these days willing to build you a big power YB when in reality only 3/10 of all the tuners actually know what their talking about.

Apparently anyone these days can build you a reliable 500hp Yb for less than the next tuner

garyrs

i have heard a fair few people say that wrc engines use long studs , i thought that was cos they were higher comp engines ??? anny 1

rapidcossie

yet how many do you see that actually perform like 500 bhp

Stick with tried and tesetd methods that have proven to work

Alps Pacino

I have heard of a 750bhp mk2 using arp stud and nut

I know of 500bhp 205 blocks runing arp stud and nut and standard bolts

I know of 200 blocks long studded 500bhp

My rs500 205 block let go at 400bhp on standard head bolts.

There is no set proof as to whats better a 205 block can last as long as a 200 block at the same power levels, just like a 200 block can fail at less than some 205 blocks. I honestly think its purel down to luck of the draw at big power and tuners just speak from there own experiences and maybe Karls experiences have been that long studding just snt necasery so he just advises against it.

To sum up what i'm trying to say 500bhp through ANY 20 year old engine is a lottery

Deleted by Request

long studding and the multi layer head gasket were used on WRC engines......because of the high compression and needing to keep the head on at 3bar plus boost spike!...This was used in conjuction with nikasil liners..to put the strength back to the bore walls.


Touring cars did not run long stud.

500bhp + cars do NOT need long studding....650plus you need to start thinking due to boost figures and flow.

HTH

PGT

according to AB one of the raesons for long studding is to reduce bore distortion when clamping down the head. some tuners - GGR is one - use a torque plate for this purpose. in USA most good tuning shops appear to use torque plates even for NA. with turbo the potential for blow by must increase

NMS Badboy^NUTTER^

My engine is not long studded, and neither is Karl's.

I had a 6 long stud engine, and a 10 long stud engine, and both suffered head gasket failure, and when the studs were measured, they were all different lengths.

I have had no trouble whatsoever with standard head bolts.
I understand the physics behind Karl's logic here, and will never have another block long studded.

Like Karl said, don't do it.

NMS Badboy^NUTTER^

A torque plate has got fuck all to do with long studs, this is used while boring the block

rapidcossie

what long studs were used Jonno?