Alternative front diff options??
24-03-2013, 08:49 AM
#1
Alternative front diff options??
I'm trying to decide what front diff to use in my Escort, ideally it will be one from a production car that can be bought for a reasonable cost but it does need to be pretty strong too. I have considered an R33 Skyline unit with an aftermarket lsd as its quite compact but am unsure of what sort of power it can take and can't even find out what size the crown wheel is, anyone know? Obviously I need to be thinking about matching the ratio to the rear but I will think about that after!!
I'm prepared to consider any diff if any of you have any other potential candidates in mind, I'd prefer to integrate it into the sump but could remote mount it on a frame if needs be, it has to fit on the drivers side.
Any better ideas??
I'm prepared to consider any diff if any of you have any other potential candidates in mind, I'd prefer to integrate it into the sump but could remote mount it on a frame if needs be, it has to fit on the drivers side.
Any better ideas??
Last edited by Martin-Hadland; 24-03-2013 at 08:51 AM.
24-03-2013, 12:08 PM
#2
What crownwheel do you need ? I think the earlier Skylines use a high 3.x range and their drivetrains are robust.
The later R34 stuff is in the 3.5x range...much better IMO. The R34 front diff is integral to the sump.
I think I posted pics of that before where the guy was fitting one to an old Celica ?
Other option is a normal IRS rear diff, inverted. Same F/R
The later R34 stuff is in the 3.5x range...much better IMO. The R34 front diff is integral to the sump.
I think I posted pics of that before where the guy was fitting one to an old Celica ?
Other option is a normal IRS rear diff, inverted. Same F/R
24-03-2013, 12:33 PM
#3
What crownwheel do you need ? I think the earlier Skylines use a high 3.x range and their drivetrains are robust.
The later R34 stuff is in the 3.5x range...much better IMO. The R34 front diff is integral to the sump.
I think I posted pics of that before where the guy was fitting one to an old Celica ?
Other option is a normal IRS rear diff, inverted. Same F/R
The later R34 stuff is in the 3.5x range...much better IMO. The R34 front diff is integral to the sump.
I think I posted pics of that before where the guy was fitting one to an old Celica ?
Other option is a normal IRS rear diff, inverted. Same F/R
Theres a Lambo Gayardo front diff on ebay for £1600
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24-03-2013, 01:19 PM
#13
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I have always wondered if the subaru 6 speed unit could be fitted as its very strong, but presume its not viable else someone would have done it by now, people are running very high power through them without issue,
24-03-2013, 03:09 PM
#14
As far as I'm aware the 32/33 share the same ratio which is something like a 4.2, the R34 is in the high 3s I think. I'm using an R33 gearbox so either would do but obviously I need to think about the rear matching. I know they're integral to the sump, I have built a few but never measured the sump or cwp size. Your other option is in my mind too. I'd be interested to see how big a BMW X5 front diff is because that shares the same ratio as a Cossy!
Theres a Lambo Gayardo front diff on ebay for £1600
Theres a Lambo Gayardo front diff on ebay for £1600
On that basis, it would just make sense to use the F/R diff from the same vehicle.
Subaru 6 speed would be no use as it's a transaxle design, mating front shafts to the wheels would be very difficult, Subaru engine sits quite far forwards and can do because it's short.
Audi's manage it too, although they're very long nosed cars.
24-03-2013, 04:20 PM
#17
I'm pretty sure the front diff of an R34 is 3.54 or 3.45, somewhere there. Thats what my mate bought for his standstill project. the R33 etc would just be far far too short for any useful top speed.
On that basis, it would just make sense to use the F/R diff from the same vehicle.
On that basis, it would just make sense to use the F/R diff from the same vehicle.
I'm sure there's loads propped up a garage wall up and down the country so finding one won't be a problem other than getting the ratio I want.
Last edited by Martin-Hadland; 24-03-2013 at 04:26 PM.
24-03-2013, 04:47 PM
#19
From a post on GTR, R33 4.11,and R34 3.565
Most googling seems to back that up.
Not sure about dedicated front 4.11 diffs, but some Nissan 200's will have a rear 4.11, as will some R160 diffed Subarus ( that's the small diff, so may be strong enough in a front application...or may not )
I think the 200's use the R200 diff, which is obviously bigger.
Most googling seems to back that up.
Not sure about dedicated front 4.11 diffs, but some Nissan 200's will have a rear 4.11, as will some R160 diffed Subarus ( that's the small diff, so may be strong enough in a front application...or may not )
I think the 200's use the R200 diff, which is obviously bigger.
24-03-2013, 04:51 PM
#20
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24-03-2013, 04:56 PM
#21
From a post on GTR, R33 4.11,and R34 3.565
Most googling seems to back that up.
Not sure about dedicated front 4.11 diffs, but some Nissan 200's will have a rear 4.11, as will some R160 diffed Subarus ( that's the small diff, so may be strong enough in a front application...or may not )
I think the 200's use the R200 diff, which is obviously bigger.
Most googling seems to back that up.
Not sure about dedicated front 4.11 diffs, but some Nissan 200's will have a rear 4.11, as will some R160 diffed Subarus ( that's the small diff, so may be strong enough in a front application...or may not )
I think the 200's use the R200 diff, which is obviously bigger.
It will be turbo'd for sure (no point otherwise
) by whether its single or twin will have to decided when I see what sort of space I have, powerwise it needs t0 start with an 8 or more.
Last edited by Martin-Hadland; 24-03-2013 at 04:58 PM.
24-03-2013, 05:10 PM
#22
Thanks for the info Stevie, I can buy a shorter 5th so the R34 would probably the one to go for even though its rarer to get hold of. I'm thinking of making a pattern sump so that I can have one cast rather than welded up.
It will be turbo'd for sure (no point otherwise ) by whether its single or twin will have to decided when I see what sort of space I have, powerwise it needs t0 start with an 8 or more.
It will be turbo'd for sure (no point otherwise
) by whether its single or twin will have to decided when I see what sort of space I have, powerwise it needs t0 start with an 8 or more.From a simplicity point of view, I'd go for a big single. Manifolds dont need to be fancy, just functional, and all you'll need is a 2" or 2.25" max link pipe from one side to the other. A Single simplifies air filters and boost plumbing too.
With 255/40x17 and the 3.27 rear I seen 200mph at about 6700rpm. With a 3.55, I'd have needed about 7400rpm to achieve it ( 0.74 5th gear ), which with my engine would never happen.
So I'd say the 3.56 would be close to ideal, depending on your tyre sizes. But with lots of power and torque, shorter gearing is of little benefit.
24-03-2013, 09:21 PM
#26
IMO aim peak power for your desired target speed, gives you more chance of actually hitting it when the going gets tough. It may still carry a few hundred rpm after that anyway
But it will definitely be easier than the 2.0 simply due to the wider spread of power and torque.
If you needed a little more or less gearing, it's just a tyre change away. But safer to aim for tall gearing. More boost/power can make up the difference.
If gearing is too short, you're screwed lol.
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