Rod-Tarry

Made the trip up to Grimsby to meet Mark the guy behind MK Motorsport, decided on a 2 day break with the Mrs, so nice hotel in the Lincolnshire country side & some great food it was like going back 20 years with the prices & lack of roads to go anywhere .
Mark has been developing a Girdle for the YB & is also making my dry-sump system. Part of the reason for the visit was to bring back the girdle & also discuss changes to the dry-sump system after discussions with Mark Shead. Lots going on at MK including ideas on the Big Power Cossie head gasket integrity problem. Could not really tell whats done on mine as its another company’s development. Also saw his billet Throttle bodies.
A well known Cossie from here is being worked on but wont say anymore incase its secret squirrel stuff. Also a non purist Escort Cossie pick-up being built.
Mark is as passionate as I am so we got on very well. Pics of the girdle & pan are below & I now understand why its like it is, stronger than another on the market in my eyes.
Had a great day & would fully recommend this company, he wont always answer his phone cos he cant hear it, I now understand why .
Thanks for a great welcome Mark & also to your son. The Mrs was impressed with him giving him a ‘nice lad’ tag never a good sign when you are young.
When the dry sump system is fully developed another 2 perhaps 3 day break is on the cards maybe we will be the first to find an ‘M’ road in the Lincolnshire outback.
Cheers Rod


.

Dan F

I didnt realise they were so close to me, good to know theres a decent company near

Id love to see your Sierra eating up the Lincolnshire roads Rod

JamesH

iTrader: (21)

Glad you got the girdle Rod! You can get Mark to build up the engine now

NoRubNoDub

Are you using a different font?
Mk Motorsports work is second to none. I'd love to work for them.

McGoo 69

yeh mark is a very knowledgeable guy!

had a great chat when i met up with him also, unfortunately i couldn't go into the shop as he had some secret secret stuff in but theres always next time!

love the sump its a nice bit of kit!

zetaboostboy522bhp

lovely piece of engineering isnt it , i didnt realise it was you yesterday rod otherwise i would of had a quick chat and introduced myself , i was the lad walking out with a box full of stuff when you walked in. i also had a great day out aswell lol

cheers paul

750hp escos

His ok isnt he rod??lol

Yea theres lots of secret squirrel stuff going on with my car and its coming on great so i hear??

I also have the same sump and girdle kit as you rod and i have one of marks tall block kits that martin designed ..

Mark has got some great ideas on my car ,infact its going to be a rolling advert for him when finished!!

Thanks to mcgoo i have every carbon kevlar panel now and he even delivered it for me..


Mk motorsport has got some nice bits going on and i cant wait to show everyone what he has done for me when finished..glad your happy rod..


cheers danny

saph4be

How long is yours gonna be Danny?

steveboyslim

As one of the problems with big power YB engines is the main caps cracking, I am supprised that the lower part of the girdle has a channel along the center of the supporting web.
On other working designs, the oil is drains back through holes under each reinforcement web, with the original caps machined flat so that the web has a larger contact area giving greater support to the main cap.

Steve

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi steve if the problems is the main caps cracking why would you want to weaken them more by machining them flat

mark

stevieturbo

Why not integrate the main caps into a girdle, so it all becomes a single structure ? I'm sure Ive seen some engines made that way.

Chaz888

Nice work ! fek me it's almost art .

steveboyslim

To increase the area of the cap which is supported rather than leave the middle unsuported.
I can understand that with you version you have designed it so that the original caps do not have to be touched, making it 'bolt on'.
The design of the other girdle which uses machined main caps has been proven to work and has been in used for several years with many championship winning YB engines.

Steve

steveboyslim

Hart 420r F2 engine had a twin trough mainframe incoperating the main caps into the structure.

Steve

lee2cossies

iTrader: (2)

Amazing machine work as always. Great to see that someone is still so enthusiastic with fresh ideas for the old yb and still pushing the boundaries.

stevieturbo

I was thinking more along the lines of a Nissan or Honda lol

In fact, I'm almost sure I seen one of those shitty modern 3 cylinder VAG engines that looked like it used a girdle/cap setup

c20tbo

iTrader: (1)

I have to agree,

750hp escos

It didnt and doesnt work on andrew gs( now charlies engine) as that has cracked with a jg girdle kit..

This one isnt tested yet so cant really argue to whether it will work or not but one things for sure its giving it more support than with out it..

The cracking alot of people are led to believe is more down to harmonics than anything else any way..

The reason im using one is because since weve seen 600+lb ft of torque we have experienced the rear main and big end bearings bronzing to the left side so just trying to stop things moving around as much..

This will prove to me after a good few outings if it stops that..

Im sure rod has his own reasons why he is using one as well as wanting a dry sump kit??

Also this is a quarter of the price of the jg one so if all works well a bargain,as said though as long as it slows the bronzing of my shells so quick then job done!!



cheers danny

SiZT

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi because then the cost would push it past the price of a new alloy block

mark

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi steve
if the problem is the main caps ,why not just fit some big billet caps surely that would be easier and cheaper than what julian does ,my system was just meant as a helping hand it was never meant to make the block bullet proof ,and a cost that it would be worth doing as a precaution

thanks mark

TimC

iTrader: (1)

Danny did I read that right? Your getting a "one piece" block which allows extra rod length?

fordrallycar

iTrader: (4)

Mark is a great guy & has been very helpful to me & the quailty of the machining is second to none A big up to MK Motorsport

Rod-Tarry

Interesting replies. We know the ag girdle has not worked at 800bhp so lets see if Marks design is the solution i think his idea is a step forward & we will attempt 1000bhp down Brunters with it. Certainly it was Vibration that caused my Block failure the crank survived the incident within manufacturers tolerances & was used in the replacement block.

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi
i didnt do this as a miracle cure just thought it would help ,it wasn't to compete with or upset, anyone else that has or is going to do this ,i dont think anything you do to the standard block is going to make it bullet proof there will always be issues with something that was never designed to make 800/1000 bhp.charlie shaw sent me pics of his block with ag sump and it had crack the block at the rear ,so even doing that way isn't guaranteed ,it seems to be vibration ,harmonics thats causing the block to crack always at the rear,has anyone looked at the possibility that it could be something to do with the input shaft or rear bearing that is causing the vibration problem ,it is a very small bearing in the rear of the crank ,might be worth machining and fitting a bigger better tolerance bearing ,also worth clocking the bell housing making sure input is actually running true to crank ,i am no expert just my hobby making these parts all done off my own back

thanks mark

lacey

Or maybe it the harmonics going into the fly wheel and that's a lot of metal to get a wobble on

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi dan
i think it has something to do with that area as its the rear of the block that has the problem

mark

steveboyslim

I was aware of the cracking problems on Charlie's engine.
From the pictures of the original build thread, it did not look like a JG product was used, although that might be outdated information, perhaps Jimbo could confrim (if he is able to)
I will agree on the cost, but the JG kit uses an Auto Verdi oil/scavange pump, which cost over Ł1K.

Steve

steveboyslim

Billet steel caps are now used depending on engine specification.

Steve

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi steve
when charlie or one of his friends contacted me to see if i could help it had a ag sump girdle on it ,
i dont want to get in too a competion this is just something i did in my shed so too speak ,so its unfair for you too compare when that was never my intention

mark

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

i can see why his engines cost Ł52,000 but is it worth it at the end of the day ,dont get me wrong he obviosly knows what hes doing but i am not in a postion to compet with that money wise

mark

steveboyslim

Over Ł60,000 now.

Steve

andrewg

its not torque thats been breaking it its vibration, must be something in the 2.2 set up
as when it was first used it would turn the twim aux belts inside out and throw them off,, even took out dry sump belt!
went to multi v that cured the belt prblem but still has vibration

maybe harmonic balancer would cure it

steveboyslim

Not trying to compare, in my opinion yours is very good and perhaps could be better but as I have not done any form of back to back testing with either product I was just passing on observations with explanations.

Steve

steveboyslim

That is what JEMS and JG uses.
V belts and pulleys with a different profile will also help.

Steve

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

bloody hell ,you can have all alloy twin turbo v8 pushing out 1800 bhp for less than that and it will last ,like the one i had in my escort

mark

MK MOTORSPORT

iTrader: (1)

hi steve
ok no probs what is it you actualy do ,are you a machinest or engine builder etc ,with saying you havent done back to back testing

mark

steveboyslim

Don't do engines or machining for a living, built a few YB's when they were still in production, now mainly do Vauxhall, built several 600+BHP XE/LET and ZLET engines.
I know most of the 'Maldon Mafia' both past an present.
I have many friends how are ex-Hart employees who have gone on to work all over the world working for some very high profile companies in all areas of motorsport and engine development.

Steve

750hp escos

Steve we know eachother with out even meeting!!!lol

Mike jennings gets to see everything new we decide to use and he has seen my block the tall one with 25mm spacer and steel wet liners and he likes it,pirroe and joe and mike have now seen the girdle kit and like anyone and evrything someone always has better ideas..

To make this perfect id say a steel main cap macined flat in place with the girdle would prob be best but then theres line boring after wards and the making of the steel caps so starting to get very expensive!!

For my application (tall block stell liners 25mm spacer that acts like a deck plate)i think this set up is perfect as were not going to create the harmonics of a std height block squeezing 2.2 cc and 800 hp at 2.5 bar and 9k rpm..

I will hope to be making 700+ hp at and before 7.5k rpm and only 2 bar boost so think i will have a pretty bomb proof yb!! well i hope anyway!!lol..

I have spoke to mike in detail about harmonics etc etc and if my engine works out like im sure it will im going to replicate this alongside the maldon mafia and mk to see if we can get a 1000 hp and hold together but that will be well over a year later than mine has been running just to see how it gets on at the 750 hp mark..



It will be nice to see an engine very similar to my own with a huge bw turbo at 1000 hp and actually see how long it lasts but as said above if in the realms of 8.8-9k rpm then i suspect the harmonics vibration problem will rear its ugly head again??



cheers danny

Rod-Tarry

Totally agree about the Vibration. Before it cracked the block you could hear a slight buzz at certain rpm gone in an instant. I took expert advice afterwards the block cracked , they looked at the set-up suggested doubling the weight on the rear of the crank refitted a heavy flywheel that apparently moves the vibration. On the re-build the vibration was gone. We also suffered the belts turning inside out we always removed one for Topspeed runs to stop them taking each other off. Solution the same as you. We have not cracked another block since but Brunters is a stiff test. The MK girdle will help on the vibration front without taking half the strength out of the crank caps as it seems the crank caps are not the problem certainly my crank survived a 4 chunk block split & was measured to within 'as new' spec.
We can but try this solution if it works we will have a Topspeed record over 215mph if it dont a big bang but at least i will try.