The car WAS working BEFORE the incident......

If your engine threw a rod through the block and left oil over your tyres and track.... causing you to spin and others even too!!!!... would this be due to your lack of preperation/checks or more down to the failing of something that worked initially ??

 

That's all very well and good for you...yet you speak like you know my mate and what his car was like.
Invest some cash on listening to people.

His brakes were brutally effective and he had the proper fluid. They failed.

No stupidity on his behalf or recklessness, he made the relevant checks beforehand....but, what do i know? I only know the lad, the car and was there all weekend with them.

It was just a simple accident that caused nobody any harm. "Talent" didn't come into it, he was braking late...went for the brakes, they wasn't there and binned it on one of Combe notorious car killing corners.

You are clearly a cut above and i am in total awe of you...

 

according to earlier posts, it would be the drivers fault and talent would have sorted him out...

 

Which he of course did.

Sometimes though there are things that you cant test in your garage, like what happens the fluid after 10 mins of hard use, that you find out about on track, sometimes with dramatic consequences.


Lol @ 4 months and you forgot to upload the right map, yet expect everyone else to be psychic about what problems might happen that they cant possibly have any way of knowing about in advance.

what a knob

 

ah kkkkkkaay, you guys are seriously good at twisting things.

i'm not being arrogant...i've pulled cars out of hedges. I'm not talented, my cars not right. But i wouldn't put other people in danger. i was on that corner where it happened, don't think i wasn't there, he was going straight on for agggeeesss...

i think it's not worth the argument guys, always going to disagree.

I really couldn't care less if a standard puma kept up with mine...there designed to do something different...can't believe how retarded you have to be to not see that. At the end of the day, i wouldn't be driving a standard puma down a forest stage at 100mph would i. FFs talk about a useless comment.

 

still arrogant....you seem to ignore me a fair bit.

I will always disagree with you when to try and spectulate on things that i know first hand and are facts.

 

i did upload the right map...i just didn't make the changes to change 1500rpm saved, but the safety stuff was all sorted.

what i dont understand is that your saying his pads overheated...well i really can't see that being the case on the rear where he could of pulled the handbrake up because on a fwd car like that i can't see you putting more than 20% brake force on the rear without it spinning out. The only thing i think could of happened is that the pads gassed up, but at 350hp surely you would look to invest in some grooved discs. And you say the fluid is ok....just doesnt add up from where i was standing.

 

He was probably quite surprised that he had no brakes, and took a moment to react.
Probably cause he is a human being.

I had similar happen to me (clevis pin came out of the brakes in a friends car I was driving on track) luckily for me I had lots of time to do something about it as it was someone elses car and I always brake early when driving other people's cars, so i went across the infield and got lucky (was at bedford, lots of space) but if I had left it later to brake or if it had been on a different corner i might not have been so lucky.
And that really is the only difference between this fella and lots of us on here, luck!
ANY car going round a racetrack hard is putting others at risk, anyone could have had a faulty tyre blow out, or they could have had a sudden totally unexpected sneezing fit.

Thats just the nature of the hobby we have, if you are on the limit you have no margin for error left.

 

Does that cause the fuckin' pedal to drop??? BECAUSE THE PEDAL DROPPED!!!

OMG Just accept that fact.

 

So you're happy that a Puma that you've clearly spent a lot of money on is slower than a standard car - and I'm the retard?

 

yes...at 6800rpm which the car was, it makes 138bhp and 137ibs/ft torque. That's not to different from a standard puma is it?? It's also a fair bit heavier when you have passengers, a full roll cage a lot of other safety stuff...besides the fact that with very large wheels on, the car becomes geared different...i thaught you would know this???

in grp N rallying, you have to have a standard engine...

But if your really concerned the car isn't fast enough...sit in with me at a test session around epynt and then see how you feel.

I'm human too, and make lots of mistakes...that cars been rebuilt 3 times after serious accidents...I remember being on the m5 when a damper failed braking and span me into the barrier. I don't remember saying that we don't make mistakes??

If you look back...all i ever said was: "i don't see why he couldn't of just pulled the handbrake up"

We all learn from our lessons

 

Bollocks

 

Do you actually think that pulling the handbrake up on a car with all the weight on the front end, is going to make a significant difference to your chances of falling off a 70mph bend that you are doing 110mph just before?

Only thing its realistically likely to do is put the car into a massive spin that increases your chance of going in sideways which is more likely to hurt the occupants.

 

Then why insist on being so sanctimonious?

Er no, you've said a fair bit more than that. Hence why you've got us lot on your case

 

seriously guys, there are people with a lot faster fwd cars that do it all the time in motorsport.

 

What that go into a 70mph bend at 110mph with no runoff, suffer total brake failure, yank the handbreak up and everything is fine?

If so, have they got a handbrake that works on all 4 wheels on a second set of disk calipers and pads in case the main set fail?

I used to program power stations for a living and even we didnt have that many backup systems and safeguards

 

I give up now.

I've given the facts on what the score is with that car, the prep, driver and the TRUE cause of the accident.

You'd expect that to be the end of the thread.

 

mate, ive been sat in a car, down a stage in isle of man doing well into 90mph, misread a corner and driver pulled the handbrake...you need 3% brake on the rear to pull the handbrake and make it work.

that was a nissan note

 

If I pulled my handbrake up to slow down going into Quarry I think I would actually hit the overhead cables!!!
Plus if im lucky enough it would slow the car to 88mph...... where upon I would go back in time and have another go!

 

Thats really fascinating, do you think its even slightly relevant though?
What exactly does that have to being well above the limit of corner speed on a track with little run off and then have total brake fade?
If he mnaged to keep the car in one piece using just the handbrake after a corner was massively tighter than it was called then clearly he doesnt drive very hard cause if he was anywhere near the limit speed wise for a loose corner and it turned out he was in a tight one instead then the handbrake isnt going to be a get out of jail free card
Are you sure it wasnt the "restart level" button on a playstation he pulled?

What?
Does that make any sense at all when you read it?


It was more like a nonsense story

 

Amazing

Harry - please shut up, your just digging yourself into a hole here.

 

There is a much simpler question to be asked here, what is the point of putting that much power in an old 5hitter of an XR2?

Unless its got some serious engineering built into it (maybe its has?) its just an accident waiting to happen on a corner near you (only my opinion but a valid one and why I would never take a valuable car out on this sort of track session as you just dont know what you might come across on track).

 

i dont wanna go and upset anyone here...i spec tthe poor lads gutted, but it might be worth a thaught next time.

i don't think it's quite right for you guys to go slating someone's opinion...i was on the corner, i saw what happened. And for most definate, i wasn't the only one saying it!

BTW, i was saying you need 3% of the of your total front and back braking force to be applied on the surface of rear brakes to activate rear braking.

 

watch ou tmind, not allowed an opinion in here...

think i'm going to stop going on them now...trying to do my bit to get a ford on the track, but it's probably not worth it/appreciated

 

Some people enjoy acceleration a lot.

Im sure from a laptimes perspective he could have gone quicker with money spent elsewhere, although these days power is actually quite cheap to get TBH



Well more power means that if you do get an issue you are likely to get it at a bigger speed, so a lot more damage, definately agree with that.

Im of the opinion that 300bhp on a track like combe is quite useful in a FWD car but that going beyond that it doesnt really help you do much other than make life hard for yourself on the brakes and take a tiny bit off your laptimes by getting to some silly speeds in the middle of the straights, but its not a big difference IME.

 

quite agree a bit extra stoke is useful round combe, but on the tighter track could be a disadvantage....

But that's a lot of stoke for a car if it's not put together really really well.

 

Depends how controllable it is, I dont really see big power on a car as making your life difficult providing you have decent control of that power. It might be pointless and not actually help you to use it, but just having it there isnt a problem in itself if you are restrained about its use.

A boost request map based on TPS input is essential IMHO in making a big power FWD car work well for example.

 

hi i am new to this whole website i am considering doing a mk6 fiesta zetec s conversion does any one no or have put a 1.6 rs turbo engine in one do really need some advice on engine mount ect cheers private message me also

 

but you need heavier parts to control the power...

 

Yes that is a very good point if you are getting parts custom made to do the job that need to be bigger than standard like driveshafts and gearbox etc.
Not to mention unsprung weight like wheels/tyres/brakes

Definately gets to a point where more power isnt an advantage anymore and im pretty sure it gets there before 350bhp in a fiesta if you are talking lap times rather than just what is fun to build and drive.

 

extra weight you can't use....

+ there is issues with gearbox parts, reliability, fuel even. If you use fuel twice as fast you have to carry the extra weight.

Also bigger engine means bigger weight iteslf...Manafacturer's spend millions discovering how cars move their weight about, your just about to change all that.

Heavier engine means more weight on the front, which means lower ride height, which means new springs and damper rates.

Not as simple as some think.

tyres on a fwd car. you start using fronts quickly and it causes you to need a different compound on the rear which means a posible disaster if they heat/cool at different speeds

 

this is why a standard puma can keep up with a highly modified car like mine, because it takes ages to gather up data and understanding to make aftermarket parts work. For instance, all my suspension picks up off rose joints, which means that the platforms have to be perfectly coner weighted for each ride height otherwise the car fires you off the road.

There are very few cars that can add aftermarket parts and get the to improve lap times. That's why imo (If that's allowed) people try just to put more power in. But even then you can end up making a car hard to drive.

 

Agreed on engine weight on FWD cars, hence I have picked an alloy blocked engine for my new trackday car

 

snap. Puma's staying as it is, despite tempations to put a more poeerful engine in. To go faster down a stage, you have to go dramatically quicker on power, even then you risk binning it.

Standard is the way forward.

If i worked out how much i spent on my car. It would be close to buying a fast standard car.

 

hey i noticed u no alot about pumas ime thinking of putting a puma engine in my mk5 fiesta. are the engine mounts the same what would i need to change ect do i need a puma loom or is a fiesta 1 ok ect cheers

 

wish some of these super fast cars could go round corners, did anyone else think this whilst watching certain cars on sat? loads of balls and noise on the straits, then roll round the corners..... just me?

 

I watched the accident, it looked the driver locked up coming into Camp, and didn't come off the brake pedal

 

Have you ever driven around Coombe?

 

does any one no anything about fiesta zetec s n ford puma conversion

 

Probably best to start your own thread and not hijack one that has a good argument going on