Loopee Lotus

Sorry for Poaching your Forum.

This is my car

https://passionford.com/forum/general-car-related-discussion/192587-elise-at-castle-combe-last-weekend.html

Apparently the bearing cage in my GT28RS has overheated and melted and is somewhere in my sump.

I need a turbo which has a metal ball bearing cage can anyone steer me in the right direction ? I am in discussions with Owen Developements at the Mo.

Also, I probably need an additional water cooling circuit to cool the turbo after I shut the engine off, can anyone recommend a pump and post a water circuit diagram, the ECU has a pin out to run it so that bit is sorted .

Thanks

pa_sjo

If the spec is right and it's mapped properly it won't be melting turbos..

Garage19

V6 omegas have a coolant run on pump that i have used for just this in the past.
Seperate turbo cooler circuit with its own rad taken from a motorcross bike.

crazycage

wouldn't it be easier to just do a cool down lap ?

AlexF

Is there any air flow over the turbo itself?

Obviuosly in an elise the engine bay flow is limit... could this be your problem?

Mr Whippy

SeanB's audi powered exige with a GT30 used to have cooling issues but never to the point of melting turbo's. And its not like he doesnt drive the thing hard

I think swapping your turbo will simply mask your underlying problem, best of sorting it and sticking with the current turbo if your happy with the spec.

tabetha

Pm sent
tabetha

Ginge !

i LOVE your car, sorry i cant help with the issue but hope your gonna be going the ring with sib next year again,,,, anyone whos seen this car will just love it !!!

the reg is also class too !!!

OvaBoost

^^

alo

Pre rad turbo cooler might help?

Twellsie

iTrader: (1)

dont T series turbos have a metal bearing cage?

tabetha

Obviously the one that "melted" was not metal, otherwise the lower melting point alloys would have gone first on the turbo, so if it melted it is either not up to the job/material wise.
If it were the afr/mapping causing it to get enough heat to melt something here, ther eould be many many more melted parts first.
A pre cooler is a good idea, not only for any water supply to turbo but also for the oil, as the oil soaks/transfers away at least as much heat as the water does.
The engine location doesn't help.
tabetha

ECU Monitor Enthusiast

iTrader: (1)

All turbos need an exterior air flow to cool the housings of the turbines.

Any case temperature will increase the temperature of the compressed air cause charge issues !

Any temperature increase of the incoming air to the engine will add more temperature to the turbo itself.

Classic feedback loop !

Loopee Lotus

Thanks for some of your sensible comments. The car has been mapped properly it spent 4 hrs on the RR. I use V300 Motul oil with pre filter, the side scoop is dedicated to cooling the turbo alone via a 3" pipe, the other scoop is where the intercooler sits.

Turbo Dynamics basically have dismantled the turbo and told me that the nylon cage which is used to keep the bearings in place has melted and should be somewhere in the sump ! All GT28's turbos are supplied like this.

For those who know me the cars not driven hard, when I do I spend most of the time shitting myself - It's a bit of an animal ! as for cool down lap - well I thought that kind of thing goes without saying.

The turbo let go before xmas, driving at 60mph not even on power - so I can't really see how it got too hot either - maybe it was just faulty ?

According to the chap at Universal Turbos - most of the Cossies suffered from this when they changed to BB turbos - they now run with a brass cage - is this true ?

Obviously Turbo Dynamics don't want to compensate me and are blaming my engine - but how can I argue, the car has been mapped properly and only running 1.2 Bar of Boost, it's got good oil going to it as well as coolant, the oil P is good, the oil drain isn't blocked, it's got cold air feed to it with plenty of space for the emitted heat to escape - What else does it need ? TD recon that there was fuel in the oil after they sniffed it ! not as scientic test but there you go.

pa_sjo

What pre-turbine EGT's were being seen whilst mapping? If it was being done properly they would have been monitoring this.

alo

Whats the coolant supply to the turbo like?
I can't get my head round who's idea it was to put a nylon cage on a bearing that sits next to 800degrees of heat. like thats gona last.
If i was you i'd be pulling my sump off to see where the lump of plastics gone, hopefully not down an oil way or between a bearing

Loopee Lotus

I'm not sure on the EGT temps I'm gonna speak to the tuners on Monday.

Apparently Garrett thought it would be a good idea to use this material.

pa_sjo

I think Garrett know what they're doing... hundreds of thousands of cars are using these turbos in production right now and they're not all melting.

foreigneRS

of course it will last if it gets adequate cooling from the oil and water

Ginge !

it will be a high temp nylon for a start, not some low temp plastic used for bushes/ ladies tights pmsl

Ginge !

as silly as it sounds the turbo warrantys aint worth a toss, we sell turbos at work, if its non labour warranty then we just swop em over the first time, if theres a labour claim its sent back and ALWAYS rejected with "fitment error" as a excuse,,,, its a fucking scam as i doubt any company REALLY tests there stuff unless theres a huge warranty issue then they look at it, even denso admitted this to me at a course about there "testing" as they had a run on injectors for warranty so checked it out and discovered that they was all from a 100 mile raduis in bedford area yet nowhere else, turned out the bio fuel in the area "might" have been contaminated and caused the failure

not a help as such but should give a insight into how most small companys work,, and how the large companys work also apart from they WILL just swop them and smaller places wont

wilky

iTrader: (1)

there's not enougth oil to cool the turbo on it's own as they have a ristrictor in them
i have to core's which have a bronze bearing cage and plastic

i don't think this is the problem ,also the oil feed hole's that feed the ball bearing's
are very small like pin hole's these can block easy

i see if i can get some pic's up

good old wet bearing core,easy to fix

you could alway's put a nissan pulsar unit on and use your frount comp housing
this will be very simular spec to your to your gt28r just wet bearing

Steven_RW

Out of interest - u have a 3" intake pipe to cool the housings of the turbo. Is there an outlet in the engine bay? If there is no place for the air to go, then not much will get in, regardless of the size of the intake.

Get a thermocouple and put it close ish to the housings to see what the ambient air is like. I had loads of turbos fail on my RST - fecking annoying.

RW

foreigneRS

spot on

Loopee Lotus

If you read all of the thread and look at the photos here

https://passionford.com/forum/showthread.php?t=192587

You'll see a hole in the top of the boot lid the size of your head with nothing in th way but some mesh! - is this big enough for the convected heat to escape from to stop overheating