FAO people with coilovers....
31-01-2008, 10:34 PM
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FAO people with coilovers....
Just ordered a set of gaz golds for mine...was wonderin how many people are runnin coilovers and what you did to strengthen the rear turrets to cope with the extra load on them??!! Also what poundage springs are you all runnin for road/track/strip??? 
01-02-2008, 08:12 AM
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I have gaz golds but havent fitted them yet 
Cant remember what springs they are- i didnt spec them specifically, Gaz just phoned me when they received the order to ask me what they were going to be used for
Shell wise, i have seam welded around the rear inner arches where they meet the inner quarter, and again around the turret inserts where they are let into the wheelarch itself. I also have a welded in rear strut brace and bolt in cage...
From what i have read (About rear coilover strengthening), ive gone a bit OTT
I think Gaz just recommend a strut brace 
Cant remember what springs they are- i didnt spec them specifically, Gaz just phoned me when they received the order to ask me what they were going to be used for
Shell wise, i have seam welded around the rear inner arches where they meet the inner quarter, and again around the turret inserts where they are let into the wheelarch itself. I also have a welded in rear strut brace and bolt in cage...
From what i have read (About rear coilover strengthening), ive gone a bit OTT
I think Gaz just recommend a strut brace
01-02-2008, 02:05 PM
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Made a few enquiries.....going to get the rear turrets cut out and bigger stronger ones welded in....as well as a double diagonal rear strut brace. The company doing the work have done this several times before and should be more than adequate i hope!! With no mods to the rear end the whole shell's gonna flex under hard cornering loads, they advised me it's a definate no no to just put a strut brace i. Would like to hear what other people have done tho, cos what i've bin told might be overkill! As for spring rates i've now gone for considerably harder than the ones normally supplied with the kit....with track use in mind.
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01-02-2008, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by rstdave
Made a few enquiries.....going to get the rear turrets cut out and bigger stronger ones welded in....as well as a double diagonal rear strut brace. The company doing the work have done this several times before and should be more than adequate i hope!! With no mods to the rear end the whole shell's gonna flex under hard cornering loads, they advised me it's a definate no no to just put a strut brace i. Would like to hear what other people have done tho, cos what i've bin told might be overkill! As for spring rates i've now gone for considerably harder than the ones normally supplied with the kit....with track use in mind.
IIRC Tony (Nuts) posted that he used to run his 1600i on coilovers with no additional strengthening...
That is IIRC though, i'm sure he will be commenting when he sees this thread
01-02-2008, 11:45 PM
#11
No I sucessfully ran my Mk4 rallycar (prior to the Mk3) in competition use with NO shell mods whatsoever, no rear strutbrace, no welding, no flex, no cracking etc. Well when I say sucessful that was on converted Koni's which were the biggest pile of shite I have ever used on any car.
All we did was run our own extended inner turret top mount on standard stuff before doing our own strenthened Bilsteins.
The first version of the top mount was steel and now we are on to an all alloy version. Thats been out for about 6 years now so I expect its been copied.
Most Ledas use a 2.5 inch spring
Gaz, Avo, Bilstein, etc all use 2.25 which is easier to get up the turret.
All we did was run our own extended inner turret top mount on standard stuff before doing our own strenthened Bilsteins.
The first version of the top mount was steel and now we are on to an all alloy version. Thats been out for about 6 years now so I expect its been copied.
Most Ledas use a 2.5 inch spring
Gaz, Avo, Bilstein, etc all use 2.25 which is easier to get up the turret.
02-02-2008, 12:18 AM
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Nuts Rus: Some good info, cheers .....So i've not bin told rubbish then really as there may well need to be turret mods as you've obviously made some improvements to the design of your coilovers to overcome the problem. In actual fact i was told (but i could stand corrected as i haven't actually got them yet) that the gaz golds use a 2.5" spring....as the ledas did! Might only be a rumour but i also heard on the grapevine that leda had gone bust with one of the head guys from there workin for gaz now which might have somethin to do with the redesign of the gaz coilovers and using a 2.5" spring 
......and gaz shocks now offering a repair service for leda shocks.
Scholes: Out of interest i'm assumin yours is set up for track??!! The front spring poundage is similar to what i've been specced but the rears quite a bit stiffer....i'm wondering now if it's gonna be way too stiff lol, how do you find yours handle with that setup?
.....So i've not bin told rubbish then really as there may well need to be turret mods as you've obviously made some improvements to the design of your coilovers to overcome the problem. In actual fact i was told (but i could stand corrected as i haven't actually got them yet) that the gaz golds use a 2.5" spring....as the ledas did! Might only be a rumour but i also heard on the grapevine that leda had gone bust with one of the head guys from there workin for gaz now which might have somethin to do with the redesign of the gaz coilovers and using a 2.5" spring ......and gaz shocks now offering a repair service for leda shocks.Scholes: Out of interest i'm assumin yours is set up for track??!! The front spring poundage is similar to what i've been specced but the rears quite a bit stiffer....i'm wondering now if it's gonna be way too stiff lol, how do you find yours handle with that setup?
02-02-2008, 01:08 AM
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I have been quoted very high poundage rates for the rear springs. even though I have next to no weight in the back.
I am sure for a daily driven car a strut brace will be fine. At the end of the day the strut housing, if you like, is designed to take a shocker only, not the additional weight/pressure a coil spring is going to apply.
But in the grand scheme of things it cant be a stupid amount more?
I suppose spring rates depend a great deal as to weather you run an anti roll bar?
I am sure for a daily driven car a strut brace will be fine. At the end of the day the strut housing, if you like, is designed to take a shocker only, not the additional weight/pressure a coil spring is going to apply.
But in the grand scheme of things it cant be a stupid amount more?
I suppose spring rates depend a great deal as to weather you run an anti roll bar?
02-02-2008, 06:45 PM
#15
i have just put a set on my saph cossie,im getting my blacksmith pal to make a strutbrace which connects the towers,then diagonally fixes to the boot floor,the diagonally fixes to the steelwork below the parcelshelf.if you imagine where the old springs are mounted under the car,the chassis rails are pretty thick and capable of taking the pressure put on iy by a coil spring.but the inner arches and turrets on escorts and sierras is thinner and will flex/crack as all the shock is being transferred to what was originally designed for being a damper mounting point,so they need all the help they can get!
02-02-2008, 07:37 PM
#17
Triangulation down to the floor is useless unless its welded and just looks pretty.
If you carry no excess weight in the back (passengers) then I'd put money down on nothing ever being required depending on the design of the insert and top mount and where the loadings are spread out too.
What width is the shoulder on the top of the Gaz insert ? I know what it is on a competition Bilstein as thats why we chose it
If you carry no excess weight in the back (passengers) then I'd put money down on nothing ever being required depending on the design of the insert and top mount and where the loadings are spread out too.
What width is the shoulder on the top of the Gaz insert ? I know what it is on a competition Bilstein as thats why we chose it
02-02-2008, 08:26 PM
#18
I dont have it here to measure it, but I'm guessing that it won't be up to Bilstein standard.
I don't carry anyone in the back of my RST. Though I am happy to weld in bracing to the rear of the car. I may end up with a cage, when I find one suitable, but that will only be bolt-in.
I don't carry anyone in the back of my RST. Though I am happy to weld in bracing to the rear of the car. I may end up with a cage, when I find one suitable, but that will only be bolt-in.
02-02-2008, 08:53 PM
#19
Its the inserts shoulder width (under the black top cap) thats important, and the design of the inside of the top cap that we did all our work on.
They are the bits that take the weight loadings.
Do them bottom spring platforms still rattle about with them still using course threads ?
They are the bits that take the weight loadings.
Do them bottom spring platforms still rattle about with them still using course threads ?
03-02-2008, 04:03 PM
#23
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I found out the that the rear Gaz shock are not the best of fitments as the black top mout you see in C+B pic doest sit well in the car body shell
04-02-2008, 10:02 AM
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Had a look at mine this weekend, i have 350lb fronts, and 500lb rears.
Front Gaz Gold springs are 2.5", rears are 2.25" (Rears must be 2.25" so that they fit up the turret)
Looking forward to fitting them but i'm a way off yet...
Johnny Knoxville
I know what you mean. I thought they didnt seat very well when i offered mine up to the shell
Didnt look into it too much at that point though.
Front Gaz Gold springs are 2.5", rears are 2.25" (Rears must be 2.25" so that they fit up the turret)
Looking forward to fitting them but i'm a way off yet...
Johnny Knoxville
I know what you mean. I thought they didnt seat very well when i offered mine up to the shell
Didnt look into it too much at that point though.
05-02-2008, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by scholes
500lb rear springs 
Ive seen out and out track/race Mk3 with 800lb rears...
05-02-2008, 06:22 PM
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Got 450 pound springs on the rear of mine when they come....didn't have a clue what to go for myself so took the advice of someone in the know...i know it'll be hard but hopefully not to the point of ruining it!! Sayin that he told me their race cars run 950 pound springs on the rear
05-02-2008, 07:33 PM
#33
Originally Posted by gus
i like that andy
your car is full of tricks
your car is full of tricks
It could be said that its unnecessary, however at the time MEF kit wasnt available and Leda reccomended strengthening the turret tops. Fortunatly the lads at AVA had a plan and fabricated new turrets etc etc.....the result is what you see!
05-02-2008, 08:26 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by Rick
std rear springs are 136lb, and they are inboard
05-02-2008, 08:37 PM
#36
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Originally Posted by Rick
std rear springs are 136lb, and they are inboard
BACK TO UNI FOR YOU
Looking good andy
Not sure any mods are needed other than a proper rear brace as the mk3/4 shell is weak as fuck.
07-02-2008, 06:19 PM
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you cant't leave it at that tony whats your view on poundage for road/track and what do you tend to see as the most popular poundage rate sold with your stuff or what have you personally tried over the years with adj shocks and coilovers, p.s does anyone know what poundage koni springs are as i've got some on mine with adj shocks but they seem to soft and unbalanced unless you run them on hard setting but then still feels slightly off 
07-02-2008, 06:43 PM
#40
Come balanced out with the length and bump/rebound of the inserts Gus
I use mine in competition as you know and that includes playing about on serious trackdays so its developed and tweeked all the time.
Its basically a Gp A gravel set up on the rear that works best for handling grip and comfort.
Dont want to post figures as people with different rate inserts will need different poundages etc.
I use mine in competition as you know and that includes playing about on serious trackdays so its developed and tweeked all the time.
Its basically a Gp A gravel set up on the rear that works best for handling grip and comfort.
Dont want to post figures as people with different rate inserts will need different poundages etc.