NO SPRAK ERST help!!!!!! :'(
08-01-2007, 09:45 PM
#1
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NO SPRAK ERST help!!!!!! :'(
ryt they car has just had a rst engine fitted and loom to all the wires seem to have a reading on the tester plug leads are fine plugs are new dizzy cap is new to but i have my old xr3i coil on there are the coils diffrent?? it has got a rst dizzy can that be screwed if the coils are not diffrent
hope someone can help this is driving me crazy
many thanks
saq
hope someone can help this is driving me crazy
many thanks
saq
08-01-2007, 10:07 PM
#2
not sure if its any help but when mine wasnt sparking, i found the ecu wasnt powering up, one of the pins (cant remember which of top of my head!) goes live when u switch ignition on, found the relay that powers ecu was full of rust!!! swapped it for a new one, presto!!
08-01-2007, 10:28 PM
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yh coils earthed perfect wich relay is it under the dash the pink relay is the fuel pump and theres a blue and green one wen i got the loom they were both rusted to shits ive been told the green one is for abs and ive replaced the blue one to but on my loom theres 3 wires comming off both ecu's they are brown wires and eartched onto the battery if i put them to the possitive side the pump chirps as if the car ignition was set to position to
i am kind of confused wot can be wrong
i am kind of confused wot can be wrong
08-01-2007, 10:34 PM
#6
wonder if this might help ya..??
Pin 1----should have a green wire from it to the coil negative. connect a test lamp to this and crank the engine...it should flash...if it stays constant you have a fault
Pin2----should have a brown wire to it and be connected to ground (earth or negative....vehicle body)
Pin6----ignore
Pin7----should have a black/red trace wire to it and go to a pin on the distridutor
Pin12----ignore
Pin13----should have a black wire from it and it goes to pin 87 on a relay which i think is the relay betewwn the 2 ECUs'.....this relay will have a red connected to pin 30 and that red has a battery live feed. pin 85 of that relay should be brown and to ground. pin 86 of that relay is fed from the ignition switch and this is the power up system for the ECU....basicaly when you switch your ignition on the ECU powers up (with igniton on it should have 12volts to it with the ECU connected
Pin14----should have a brown and connected to ground exactly like pin 2
Pin15----should be brown and goes to the distributor plug
Pin20----should have a green/yellow trace wire to to it and this goes to 3 locations....1 is pin 25 of the fuel ECU...another is the final pin on the distributor plug and the other is to pin 1 on the fuel pump relay
Pin25----ignore
all the pins used on the ignition ECU are listed up there...the ones i have told you to ignore are for coolant temp sensors and the amal valve...the rest are empty slots
so basically check that the green wire flashes with the test lamp when the engine is cranked over (with everything still connected) if it doesnt then check pins 2 and 14 have a good earth and that pin 13 has live to it when the ignition is switched on. if they have then make sure the green wire hasnt broken between the ECU and the coil by doing a continuety check with a mulitmeter. if thats ok then its time to look at the trigger (sensor in the distributor)....check that the wires from pins 7, 14 and 20 are all continuous to the distributor plug if they are then your looking at either an ECU fault or a faulty dizzy.......all this will only apply if there is NO spark from the coil at all when cranked
if the test lamp flashes(an even constant flash) with it connected in parallel to the green wire on the coil when the engine is cranked over that indicates that all the electronics are working and the coil should be sparking.
with the ignition on there should be a live to the positive side of the coil which is a black wire......(the green is on the other side)...if there isnt then there is a fault on that wire.......it is an ignition switched feed
a control unit???......not according to the wiring diagrams......the ignition feed just branches out in various directions to where it needs to go.....check there is feed on the black wire to the coil before you go hunting....and also that the ECU has power to pin 13 like i said in my first post........that little black box is a suppressor i think....however if you disconnect it and connect the 2 plugs together...basically bypassing it and cutting it out of the equation.....it MAY have become high resistance and is stopping power from reaching the coil
there are 2 ECUs......behind the heater box......the black Bosch one is the fuel ECU.....the silver Ford ESC 2 module is the ignition ECU....its the ESC 2 module that you need to look at
if the signal isnt getting from the dizzy to the ECU it cant tell the coil when to fire a spark....(check all 3 wires to the ECU)
at the same time if the coil has no igniton feed it cant fire a spark (check power to the positive on the coil)
and if the ecu hasnt powered up it cant do anything (check the 2 earths on pins 2 and 14 and also for live with ignition on on pin 13)
also if the ECU is telling the coil to fire a spark but the coil isnt getting that message the coil wont fire (check the green wire to pin 1)
also the dizzy....usually if i remember correctly the brown is an earth through the ECU...the black/red trace is a live fed from the ECU and the centre is the signal to pin 20........if the sensor in the dizzy isnt powering up it wont work and also at the same time if the signal isnt getting to the ECU the ECU wont know when to tell the coil to fire.....
get the wiring tested.......
Pin 1----should have a green wire from it to the coil negative. connect a test lamp to this and crank the engine...it should flash...if it stays constant you have a fault
Pin2----should have a brown wire to it and be connected to ground (earth or negative....vehicle body)
Pin6----ignore
Pin7----should have a black/red trace wire to it and go to a pin on the distridutor
Pin12----ignore
Pin13----should have a black wire from it and it goes to pin 87 on a relay which i think is the relay betewwn the 2 ECUs'.....this relay will have a red connected to pin 30 and that red has a battery live feed. pin 85 of that relay should be brown and to ground. pin 86 of that relay is fed from the ignition switch and this is the power up system for the ECU....basicaly when you switch your ignition on the ECU powers up (with igniton on it should have 12volts to it with the ECU connected
Pin14----should have a brown and connected to ground exactly like pin 2
Pin15----should be brown and goes to the distributor plug
Pin20----should have a green/yellow trace wire to to it and this goes to 3 locations....1 is pin 25 of the fuel ECU...another is the final pin on the distributor plug and the other is to pin 1 on the fuel pump relay
Pin25----ignore
all the pins used on the ignition ECU are listed up there...the ones i have told you to ignore are for coolant temp sensors and the amal valve...the rest are empty slots
so basically check that the green wire flashes with the test lamp when the engine is cranked over (with everything still connected) if it doesnt then check pins 2 and 14 have a good earth and that pin 13 has live to it when the ignition is switched on. if they have then make sure the green wire hasnt broken between the ECU and the coil by doing a continuety check with a mulitmeter. if thats ok then its time to look at the trigger (sensor in the distributor)....check that the wires from pins 7, 14 and 20 are all continuous to the distributor plug if they are then your looking at either an ECU fault or a faulty dizzy.......all this will only apply if there is NO spark from the coil at all when cranked
if the test lamp flashes(an even constant flash) with it connected in parallel to the green wire on the coil when the engine is cranked over that indicates that all the electronics are working and the coil should be sparking.
with the ignition on there should be a live to the positive side of the coil which is a black wire......(the green is on the other side)...if there isnt then there is a fault on that wire.......it is an ignition switched feed
a control unit???......not according to the wiring diagrams......the ignition feed just branches out in various directions to where it needs to go.....check there is feed on the black wire to the coil before you go hunting....and also that the ECU has power to pin 13 like i said in my first post........that little black box is a suppressor i think....however if you disconnect it and connect the 2 plugs together...basically bypassing it and cutting it out of the equation.....it MAY have become high resistance and is stopping power from reaching the coil
there are 2 ECUs......behind the heater box......the black Bosch one is the fuel ECU.....the silver Ford ESC 2 module is the ignition ECU....its the ESC 2 module that you need to look at
if the signal isnt getting from the dizzy to the ECU it cant tell the coil when to fire a spark....(check all 3 wires to the ECU)
at the same time if the coil has no igniton feed it cant fire a spark (check power to the positive on the coil)
and if the ecu hasnt powered up it cant do anything (check the 2 earths on pins 2 and 14 and also for live with ignition on on pin 13)
also if the ECU is telling the coil to fire a spark but the coil isnt getting that message the coil wont fire (check the green wire to pin 1)
also the dizzy....usually if i remember correctly the brown is an earth through the ECU...the black/red trace is a live fed from the ECU and the centre is the signal to pin 20........if the sensor in the dizzy isnt powering up it wont work and also at the same time if the signal isnt getting to the ECU the ECU wont know when to tell the coil to fire.....
get the wiring tested.......
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09-01-2007, 11:39 AM
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09-01-2007, 04:48 PM
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i got a new dizzzy mate no luck new coil and leads stil no luck
checked the wires seem fine to something ent giving a signal to the coil to start
checked the wires seem fine to something ent giving a signal to the coil to start
09-01-2007, 05:57 PM
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right i got it to start with a diffrent wel half of a 1.6 carb loom and dizzyy made it start til the fuel in the chambers finished either ive got a problem in the loom or a faulty ecu wich dout and hope not but i wil try and tested it by trying it on another rs if it starts that my ecu is fine and loom is gay and needs a opp 
09-01-2007, 07:28 PM
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hmmmmmmmmmm
Next test, get a bulb, connect one side to the green wire on the coil, and the other side to the battery positive. Crank the engine over, and tell me if you see anything!
Next test, get a bulb, connect one side to the green wire on the coil, and the other side to the battery positive. Crank the engine over, and tell me if you see anything!
09-01-2007, 07:30 PM
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On a Series 2 yes i would say so, the dizzy has to send the signal to the ECU and then the fuel pump, coil and rev counter are all on the ECU output.
If the pump runs your are getting a low tension signal.
If you do the test above that would help
If the pump runs your are getting a low tension signal.
If you do the test above that would help
09-01-2007, 07:36 PM
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Right, you have a broken wire 
If my memory serves me correctly, there is 2 green wires out of the ecu plug, one dissapears inside the fuse box, the other runs around the loom to the coil (there is another wire running with this one which connects to the suppressor and also runs through the fusebox to the rev counter)
Disconnect the battery, unplug the ignition ECU, remove the fuel pump relay, disconnect the suppressor on the green wire on the coil, then continuity test from the ecu plug to the green wire that plugs onto the coil, i think you will find there is no continuity
If my memory serves me correctly, there is 2 green wires out of the ecu plug, one dissapears inside the fuse box, the other runs around the loom to the coil (there is another wire running with this one which connects to the suppressor and also runs through the fusebox to the rev counter)
Disconnect the battery, unplug the ignition ECU, remove the fuel pump relay, disconnect the suppressor on the green wire on the coil, then continuity test from the ecu plug to the green wire that plugs onto the coil, i think you will find there is no continuity
09-01-2007, 07:38 PM
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ive got the loom out so il go bust the multi meter out and rip the tape off the loom see were i track the 2nd wire from the coil to 
it wil be going to the silver ecu right?
as the other ones a fuel computer or am i wrong
it wil be going to the silver ecu right?as the other ones a fuel computer or am i wrong
09-01-2007, 07:40 PM
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The green wires should be above the tape unless the looms been fuck around with!
Do you know what i mean?
Silver ECU - Ignition
Black ECU - Fuelling
Do you know what i mean?
Silver ECU - Ignition
Black ECU - Fuelling
Thats probably why it was down there 
09-01-2007, 07:50 PM
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Pin 1 is what you want mate.
Unplug everything i said above, and test from all 4 corner pins on the ECU plug to the green wire (obviously only 1 pin if any will show the continuity) if none do, you've found your fault
Unplug everything i said above, and test from all 4 corner pins on the ECU plug to the green wire (obviously only 1 pin if any will show the continuity) if none do, you've found your fault
09-01-2007, 07:57 PM
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your the man 
i was luking at the wires none are green so i gues they change half way some were
but stil your the man gnna try it now
i was luking at the wires none are green so i gues they change half way some were but stil your the man gnna try it now
10-01-2007, 12:57 AM
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ryt all the wires seem fine they mostley go to the black computer :S and same on my spare half rst loom just wondering wil the car start if the throttle sensor is not connected?
10-01-2007, 01:27 PM
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The car will still start with the TPS disconnected yes. That only operates the fuelling ECU.
There HAS to be a break in that one green wire, it can be nothing else?
There HAS to be a break in that one green wire, it can be nothing else?
