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Sourire


I really like the vauxhall Astra VXR, Just wonderd what you all thought of them? Are they and all round good car? I personally think they look smart as fuck. How is the build Quality in them? I want one.

Opinions please.

 

Not driven either, but looks wise I think the VXR looks loads better than the styling disaster that is the Focus ST.

I'm sure when it comes down to how they drive and handle the Ford would be better though!

 

I will agree the Astra is much better looking than the focus.

 

I'd rather have this...

 

the wheels on the blue one are shite

the red one is well nice

 

great in a straight line (as long as you hold onto the steering wheel)
round corners it's terrible

they sent it round the track with the stig at the wheel and he almost crashed going round corners, understeers worse than a smart car

 

When mags like EVO, Top Gear and Autocar have tested them round a track it's always acquitted itself reasonably well.
Take a test drive in one and see what you reckon - it's reasonably easy to get a test drive in one

 

Don't believe everything you see on Top Gear, they handle fine.

'Ring video, doesn't look terrible at all: http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?...0347052662167&

 

Yes, JC has an obvious anti-Vauxhall thing for a lot of their fwd cars.
Contrast his Vectra VXR review with the EVO mag review of the same car.....

I guess not everyone likes the same thing though

 

Absolutely gorgeous

 

not a big fan of vauxhalls, but i must say i have seen a few on the roads round here

with xenons' 19's and the TV in the dash setup they do look smart as fook though

but the renault sport megane is growing on me too. dont really think they ST looks as exciting as these two, but i can imagine its a better drive

 

So you've driven one then ?

As has been said on here already the TG test was a load of pants with Clarksons general Vauxhall dislike and in fact the car they used was an early development car with different suspension so again does not reflect the cars sold to the public.

If you want to find out more information and actually get comments from people who actually drive the cars check out VXR Online at :-

http://www.vxronline.co.uk/

 

I know someone who got one brand new, hes talking about getting rid of it already as the traction is shite, even before its tuned.
Running costs are stupid too

 

yes, my mate works at the vauxhall dealer just down the road and i tend to get a "test drive" with him in most of the newer motors (gong back as far as having a pootle in a lotus carlton as well )

i somehow dooubt that even jc could get the stig to power understeer into a cameraman, no matter how much he hates them cars

the problem has always been the same with fwd vauxhalls, they have too much torque and it totaly overpowers the chassis
the 1.8 sri cavalier was fine, but even the 2.0 ones went mad at the wheels, and when you had a whole huge 130 brake pushing through the front wheels and you had no idea where you were going because it ust went where it wanted to go when you pressed the loud pedal....
things haven't changed with the letest generation vectra's either, either there is to much power or the traction control would kick in way to harshly
my mate had one for a few weeks which seemed to be better, but they just can't get the power down
put bigger and bigger tyres on it by all means, but it doesn't mask the problem that you have too much power going through the front wheels

 

Well then you'll know that they don't pull the steering out your hands on acceleration and they do actually go round corners as well as the similar competition.

You can make any high power FWD car regardless of make/model do the same thing by mashing the pedal to the carpet mid corner

Again that can be said for any FWD platform. The market is calling for more power/faster cars so its up to the manafacture's to try and make it work on the road hence having all the electronics etc. To restrict/limit power etc is one of the methods available to do this. Funnily enough you and TG both seem to slag off the Vectra VXR and yet EVO magazine report on it quite favourably even against the 4WD oposition. Personally I know who's opinion I respect more....

Everyone to their own and being this is Ford based site I can understand you brand loyalty, but we can all agree that high power through FWD its not going to make the best handling car in the world. Its just a shame that all the manafacture's are still going this route (I expect for cost reasons) I mean isn't the ST gonna have 280bhp. Now you can't honestly tell me that this is gonna be a great handling car based on your comments above

 

How about the thurble 888? Anyone driven one of these? I like them alot and where I live with be a much more subtle choice.

 

having a platform to handle the power is a lot more difficult that just dropping in a bigger engine
why do you think that ford limited the power output on the st?
they've put a bigger engine in to make more torque to make it mroe driveable

vxhl have decided to follow the max power route and have just upped the boost

i have yet to find the "perfect" car, soemthing that i can thrash about in as well as be able to take my kid shopping in
i just find teh mondeo a much easier more comfortable ride which is why i've got one, i've also got a fire breathing sierra estate but i can't see myself dropping junior off to school in that the schools 100 yards away and it don't get over the speed humps

the only way to find the right car for you is to go out and have a go in one, and, aftermuch testing, i find that all the vxhals tend to fal in to the same trap as pervious models, too much power, not enough control

their engiens are cracking thoguh, much better fuel economy and a fair bit more torquey through the seat of your pants, but the rest of teh package lets it down quite drasticly

 

real real bad 4 torquesteer,and shite handling,vauxhall havnt advanced any since mk2 astra 16valve if u ask me!!!

 

8 mins 36
how does this stack with focus st ???
mike r etc

 

i would prefer the red one to the blue one anyday they do look stylish,they look better than the focus.

 

They look nice from the outside but the interior is pants

 

You can make any car look bad if you want to, dont take it as representitive. ALso remember, TG is an entertainment show, not a proper car test

Yeah, cos thats a coherent argument?

oh yes, the fabled torque steer as demoed on TG with a mild movement of the wheel under acceleration?

best tell anyone on here with an rst that their cars are also total shite, because I promise you the vxr will be a better handling car in every respect.

 

Another Vauxhall Ashtray to me

 

i wouldn't have made it otherwise now would i as top gear represented yesterday, a car with less power was 2 seconds quicker round their track so power isn't everything, also, the vxr and the focus were a good few seconds apart, even the st was quicker and there is around a 25 bhp deficiet from the ford stable

 

Just to clear it up

 

i think you are missing the point here
vauxhall, instead of trying to figure out a way to tame the pwoer and torque from their engines (which are fairly good and probably that little bit better than the ford usints at most times) they have not bothered
whereas ford have kept the power the same sort of levels with the st as opposed to the rs but the torque has gone up across the range because of the extra 300 cc and cylinder, therefore making the driveability that much better

in the astra it's all or nothing, with the st it's a liniear power delivery which makes things much smoother and less snappy, even thought they are just as quick as each other in the real world straight line stakes

 

If Vauxhall have done such a bad job of the handling of the Astra compared to the Ford (in your opinion) then explain the times of both cars on Millbrooks west circuit as tested by EVO this month (in the wet may I hasten to add which is certainly an interesting prospect in any high powered FWD car )

Astra VXR

Stability On - 1.38.25
Stability Off - 1.40.65
Cornering G - 0.71

Focus ST

Stability On - 1.42.15
Stability Off - 1.43.30
Cornering G - 0.70

In fact the ST was the slowest of all hot hatches tested. Now i'm not having a pop at the ST as its a fine car. Its more a case of explaining to you that you need to get your facts straight as oposed to letting your feelings do the talking.

 

Sorry, but Dojj is not talking rubbish here. I actually WORK for a Vauxhall dealer (not the mate he is talking about though) and get to drive ALL the new cars when I want, including the Monaro VXR. Out of all the VXR range, the Monaro is the most "fun", although repair bills will be high, especially transmission and engine bills, the Vectra VXR is by far the best overall, the Zafira VXR is "different" and the Astra VXR is utter crap. Have you even tried reversing one and looking out of the rear window? It is a bloody porthole, not a window, it DOES torque-steer on anything but the most smooth road surfaces (like a racetrack, but how many people only drive on tracks instead of roads). It is a CHAV-mobile, aimed @ CHAVs. It is like the Focus RS in my opinion (all brand names and built to sell to "boyracers"), and I hate the Focus RS (sorry to all FRS owners in advance)

Yes, I am Ford @ heart, I have been working with and around them since I was 4 years old (well over 25 years now) and I would still buy a Monaro over a Falcon for example (just as proof that I am not biased towards Fords, although a GT500 Mustang might sway my decision ).

 

Quite a quick car, I had a play with one in the ECos, well he wanted to have a go at me actually....

70-120 defo held his own!! (I only pulled a couple of car lengths on him)... dust after that Im afraid, though I reckon he was still getting up to 150ish


Have to say though I think he was VERY dissapointed I slowed to 65 on the MWay and he still wouldnt come pass me


Quite pretty cars I reckon

 

Before I settled on my Focus RS, I had a go in both a VXR and an ST and, to be honest, I liked the VXR better. Mainly because it's a stunning looking car (the ST is a bit on the ugly side) but also because it is a damn fine car to drive - Clarkson & CO got this one wrong (IMHO)

Only thing that stopped me was the alarming depreciation they suffer

 

nice looking cars.

 

I test drove one a year ago now and scared myself silly so I rather like them! I drove the full fat, 19" wheels, blue calipers jobbie... It was fan-flaming-tastic in a straight line like some have said and I was on a national speed limit, single lane road in the countryside. I went round a roundabout (quite a job in that), floored it as I came out of the roundabout, like I do in my trusty Fiesta, and very nearly said an up close & personal hello to a hedge.

The look on the dealership fella's face was quality if nothing else.

 

nice looking, but the interior looks the exact same as my mothers 1.6 vectra bar the seats

 

Riiiight, why woud the monaro have hih maintenance bills? its an unstressed standard ls2 engine?? certainly going to last a lot longer than ANY 2l 4 pot turbo.

The transmission likewise is pretty bulletproff unless you abuse it?

The only issue I see is tyres and petrol tbh cos its a big fast car, like any big fast car.

I find it interesting youd swap one for a gt500 'stang tho, which while being a nice looking car is a total abortio of a design utilising technology first employed int he horse and cart to get around corners. It really is a SHOCKING car.

Your feelings on the particular market sector into which the astra and focus fall is interesting, but largely irellevant to this discussion im afraid, and if the worst you can come up with is "the rear windows too small" then go and buy a people carrier, as ALL modern mid size hatchbacks are pish by comparison to those of yesteryear.

 

Unless you abuse it!!! A VXR is brought normally by people who "abuse" them, a bit like some other types of cars (how many Cossies do you know of that have been abused in their life?).

Horse & cart technology maybe, and yes, time has moved on, but it WORKS!!! You have to drive the car, not the car drive you. And a 'Stang is more of a drivers car than a VXR or FRS EVER will be!!!

And I would still have a Vectra VXR over an Astra VXR , @ least they are "sensibly" quick.

 

Depends on your definition of abused. The T56 will be fine unless you do 6 grand launches at the pod regularly, theres a massive difference between hard driving and mechanical abuse.

And no, live axles dont work, theyre in the same league as carbs, there is just no reason to use them nowadays

 

[quote="iansoutham"]I'd rather have the VXR8....

 

[quote="alistairolsen"][quote="iansoutham"]I'm sure Nascars use a live rear axle

And when a rally car like a mk2 escort is STILL competitive in club and national motorsport nearly 30 years after its launch I dont think there is many arguments to suggest a live axle cant be made to work very well