wallopadonkey

got my replacement fuel pump as mine was dead
now bear in mind this car has been stood for 9 years!
we drained some of the old stale fuel out and put fresh in, it took a while for the pump to turn off so had a look under neath and had a cpl leaks which we sorted all of them!
ok the pump wont turn off at all it just keeps on running any ideas?

tried to start it nada

give it a few mins checked for spark - real strong
checked fuel at the inlet for the plenum thingy - fuel under pressure - good

turned over again and good fired woohoo

had to feather the throttle to keep it going and every time i let it tick over it stalled got it going for a cpl mins in the end good
little missfiire so i thought i would turn it off and clean the plugs 1 and 2 were sooty 3 lovely light brown and 4 sooty - wire brushed and replaced
then absolutely nothing!
the pump still runs continuously using a new purple relay holder and the lucas relay

my gut tells me that if the pump runs continuously it mus be delivering fuel somewhere or sucking air somewhere all the high pressure hoses down of the pump are pressurised!
could the injectors be stuck open?
cheers for help dave!
sorry about the length of the post lol

wallopadonkey

no one on passion ford got any ideas?
hell i am in trouble!
dave

XR2

Many ideas. But most of them can only be verified by taking a look at the car.

9 years is long. Fuel pump is running and delivering fuel also. So the relay is the last thing to worry about!

First problem might be the fuel filter. MUST be replaced after 9 years
Second problem might be dirt/rust inside of the tank. Get rid of everything BEFORE replacing the filter or you'll need a new one afterwards.
Third problem and maybe the main cause: Mechanical parts, gaskets and seals inside the metering head and the moving parts of the flap need fuel to keep them in working condition. Letting fuel rot inside it for 9 years is not good. Might want to try a WORKING item out of a running car.

wallopadonkey

ok i had drained the tank fully and then i put in about half a litre - 1 litre ran it through to the old filter put the banjo into a fuel can and ran it to flush the pipes through
changed the fuel filter for a new one tightened up the banjos ran tank empty then added 8 litres of optimax to make sure we had a little more octane to make up for any dead fuel in system
it did run like this after 20 mins of trying and only if i feathered the throttle with my hand on the pedal (foot was too ham fisted if you like) every time i let it tick over it stalled
then it started sounding better and better and we thought we would clean the plugs which i did with a wire brush
then nada!
took one lead off at a time and cleaned replaced before refixing

do i need a metering head from another car we have a similar age mfi cabriolet i can swap stuff with to get it going
but could do with a step by step of items to check in order to make it easier.

cheers for the reply

dave

XR2

Well I think your metering unit is stuck or leaking inside. The only way to check it would be to measure the pressure and fuel amount for each cylinder. Or just swap it for a try.

wallopadonkey

cheers for that so i should swap the metering head for another we have from a running car to see if it helps yeah?
not sure how i would ch3eck pressure / flow at each cylinder with basic diy'er tools though
cheers
for the reply

XR2

You'd need a full pressure test equipment! Got one from my local Ford dealer for the weekend.

Make sure the fuel is free of dirt and try with a working metering unit. If that helps, you will know what to change then. If not - the quest will continue

marky_g

metering head on a efi car? my pipes run straight from pump to filter to pressure reg

XR2

He's got an MFI!?

marky_g

oh yer lol, metering head it is then

wallopadonkey

thanks for the help up till now!

ok guys spent about 4 hours out there today
started with the basics again
removed all spark plugs cleaned regapped and replaced with a squirt of damp start in the spark plug hole.
removed ll the leads and replaced then in the correct order cleaning connections as i went with a squirt of electrical contact cleaner.
opened dizzy cap and the terminals were a little black sraped them and cleaned up a bit
there was a little oil in the bottom of this few drops but it was there all the same??
removed the intake hose by the manifold gave it a GOOD squirt of damp start and left it off.
removed the relay and cleaned all the terminals and added a little contact cleaner to the contacts in and out 10 or so times.
started over ran on the damp start then stopped give it a squirt into the inlet manifold runs for a second then stalled
checked fuel at cold start injector peeing out under great pressure!
relay still permanently on! with ignition only.
still nothing put the purple relay from the other car we have access to and connected the inlet pipe onto the intake manifold and IT RAN !!! couldnt believe it the relay cut the pump after a few secs and it ran a bit rattly and a bit of blue smoke from the exhaust but then it started to creep up in revs to 3000 rev it and it'd drop for a few secs then up to 3k!!

again any ideas chaps ?

XR2

So the car is running with a different relay? First problem solved.

For the second problem: Check compression, ignition AND mixture (long 3 mm inhex), set it up correctly, check for ANY air leaks between metering unit and engine (spray brake cleaner or something else everywhere, especially onto rubber parts, hose connectors and onto the gaskets between two parts).

When you've still got problems you'll have to check fuel pressures. And maybe a different set of injectors.

EDIT: Maybe the flap of the metering is stuck a little bit...

marky_g

my mfi one used to have that problem sometimes relay never cut in, but if i bridged it to run permanently to get the car started it was fine

wallopadonkey

cool at least it is progress !
i didnt touch the metering head as i dont know what i am doing with it lol
all linkages got some wd40 last night
the airbox is not clipped tight yet and the hose onto the inlet manifold is not tightened up fully tight yet
i know some of this is basic stuff but i dont know the ins and outs of these cars (actually considered putting it onto carbs!)
so i take it the slightest thing can cause funny running and stuff then
i would never of guessed leaving the intake pipe off would stop it from running at all!
thanks guys is there a guide to servicing the metering head and flap or are we just talking about carb cleaner or something to de gum it?
cheers for taking the time to answer

XR2

Pull off the big rund neck on top of the metering unit (loosen the big jubilee clip first) then you'll see the flap. When the trottle is closed, the pressure inside the hose is the same as outside, the flap isn't open, so the car is just running with idle mixture. When you open the throttle slightly, the flap also will open and give the engine the amount of fuel it needs for the air passing through flap and throttle. The more you open the throttle, the more the flap will open also (when there are no air leaks between engine and flap!).

Just open all four clips on top of the air filter box, then you can take the metering unit with the plastic cap of the box off. When you turn it, you'll see how the flap is mounted underneath. It's just like old scales. Wenn the flap opens, the other side will go down, the rod inside the metering unit also will go down and give more fuel to the injectors. Usually the oil damps from the engine are used to get some oil to this mechanism. Maybe after many years standing around the oil there was getting thick. So try some WD40 or Caramba on the moving parts and don't hesitate to clean it all with brake cleaner or something else. Flap and funnel also for sure.

And as mentioned above - when the metering unit is working - there are some more parts that might cause problems. Warm-up regulator (controls fuel pressure) and the injectors.

wallopadonkey

brilliant ! i'll have a good go at tomorrow or wednesday.
Thank you so much for the basic instructions just what i needed last thing i need is to open the wrong thing and have springs fire all over the drive lol

it has started smoking a bit i am thinking valve stem seals as it has been stood so long

it drove around the garden today the brake pedal is way too firm and the clutch works fine for now lol

thanks again for all the help especially xr2 cheers matey!
legend

XR2

Another cause for not revving higher could be a not proper working ignition advance... when the car still is running on idle ignition timing it won't rev high and produce misfire...

wallopadonkey

hi there fella it will rev higher but will not rev lower lol the idle speed is 3k rpm lol

smokes like a chimby at the moment lol

XR2

Ok. Is the engine running @3k from cold or just when it's warm?

Like told before... clean the fuel metering unit first and make sure the flap can swing free and falls down to lowest point itself.

3k is too much for a air leak, the engine would cut out because of too much air and less fuel. 3k is also too much for a wrong idle speed screw setting or a stuck auxilary air device...

turbobill

when i got mine it use to idle at 3k turned out to be the cold start valve, try unplugging it n see if that make a difference, just a idea

wallopadonkey

the 3000 rpm revs is straight from cold!

where is the cold start valve i have not had my haynes manual yet sorry for the basic questions
dave

chaffe

the cold start valve is the injector on the inlet manifold on its own, it should only squirt momentarily before you start the car, not all the time!!!!

wallopadonkey

wife has had the baby early (and on my day off too) so i will get on with the car in a few days and let ya know how i got on cheers
dave

wallopadonkey

ok it has been a while but i am back on here now!
little boy was in intensive care for a month so i had other things to worry about!

right got it running the problems were
fuel relay was stuck on we tested another relay and it cuts out as it should!

metering head was stuck and was causing the engine to tick over at 3k.
it was gummed up with a varnish lke substance believed to be due to 9 year old fuel we used carb cleaner to clean it up a bit

the fuel pump i have bought for it works fine but is more buzzy than a few others i have heard on other cars
when the car returns the fuel to the tank it sounds more like the pump is drawing air rally loud? is this right?
so i have bought a new one with a very clean cradle with it in case it is on its last legs

the oil had gone like syrup and needed to be changed in the sump but

is it safe to use wynns engine flush in one of these engines?

it went in for mot thursday and failed on 1 rear brake stuck on and 2 bulbs lol

did brake cylinders and shoes over the weekend along with front disks and pads to remove an imbalance!

i need to coat the bottom of the car next and require a sort of paint on underseal i think?? but would rather white really as i dont want it to look like a bodgers holiday in a tar pit
any ideas?

thanks for your time

XR2

Most of the things I had in mind

Yes, take care of the fuel pump. High pressure K-Jetronic ones are louder than EFI ones. And they're outside of the tank, too. When it's not running "round" and sounds like you when you try to get the last drops of coke with a straw out of the cup @McDumb or BK, there's something wrong, usually not enough fuel in tank

Change the oil first, use engine flush with new oil and filter and change oil and filter again to be sure.

For underseal black is fine. But you can also use white if you prefer

wallopadonkey

cool would you use the flush in a nice hot engine with new oil or with the old oil already in it?

then leave it for a day or so to get all the last drips out?

do you know a white underseal product that is good?

i tend to use a tetrosyl black one with waxoil but have never seen a white one?
many thanks

the fuel was dead low and it is a little better now i have put another tenner in it

however the needle was not on the red at all so would of thought it had some left in it
set tickover to 1000 rpm tonight and it was fine for over an hour
not a flicker, got an injection cleaner to give it a shot as well

XR2

Fill your fuel tank to the top and apply the injection cleaner.

I'd get the old oil out of the engine as soon as possible, use the flush like it should be with new oil and change the oil afterwards again.

Not quite sure which underseal products you've got over there

wallopadonkey

you are a star!!

flush wont damage the hydrolic tappets though no?

XR2

Should be fine. But after nine years you'd probably have to fit new tappets in any case.

wallopadonkey

it doesnt sound at all tappety at the moment and it aint smoking either lol
drove it the other day and it seemed to go well to be fair there was a serious wobble which i thought was due to badly worn/broken rubber bushes turned out to be both front wheels were loose lol
dave