Looking for a bit of advice about where to go next for more power...
10-08-2010, 11:49 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
Looking for a bit of advice about where to go next for more power...
Right to get started, i have a Saph Cosworth with the following spec:
200 block
Low comp pistons
Lightened and balanced bottom end and flywheel
Ported and flowed head with BD10 cams and bronze valve guides
Kent alloy vernier pulleys
T.34 turbo with .63 housing (Turbo technics stage 3 i believe)
Green injectors
Stage 3 chip
3 bar map sensor
RS 500 intercooler
Alloy radiator with twin fans
Full mongoose ss exhaust
K&N cone with alloy trumpet
Samcos
With this, the car when last rolling roaded produced 317bhp at the wheels.
This was all done when i bought the car and am now craving more power, as it will be going off the road for winter i am keen to increase the power and hopefully see 400bhp+.
Could i have some info on what i would require on top of what i have please?
I'm thinking along the lines of bigger turbo, bigger injectors, remap anyway. Just not sure what i may not be thinking about and should be. One thing in the back of my mind is the conrods and crank, what are they capable of handling as standard as i have no indication of stronger rods.
Cheers
Scott
200 block
Low comp pistons
Lightened and balanced bottom end and flywheel
Ported and flowed head with BD10 cams and bronze valve guides
Kent alloy vernier pulleys
T.34 turbo with .63 housing (Turbo technics stage 3 i believe)
Green injectors
Stage 3 chip
3 bar map sensor
RS 500 intercooler
Alloy radiator with twin fans
Full mongoose ss exhaust
K&N cone with alloy trumpet
Samcos
With this, the car when last rolling roaded produced 317bhp at the wheels.
This was all done when i bought the car and am now craving more power, as it will be going off the road for winter i am keen to increase the power and hopefully see 400bhp+.
Could i have some info on what i would require on top of what i have please?
I'm thinking along the lines of bigger turbo, bigger injectors, remap anyway. Just not sure what i may not be thinking about and should be. One thing in the back of my mind is the conrods and crank, what are they capable of handling as standard as i have no indication of stronger rods.
Cheers
Scott
10-08-2010, 12:11 PM
#2
Turbo is fine you need more boost and uprated injectors to supply the fuel, I.E Bosch 403 (Greys) or Siemens 55LB and obviously a remap or a remapped chip to suit.
The radiator and that doesn't do anything to the power.
The bottom end will easily cope with 500BHP+, the exception to this would be if you still had the 205 block which can be a bit of a lottery with this sort of power but you have the stronger 200 block and so that is fine.
Martin
The radiator and that doesn't do anything to the power.
The bottom end will easily cope with 500BHP+, the exception to this would be if you still had the 205 block which can be a bit of a lottery with this sort of power but you have the stronger 200 block and so that is fine.
Martin
10-08-2010, 02:46 PM
#4
I've found that life I needed.. It's HERE!!
Thread Starter
Turbo is fine you need more boost and uprated injectors to supply the fuel, I.E Bosch 403 (Greys) or Siemens 55LB and obviously a remap or a remapped chip to suit.
The radiator and that doesn't do anything to the power.
The bottom end will easily cope with 500BHP+, the exception to this would be if you still had the 205 block which can be a bit of a lottery with this sort of power but you have the stronger 200 block and so that is fine.
Martin
The radiator and that doesn't do anything to the power.
The bottom end will easily cope with 500BHP+, the exception to this would be if you still had the 205 block which can be a bit of a lottery with this sort of power but you have the stronger 200 block and so that is fine.
Martin
Ah, good point Rog, don't know about the pump, will have to look into that, any suggestions for one that would be decent? The manifold i would imagine will be the 2wd one, just for checking though - how do i tell the difference? Which one is better? Yep it's a decent cooler.
10-08-2010, 04:44 PM
#5
20K+ Super Poster.
First thing I would do is rewire the fuel pump and the fan circuit.
The crank rods and pistons are good for 500 at least as said, I assume you have pocketed pistons ?, decide what power you want, and why, can be better having a less powerful but better torqueier motor depending on use of the car and driving style.
Defo need higher rated injectors, with map or chip to suit.
317@wheels is a bit enthusiastic for your present set up, don't overlook the many advantages of a lightened flywheel, performance for the outlay is hard to beat.
tabetha
The crank rods and pistons are good for 500 at least as said, I assume you have pocketed pistons ?, decide what power you want, and why, can be better having a less powerful but better torqueier motor depending on use of the car and driving style.
Defo need higher rated injectors, with map or chip to suit.
317@wheels is a bit enthusiastic for your present set up, don't overlook the many advantages of a lightened flywheel, performance for the outlay is hard to beat.
tabetha
10-08-2010, 05:28 PM
#6
I've found that life I needed.. It's HERE!!
Thread Starter
First thing I would do is rewire the fuel pump and the fan circuit.
The crank rods and pistons are good for 500 at least as said, I assume you have pocketed pistons ?, decide what power you want, and why, can be better having a less powerful but better torqueier motor depending on use of the car and driving style.
Defo need higher rated injectors, with map or chip to suit.
317@wheels is a bit enthusiastic for your present set up, don't overlook the many advantages of a lightened flywheel, performance for the outlay is hard to beat.
tabetha
The crank rods and pistons are good for 500 at least as said, I assume you have pocketed pistons ?, decide what power you want, and why, can be better having a less powerful but better torqueier motor depending on use of the car and driving style.
Defo need higher rated injectors, with map or chip to suit.
317@wheels is a bit enthusiastic for your present set up, don't overlook the many advantages of a lightened flywheel, performance for the outlay is hard to beat.
tabetha
To be honest i just feel like making it a faster car, i don't have a certain driving style in mind, it is a very good driver at the moment, good enough for around town and when opened up is also very good, it's just a bit of greed that has made me think about this. If i can get some more horse and torque without going mad with mods or crazy money, i'd like to...
What do you mean about 317 at the wheels being a bit enthusiastic exactly, a bit much for the set up maybe? I do have a lightened flywheel, could you maybe elaborate a bit on potential overlooked advantages, etc?
Thanks
Last edited by Lowson; 10-08-2010 at 05:29 PM.
10-08-2010, 07:41 PM
#7
Yes the fan wiring was substandard to start with many went back under warrenty when new because of it, the main problem is the span of the switch the fans when they do work come on to soon and then won't go off or take sooo long that it melts the fuse.
The fuel pump also being a juicy component can not get the power it needs under load due to the aged wiring and so can lead to a meltdown!
He means that 317HP sounds a bit optimistic for the setup, this would power @ flywheel for this spec, is that what you meant?
I think idea of lightened flywheel is better acceleration, and for freeer revving.
Martin
The fuel pump also being a juicy component can not get the power it needs under load due to the aged wiring and so can lead to a meltdown!
He means that 317HP sounds a bit optimistic for the setup, this would power @ flywheel for this spec, is that what you meant?
I think idea of lightened flywheel is better acceleration, and for freeer revving.
Martin
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10-08-2010, 08:12 PM
#9
Yo, the pump you want is a 044 one made by bosch, what the majority of modded cossies use, the 044 relates to the last three numbers of the part number, this together with a proper rewire usng a feed direct from the battery and a switched earth and relay controlled by the original wiring. You can buy the looms on here/ebay or get a diagram and do it yourself, i bought the loom as I wanted i to look neat and it looks more "pro", plus i couldn't be arsed making it myself. 
general rule of thumb is 4x4 manifold upto 400 & 2WD beyond if i remember correctly, also 4x4 is allegedly better for torque which is important, though some may be able to elaborate on this. 2WD manifold is 2 piece, 4WD 1 piece, 2WD has a hanger joined onto the head, 4x4 doesn't. That should cover it 4 now. IMO i'd slap on some siemens blacks and a better chip, thats what I intended to do but given up 4 justnow.
general rule of thumb is 4x4 manifold upto 400 & 2WD beyond if i remember correctly, also 4x4 is allegedly better for torque which is important, though some may be able to elaborate on this. 2WD manifold is 2 piece, 4WD 1 piece, 2WD has a hanger joined onto the head, 4x4 doesn't. That should cover it 4 now. IMO i'd slap on some siemens blacks and a better chip, thats what I intended to do but given up 4 justnow.
Last edited by rog; 10-08-2010 at 08:14 PM.
11-08-2010, 08:13 AM
#10
20K+ Super Poster.
Lightened flywheel in terms of difference/benefit per pound spent is awsome.
The engine is much freer revving gear changes at high rpm become better as engine speed dies so much quicker without the inertia of the very heavy standard flywheel.
If there is a downside it is that you may need to use a few hundred more rpm when pulling away, or slip the clutch a tad longer as you let it up, as there will be less inertia to assist when pulling away, but once moving it's all plus points.
The point I am trying to make about power and torque is your car could feel much more powerful/torquier to you with say for example a smaller turbine housing where it will boost much earlier, so in everyday driving would be "better", some would prefer this, some like screamers, bit like a civic type r a awsome car in it'sown right, bit like a 2 stroke bike nothing nothing nothing shit too much, nothing power wise, depends what you like a engine with better low down torque will feel faster in everyday driving, but won't at much higher speeds.
If wanting overall improvements I wouldn't overlook the advantage a live map session will give you, chips by their nature can't exploit the ultimate out of every car they're fitted to, but mapping does just that, bad example but my ea chip over a map on a different ecu saw me pick up 30odd bhp for 9.5psi LESS boost, yes the ea chip was that bad, had less bhp on ea stage3 than GGR stage one, despite being some 10 psi higher boost, hard to believe I've still got the printouts that show it.
Doesn't matter whose chip etc you go with I'd seriously get all your mods done then live mapped, be the best money spent in terms of refinement and running.
tabetha
The engine is much freer revving gear changes at high rpm become better as engine speed dies so much quicker without the inertia of the very heavy standard flywheel.
If there is a downside it is that you may need to use a few hundred more rpm when pulling away, or slip the clutch a tad longer as you let it up, as there will be less inertia to assist when pulling away, but once moving it's all plus points.
The point I am trying to make about power and torque is your car could feel much more powerful/torquier to you with say for example a smaller turbine housing where it will boost much earlier, so in everyday driving would be "better", some would prefer this, some like screamers, bit like a civic type r a awsome car in it'sown right, bit like a 2 stroke bike nothing nothing nothing shit too much, nothing power wise, depends what you like a engine with better low down torque will feel faster in everyday driving, but won't at much higher speeds.
If wanting overall improvements I wouldn't overlook the advantage a live map session will give you, chips by their nature can't exploit the ultimate out of every car they're fitted to, but mapping does just that, bad example but my ea chip over a map on a different ecu saw me pick up 30odd bhp for 9.5psi LESS boost, yes the ea chip was that bad, had less bhp on ea stage3 than GGR stage one, despite being some 10 psi higher boost, hard to believe I've still got the printouts that show it.
Doesn't matter whose chip etc you go with I'd seriously get all your mods done then live mapped, be the best money spent in terms of refinement and running.
tabetha
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