McPikie

I have been told that the 1800 block will fit straight into my MK2 XR2............ is this true??? I was told the 1600 Headgasket and timing belt should be used.

I've cracked the block on the XR2, not bad, but it is using water and I clocked an 1800 in the scrappers on sunday.

Your advice is appreciated

Keith B

The 1800 Sierra was rated at 90bhp but had a fair old bit of torque. The 1600CVH in the Orion was rated at 96bhp (these are carb fed engines from '90)
I think the g'box mounting might be different? different blot holes? Anyone got any better info?

McPikie

I am gonna use my XR2 box as its belting with no probs. I think I will have to use my xr2 flywheel.

I just think that the 1800 will give me more grunt

Sticky.

iTrader: (4)

You've got PM mate

Thrush

iTrader: (1)

The 1800 won't fit straight in, no. You have to modify the sump. I don't know all the details, but I was gonna do this with my 3i a while back and spoke to someone on the Interford forum who had done it. Stick a thread up over there ( www.interford.co.uk/forums ) and ask - sure they guy who done it will post up for ya

McPikie

Large hammer???

Sticky.

iTrader: (4)

[McPikie,
Thats the spirit lad

XRTypeRS

I have one of these. The 1800 is essentially the same block as the US 1900. Mine is fitted with a zetec fiesta sump like a ZVH, tho I think the 1600 CVH sump will also bolt on.

However you will need to get hold of some proper pistons if you are going to turbo it, the 1800 CVH ones are VERY weak and wont handle any abuse. The 1800 is also 88 mm stroke so you get plently of torque (I got 241 lb/ft at 1 bar boost) but like a ZVH it wont rev as well as a 1600.

Good luck

Stu

McPikie

I aint turboing it, its litrally gonna be a straight sawp for my 1600 carb fed block.

But will the mounts be in the same position because, at the end of the day, surely its just a CVH block with a longer stroke crank in it????

XRTypeRS

My mounts are in the completey standard position and my mounts are not modified.

Your right 88mm stroke, 82 mm bore (hence can use 1600 gasket), block is about 1cm taller I think.

McPikie

Winner, best get my spanners at the ready then

Versus_Creations

iTrader: (1)

1800 is not a very good engine, you would be better off putting a 1600 back in. IMO

McPikie

Can you explain why for me Jano??

Versus_Creations

iTrader: (1)

I cant be bothered cos the engine aint worth talking about dude....

McPikie

That's not very constructive is it Jano???

Surely being a bigger stroke it would dish out more torque than the 1600

Versus_Creations

iTrader: (1)

Sorry to put a downer on it cos i didnt wanna do that, but the truth is that most 1800 cvh's are just smokey muvva fukas that tap and stink.


Specialised Engines use these components to Turbo Charge

McPikie

Surely its the top end that taps????

And as for smokey, would this not be due to either rings or stem seals???

I will be using my XR2 head, I just want the bottom end and thought that 1800 would be better than 1600

Versus_Creations

iTrader: (1)

its upto you what you do maytee, i was just giving you my opinion.

McPikie

You gave your opinion without due facts tho mate. If the bottom end was fine would it be better or worse???

Simple really isnt it

Keith B

It has alot more torque than the 1600 but wont rev as well. it has a long stroke as i said stock it makes 90bhp where as the 1600 makes 96bhp

McPikie

But keith, is torque better than BHP????

The most this thing gets is traffic light GP's

M Brian

it doesnt make ALOT more torque - think there is a maximum of 10lb/ft in it

if you just stick the 1800 bottom end on then you will have a low compression engine - which wont be overlly powerful

the 1600 sump really doesnt want to fit on the 1800 block - and the oil pump etc wont fit...

what people do is modify the 1800 sump by cutting and welding the deep part of the 1600 sump on to it. (you have to mod the pick up pipe then)


stick to the 1600 and see if you can pick up a reasonable modded one with ported head - should give much better results.

turbocab

i put a 1800 cvh in my escort when it was 3i had down pipe mad and the fly wheel one hole will have to filed out

M Brian

oh and the 1800 is only 1769cc unlike the zetec 1796cc

so youre only talking 172cc difference - say 10% --- so if everything was kept exactly the same -- youd be talking 10bhp more - for equivalent power per litre...

knock off your low comp ratio that you'll get..... knock off the lower revs due to the undersquare bore/stroke, lose efficiencies with short rods and higher stresses --- and if it makes 10bhp more than your standard xr2 ill be amazed!!!

ferriday engineering do a 1800cvh based on this block - but its not a simple bolt it all together hope for the best kinda jobby - i.e. it has zetec pistons etc

Thrush

iTrader: (1)

Sorry Jano - your talking crap mate....

Reason most 1800CVH Sierra's are somkey old pieces of shit are cos most are ragged to fuck or over-used workhorses and the rings are fried and valve stems fooked, and power wise the reason it is held back behind the XR3i's and the like is cos of the shitty CFi fuel system (and also the head has crap flow properties)

I have seen rebuilt 1800 bottom ends mated to the XR2 1600 head with a few choice mods (zorst, filter, re-jet carb, cam) make over 150/160bhp, which not a massive lot compared to what you'd get with those mods on a std 1600 block, but the torque was 20-25%higher than you would get normally - and torque is what matters

True they don't rev as well as the 16's due to the long stroke - so change the box. Put an early mk3 XR3 box in there - they have much lower ratio's and whilst it won't let you get 60 in 2nd gear, it does let you whip thru the gears faster

Pikie - get over to Interford Forums and post up there mate - you'll get far more "usefull" info for what you want mate

M Brian

150-160 bhp???!!

for a low comp 1769cc cvh on a single carb???

PF bens was reported to be around that - but that had all the pistons etc changed...
and in later articles the figures were only shown to be around the same 145bhp with twin carbs on.

B11GNS

I owned a frst ages ago and that had a sierra 1800 bottom end, cant tell you how it was done as the previous owner done the work but it was pretty quick though and a very nice engine. Go for it i'd say Just make sure you do it properly though

James

Heres the situation; 1.8 CVH sierra with a cracked piston, no-one lists new items anymore and changing the engine is just to much hassle + i may be able to get my hands on 1.8 Zetec pistons cheap/free.

Question is; what will happen if you mate 1.8 Zetec pistons in a 1.8CVH block with 1.8CVH head? - Will the Zetec pistons go in with CVH small end bearings/greadgin pin [sp?] and con rods ok? Will it run too low CR for n/a use? The bore sizes are under 1mm difference? - O/s rings?

thanking yous,..

XRTypeRS

James, give Ferriday engineering a call (http://www.ferriday.co.uk). Im sure they will be able to help. I would have thought that your engine will need to be bored to get the 1800 zetec pistons to fit as I believe they are marginally bigger in diameter.

I belive Ive got zetec pistons in my bottom end put I have never had the sump off so I dont really know!.

M Brian

the zetec pistons as you say stu are bigger at circa 81mm where as the cvh is circa 79.96 or something like.

if you keep the 1.8 head then the CR will go to about 10.5 CR I reckon... - just estimating based on the dish in the 1800 pistons (zetec are flat)

not sure if the zetec pistons fit straight onto the 1800 rods - but I assume they do. if anyone has a zetec rod or piston handy to measure the width of the con rod then I could tell you.

the gudgeon pin should be the same diameter as most fords are.

ooooh and stu 241lb/ft??!!! get your sig updated then without the "does it really need a turbo with that low boost" setting

Zetec Andy

what a load of bollox

Mines an 1800 CVH and has done 128,000 miles, no taps, no smoke and no smell

CarlRsT

I was gonna go this route but was advised not to bother but thats on a turbo not na so I've gone down the zvh route instead

McPikie I've a 1.8 sat in my garage if u wanna buy the bottom end. . . . . ???

M Brian

the 1800 ch shoudl rattle less than a 1600 due to the design of the followers and reduced cam wear due to rollers.

XRTypeRS

Melv, 241 lb/ft is fine and Dandy except my car is now running like a dog since I finally decided to get the boost (see my other posts ). At this rate I'll be going back to and sticking to 8psi as I cant be doing with this grief...