Very laggy Cosworth? Will a cam help?
#1
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My mate just bought a Saff with 402 bhp but it's very laggy
Spec is
200 block mahle Pistons
4wd head/standard cams
4wd inlet
Turbo technics t38.63
Light blues
All the normal exhaust/3bar/500 cooler etc
Doesn't seem to one on full boost till 4-4.5k rpm
Well I ended up melting it on the way home (no4)
Will a bd14 inlet cam help with the lag or make it worse?
I take it bd10/s are no good for this spec?
Spec is
200 block mahle Pistons
4wd head/standard cams
4wd inlet
Turbo technics t38.63
Light blues
All the normal exhaust/3bar/500 cooler etc
Doesn't seem to one on full boost till 4-4.5k rpm
Well I ended up melting it on the way home (no4)
Will a bd14 inlet cam help with the lag or make it worse?
I take it bd10/s are no good for this spec?
#2
Regular Contributor
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My mate just bought a Saff with 402 bhp but it's very laggy
Spec is
200 block mahle Pistons
4wd head/standard cams
4wd inlet
Turbo technics t38.63
Light blues
All the normal exhaust/3bar/500 cooler etc
Doesn't seem to one on full boost till 4-4.5k rpm
Well I ended up melting it on the way home (no4)
Will a bd14 inlet cam help with the lag or make it worse?
I take it bd10/s are no good for this spec?
Spec is
200 block mahle Pistons
4wd head/standard cams
4wd inlet
Turbo technics t38.63
Light blues
All the normal exhaust/3bar/500 cooler etc
Doesn't seem to one on full boost till 4-4.5k rpm
Well I ended up melting it on the way home (no4)
Will a bd14 inlet cam help with the lag or make it worse?
I take it bd10/s are no good for this spec?
#4
It Wasnt Me!
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What do you want? power or driveability?
theres a few ways you can get round it:
Roller bearing core
Smaller exhaust housing (or turbo)
if you're on standard cams then you'd need to have a smaller lobe to make more power low down which defeats the purpose of having a big turbo..
ALS
theres a few ways you can get round it:
Roller bearing core
Smaller exhaust housing (or turbo)
if you're on standard cams then you'd need to have a smaller lobe to make more power low down which defeats the purpose of having a big turbo..
ALS
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#6
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It's because it's got a T38, they're shit
seriously, a T34 will do 400BHP, just run out of puff towards top of the rev range, i have honestly never been in a car with a T38 and liked it, i have always thought them to be crap.
If you've got the money, get a twin scroll turbo slapped on it, with regards to model i couldn't recommend any particular one, but if you don.t want to spend the money, T34.63 ans siemens 55lb. Perfect combination and will see 380bhp and i can guarantee it'll be better than the T38 piece of poop.
seriously, a T34 will do 400BHP, just run out of puff towards top of the rev range, i have honestly never been in a car with a T38 and liked it, i have always thought them to be crap.
If you've got the money, get a twin scroll turbo slapped on it, with regards to model i couldn't recommend any particular one, but if you don.t want to spend the money, T34.63 ans siemens 55lb. Perfect combination and will see 380bhp and i can guarantee it'll be better than the T38 piece of poop.
Last edited by AJC; 28-01-2016 at 07:09 AM.
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It's my mates car & tbh he is just gonna use it for the summer & maybe sell it
Just while the engines in bits I was wondering if I should change a cam to help
It will go get set up when built
I had an rs turbo 4wd Cosworth with a t38 & it was awesome but had different cams, head work etc
Just while the engines in bits I was wondering if I should change a cam to help
It will go get set up when built
I had an rs turbo 4wd Cosworth with a t38 & it was awesome but had different cams, head work etc
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#9
cossie fan (unluckerly)
#10
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from engenering place .every stage hp have the right itercooler not bigger not smaller .there are maths that calculate the right size for the intercooler and the capacity measures in cfm .the rs 500 is large for the stage 400hp .is made for rs500 and 500 + hp ..we made a test years ago in 400hp 4x4 with pro alloy coller ..the car was lagy and we tryied with smaller cooler half size and the car was much better also the tubes 3 inches are very big need smaller ..the cams was big bd16 bd 14 we fit other smaller and we made higher cr .the result was better
#11
cossie fan (unluckerly)
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from engenering place .every stage hp have the right itercooler not bigger not smaller .there are maths that calculate the right size for the intercooler and the capacity measures in cfm .the rs 500 is large for the stage 400hp .is made for rs500 and 500 + hp ..we made a test years ago in 400hp 4x4 with pro alloy coller ..the car was lagy and we tryied with smaller cooler half size and the car was much better also the tubes 3 inches are very big need smaller ..the cams was big bd16 bd 14 we fit other smaller and we made higher cr .the result was better
#12
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It's because it's got a T38, they're shit
seriously, a T34 will do 400BHP, just run out of puff towards top of the rev range, i have honestly never been in a car with a T38 and liked it, i have always thought them to be crap.
If you've got the money, get a twin scroll turbo slapped on it, with regards to model i couldn't recommend any particular one, but if you don.t want to spend the money, T34.63 ans siemens 55lb. Perfect combination and will see 380bhp and i can guarantee it'll be better than the T38 piece of poop.
seriously, a T34 will do 400BHP, just run out of puff towards top of the rev range, i have honestly never been in a car with a T38 and liked it, i have always thought them to be crap.
If you've got the money, get a twin scroll turbo slapped on it, with regards to model i couldn't recommend any particular one, but if you don.t want to spend the money, T34.63 ans siemens 55lb. Perfect combination and will see 380bhp and i can guarantee it'll be better than the T38 piece of poop.
#13
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Why have you got such a low opinion of the T38 ? I have one with a billet compressor wheel and with all the other mods I have made it is superb! Lack of lag and quick spool up is what mine delivers. Its like anything you do, you have to have all the right stuff to get the best out of it. I can guarantee you would be impressed if you came out in mine.
#14
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I think it depends weather you have it mapped right nothing wrong with laggy turbos if mapped correct then it's down to the driver if you know how to pilot then I'd run an old t4 against any new stuff it's all nonsense these days if you have a specked engine by a reputable builder then it works home built guess work is a waste of time been there done that.its ok to self guess a stage 3 spec anything above in my opinion is specialist job or it youwill never get best out of what you have
#15
cossie fan (unluckerly)
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I think it depends weather you have it mapped right nothing wrong with laggy turbos if mapped correct then it's down to the driver if you know how to pilot then I'd run an old t4 against any new stuff it's all nonsense these days if you have a specked engine by a reputable builder then it works home built guess work is a waste of time been there done that.its ok to self guess a stage 3 spec anything above in my opinion is specialist job or it youwill never get best out of what you have
#16
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Why have you got such a low opinion of the T38 ? I have one with a billet compressor wheel and with all the other mods I have made it is superb! Lack of lag and quick spool up is what mine delivers. Its like anything you do, you have to have all the right stuff to get the best out of it. I can guarantee you would be impressed if you came out in mine.
My mate had a 4wd on a T38, imo it had the lag of a T4 and the pull of a T34, so was shit.
2wd cos, T38 fitted, really didn't impress me at all. It may just be me with the odd bad experience of them
#17
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My old Saff G88 had a UT T38 on it and it was a dog of a turbo, pulled well top end after Karl had mapped it but very lethargic, I think the TT T38 however is a different animal.
#19
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Not sure I agree with you tbh,if your engine is speced right the t4 will see most off Mike rainbirds car is a good example t4 right spec good pilot =see what I mean I have a well spec t4 car as well not quite mikes spec and nothing cosworth wise yet to impress me and yes I've had a play with these twin scroll jobby and I wasn't stunned beyond belief thing is James you can have all the power in the world,makes no sensse all the rolling roads graphs it's all talk,a speced engine done right with any turbo combining revving to 8500 is a weapon especially when it's a chunky old t4 lol...
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Staffi (29-01-2016)
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#28
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My t38 with billet compressor was built by Vince at CR turbos and works really well on my 2wd. The most usual comment from anyone that has been out with me is " fucking hell this is an animal"
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Not sure I agree with you tbh,if your engine is speced right the t4 will see most off Mike rainbirds car is a good example t4 right spec good pilot =see what I mean I have a well spec t4 car as well not quite mikes spec and nothing cosworth wise yet to impress me and yes I've had a play with these twin scroll jobby and I wasn't stunned beyond belief thing is James you can have all the power in the world,makes no sensse all the rolling roads graphs it's all talk,a speced engine done right with any turbo combining revving to 8500 is a weapon especially when it's a chunky old t4 lol...
#34
cossie fan (unluckerly)
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Not sure I agree with you tbh,if your engine is speced right the t4 will see most off Mike rainbirds car is a good example t4 right spec good pilot =see what I mean I have a well spec t4 car as well not quite mikes spec and nothing cosworth wise yet to impress me and yes I've had a play with these twin scroll jobby and I wasn't stunned beyond belief thing is James you can have all the power in the world,makes no sensse all the rolling roads graphs it's all talk,a speced engine done right with any turbo combining revving to 8500 is a weapon especially when it's a chunky old t4 lol...
Last edited by ajamesc; 01-02-2016 at 02:18 PM.
#35
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ajamesc. Would you say a 2014 540 bhp twin turbo Porsche 911 has modern technology?
I have told this before but my 2wd Saff with its "old fashioned T38 etc" had a race with one and it was on a nice long stretch of dual carriageway. from 50mph up to silly speed it could not pull away from me and when the guy was turning off a few miles on he pulled over onto the hard shoulder, put his window down and shouted across to me,"fuck me what have you got under the bonnet of that, I have never had any car that can keep up with me" He was going to the Porsche owners day at Beaulieu Motor Museum and I wondered if he told any of his mates that an old 1990 Sapphire Cosworth was as quick as his Ł98000 Porsche! I must admit I was in a bit of shock myself as I thought it would have left me for dead!
I have told this before but my 2wd Saff with its "old fashioned T38 etc" had a race with one and it was on a nice long stretch of dual carriageway. from 50mph up to silly speed it could not pull away from me and when the guy was turning off a few miles on he pulled over onto the hard shoulder, put his window down and shouted across to me,"fuck me what have you got under the bonnet of that, I have never had any car that can keep up with me" He was going to the Porsche owners day at Beaulieu Motor Museum and I wondered if he told any of his mates that an old 1990 Sapphire Cosworth was as quick as his Ł98000 Porsche! I must admit I was in a bit of shock myself as I thought it would have left me for dead!
Last edited by cossynut2; 01-02-2016 at 04:55 PM.
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#36
cossie fan (unluckerly)
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ajamesc. Would you say a 2014 540 bhp twin turbo Porsche 911 has modern technology?
I have told this before but my 2wd Saff with its "old fashioned T38 etc" had a race with one and it was on a nice long stretch of dual carriageway. from 50mph up to silly speed it could not pull away from me and when the guy was turning off a few miles on he pulled over onto the hard shoulder, put his window down and shouted across to me,"fuck me what have you got under the bonnet of that, I have never had any car that can keep up with me" He was going to the Porsche owners day at Beaulieu Motor Museum and I wondered if he told any of his mates that an old 1990 Sapphire Cosworth was as quick as his Ł98000 Porsche!
I have told this before but my 2wd Saff with its "old fashioned T38 etc" had a race with one and it was on a nice long stretch of dual carriageway. from 50mph up to silly speed it could not pull away from me and when the guy was turning off a few miles on he pulled over onto the hard shoulder, put his window down and shouted across to me,"fuck me what have you got under the bonnet of that, I have never had any car that can keep up with me" He was going to the Porsche owners day at Beaulieu Motor Museum and I wondered if he told any of his mates that an old 1990 Sapphire Cosworth was as quick as his Ł98000 Porsche!
Last edited by ajamesc; 02-02-2016 at 07:53 PM.
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Nice to see opinions from both sides here.....
Could get messy though....
Cheers Paul
Could get messy though....
Cheers Paul