turbotrev

As per title, what turbo options are there 600/650hp Cossie YB people?
Not Borg Warner efr's though.

GT35 or bigger?
Big Hybrid T4's?
Any others?

Cheers Paul

The Enigma

Borg Warner EFR 7670 twin scroll is around 600bhp or you could go 8374 (which is good for 700+) in the same product range.

Mark Shead

Why the compromise away from a Efr. A gt35 will work but on a Yb it's a bit of a dog with lag. Hybrids at that level are shit.
Then if you want to keep it on a 2wd you have to find one that don't hit the head.

Mark

jontysafe

I would be going Owen developments GTX35.

ajamesc

Only advice worth taking at that power level is marks. No point building an engine like that because it's not cheap done right for it to be laggy and not perform well

turbotrev

I did say not efr turbos in the post.....

Just interested in what other alternatives are out there.

Compromise, just because of the cost.
I wouldn't at this point in time lay out 3k to swap to a Borg Warner.
Although I'd still like to experience one.

what size housings does a standard Gtx35 have?

Cheers Paul

Caddyshack

I would lower the spec and get the efr turbo, I expect an efr equipped car under 500 would out perform the 600 laggy engine in 90% of instances.

Nothing about 600 to 650 bhp is going to be long term cheap.

Mark Shead

At 700hp turbo is bigger than it needs to be.

Mark

Mark Shead

The question you need to add is what manifold and wastegate arrangement you are going to be using.

Mark

turbotrev

Modded 2wd manifold, external waste gate, screamer pipe, l8 ecu.

I don't know why people keep mentioning efr turbos, I said NON efr alternatives!

Cheers Paul

Mark Shead

So you are looking for a t3 flanged external gated turbo. For me and it has average performance a gt35 is prob the only way to go.

Mark

turbotrev

Nice one. Just a standard 35?
What Hp will of of them max out at?
When (roughly) do they make full boost?

Cheers Paul

Mark Shead

Around 630hp and about 5k full boost. It's a laggy beast a gtx 35 will give a bit more power and a bit less surge.

Mark

turbotrev

What's the difference in a gt and a gtx? The shrouded compressor housing?

Is that similar turbo to what Rod and Dave YUM used to run?

Cheers Paul

Mark Shead

Dave had a gt35 rear and t04z comp wheel. Rod had a t4 a gt35 a gt4088 a gt4094 a gt4202 a gtx4202 and now has a 9180.
I have mapped t4 with diff comp wheels diff comp wheels and covers. Hta turbos holset.
I have lost count on how many other hybrid units. There is only 1 manufactor that I currently recommend due to using current tech and not just a rehash of old parts to improve there sales.

Mark

Caddyshack

It is called advice, be thankful for the people that dispense it. You can waste a lot of money on the wrong spec. The world of turbos has moved on and if you go to all the expense of the old fashioned set up that money gets you a long way towards the better stuff. Good luck with whatever you end up with and I hope you like it.

turbotrev

Fair enough Mark, cheers for the info.
I do know where your coming from buddy.
What are the T04Z turbos rated too?

I do appreciate advice mate but not when people post replies about efr turbos and I stated in the first post non efr turbo alternatives!
I've read and heard lots about them so feel I'm pretty up to speed how how good they are thanks.

Cheers Paul

Mark Shead

T04z is over 700hp but is a old unit like most of the Garrett range and only upgrades are billet comp wheels with old tech rear ends and that's where the main prob is. Changing the front end to higher flow just brings surge.
For me the best gtx is the 35 where all the others bring to the party is surge.

Mark

turbotrev

Good info thanks!

Cheers Paul

eel-roy-t5r

why do you not want to use the efr turbos , seem to be the best of the bunch atm , if I had the funds that's what I would be looking at getting

grcossie

What about the twinscroll Garrett turbos??

3doorcozmess

Exactly funds, probably why paul has said alternatives.

Hellraiser

How much is an Efr rated at 600-650 bhp ? Compared to alternative models like gtx35? I'm currently building engine for this power level n I will deffo be goin Borg Warner route, I just save up a bit longer! I wanna do it right first time . Turbo is small cost in my eyes compared to rest of work/parts cost to get to that power level

3doorcozmess

Look on turbo dynamics web site for a cost of an EFR, manifold will cost you roughly 1k for a good a T4 fitment.

jamie956

How about Precision Turbos seam to be the main choice in the US along with FuelTech ECU's.

Mark Shead

At the power level he is asking for the exhaust wheel is a bit short and the housing don't flow very well.
If you want a twin scroll version that works ok is the gt4088 this works well but can't match a Efr for response.

Mark

turbotrev

I was also just generally interested on what alternatives there are out there.
I didn't say i'd never use one.....

Cheers Paul

turbotrev

Did Garrett do a twin scroll t4?

Cheers Paul

Mark Shead

T4 what as that's a flange pattern to me. The gt4088 is t4 flange. A Cossie t4 has a t3 flange.

Mark

ajamesc

I see a few tuners are playing with borg's now

Rod-Tarry

My only advice. Do it right & only do it only once, you will not be happy as you start to realise that Mark is correct & you have created a lag monster relative to a EFR Specced car. I would sit tight until you can afford to build to 2015 technology. You will be happy only short term if you build to a Spec that's outdated before you start. You can of course never win because next year the new range of EFR Turbos will no doubt make the present ones redundant.

turbotrev

I already have an up a running car already modded.
And it's already a lag monster but that's because of the weird hybrid turbo it has fitted to it.
I don't mind dropping it down a gear or two to keep it in its power band though at the moment.
Was just thinking of the future. That's all.
Once I've been in a efr equipped car I'll see.

Out of interested to any other makes regularly use efr turbos?
ie vws, audis, Hondas, jap stuff?
(I know Mark dabbles in evos with them fitted but I also know this is the way Mark likes to work)

Cheers Paul

turbotrev

As mentioned already what about precision turbos, turbonetics, etc?

Cheers Paul

turbotrev

You say do it right, do it once, but no offence that is yours and Marks opinions, and preferred tuning methods.

If I was to speak with another tuner they may say something different, does that make anyone wrong? Or right?

I fully understand how good these turbos are and everyone loves them but surely it's also still preference as well??

Cheers Paul

ajamesc

I think there's only two tuners who are at the sharp end of big hose power yb's that have very height low down torque which is what you want. That's mark and Julian in this country i also see Roman Oppliger now uses the Borg set up. These people build these engines for a living and test the bits that do and don't work im sure there opinion counts for a lot. Just look at the list of turbos they have bolted to rods they have tried them all lol

Mark Shead

Find a tuner that you trust and do what they say or you will get many diff options and then you won't know your arse from your elbow on which way to go.
I have tested many diff turbos over the years and know what work for me and my customers needs and not what I can get the cheapest deal on.

Mark

Staffi

iTrader: (1)

^^^^^^ Best post on the thread

turbotrev

I totally get what you guys are saying.
And new technology def helps improve engines and gain better performance and figures.
There's no denying that.
And both MAD and Juilian Godfrey both put out awesome work too.

Marks last comment was also a good statement but it's nice to keep options open.

Any other opinions/options from non MAD customers/associates would be interesting....

Cheers Paul

Mark Shead

If you have a trusted tuner talk through your requirements and go with what he says. Asking others what they think will not help you. In reality there are only prob 4 turbo manufactors and only two of what I have used reg. But there's only one I use until the others update there range.
I have mapped many other makes and seen the results and failures along the way to recommend from experience which manufactor to recommend and others not to use.
I am not tied in to a supplier and what units they sell which I have found this restricts the progress of other tuners progress.

Mark

cossiedave

iTrader: (1)

Get a laggy piece of shit then lol saying that my t4 was ok