Hellraiser

As title which is best aftermarket ecu to buy? There so many and i havent a clue what all the jargon means! I'll be running 500/550 brake, tremec box, 6degree beam, supra diff, i want fast road car, but also a few track days! I heard from loads people L8 is good ecu but to make most of set up go aftermarket

Any input or pointers in right direction would be greatfully appreciated

Bob

studabear

Who's gonna be mapping it?

DAN400

iTrader: (3)

pick a decent tuner close to you and go with what they said

ajamesc

Best after market one is the one your tuner picks really because he will end up mapping it

Rod-Tarry

Agree with that.

Hellraiser

Well im in west midlands nr birmingham so no idea really, i dont mind travelling just wanted peoples opinions on what ecu and what mapper they recommended

AJC

iTrader: (6)

Vipec, Pectel, Link, Autronic, Life Racing, Omex

The list goes on.

Mark Shead

Without doubt the mapper is more important than the ecu used.

Mark

Rod-Tarry

New boy on the block is Emtron ive changed to it on the advice of my mapper.

SiZT

You need to talk to a few mappers and figure out exactly what you want, what features you need and how many I/O's you need etc...

nixon_2wd

I'm after the exact same thing. How come tuners usually recommend Pectel T6-2000 and not newer systems (for cossies)? Newer systems have unquestionably more powerfull processors, more I/Os etc.
Most of the really good cossies i've seen run the T6-2000.

oldford

I will give you a couple of reasons:
More powerfull processors doesn't mean more horsepower. The software in any management system (factory and aftermarket) is always re-acting to external signals and therefor always running behind. They calculate the amount of fuel to be injected and the ignition moment whem the external signal occurs with the boost measured at that moment and the execution of that calculation lies in the near future. Having a faster processor means you have to wait longer after calculating the next ignition moment before this command is actually executed.
And nobody guarantees the boost will be same at the moment the injection is completed.

The use of a proven ecu is easier than a brand new one. The wiring for the "old" aftermarket ecu is known, the limitations are known and most important, the tuner will have several files as a starting point for mapping a particular engine. Having a starting point means less work (and time) you need to spend on mapping a particular engine. It usually means the mapping is better (no forgotten cells to map) and cheaper for the customer.

Some aftermarket ecu's can cope with the standard crankshaft and camshaft triggers, while others can't. If an aftermarket ecu can't use the standard trigger, extra money must be spend creating triggers to suit this particular aftermarket ecu. In case of the T6-2000 that means the 36-1 crankshaft trigger and a change to the camshaft trigger. In this case I would say money well spend.
Other engines may require a lot more money and development to get it right. I did a Viper engine a few years back and adding a crankshaft trigger on that engine is a nightmare, where an AEMS ecu can cope with the standard signal. However, the AEMS ecu is more difficult to get it mapped right. Especially all single parameters are difficult to set up as they all have abbreviated names ands there's no help file explaining what they represent or do. So, the choice depends on how much money (and effort) must be spend extra on hardware changes and how much extra money (time) will be spend setting up the ecu correctly. In this case I went for the AEMS ecu.

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

t6-2000 is a motorsport ECU so is likely to be more durable than any of the cheap upgrades.

A YB is a simple engine in management terms. No fancy VCT, no fancy emissions control, no flyby wire throttle etc etc etc.

Hence why for most lower stages of tune, a healthy good condition Webber ecu is all you need and will do all you could need on such an engine.

markk

iTrader: (2)

One of my considerations would be - is it still supported by the manufacturer?

lacey

I had a t6 , and it was problem after problem then you couldn't get the bits for it , that was a learning curve
Now gone life racing f88

markk

iTrader: (2)

WHAT you cant say that about T6 on here - its the holy grail!

wildheart

iTrader: (4)

Your profile says you're in Loughborough, If that's the case I would go up to Alfreton just off jct 28 of the M1 to NMS and get the car on an L8

AJC

iTrader: (6)

yes, i've heard of them, ecu approx Ł2000?

Fullflush

+1 on ringing NMS

gjh

Isn't Martin Hadland (Reyland) in the Birmingham area? I'd ask him. Good tuner to go to I'd say.

lacey

Lol

It was shit from the day I brought it
Every other time I started the car something in side it would go wrong
Pectel didn't what to know but they were happy to try and sell me another one
And this is the main reason why my car spent so much time off the road .
I have junked everything to do with it and now started a fresh with the f88

Staffi

iTrader: (1)

If you want to use Level 8 then I'd only use Karl @ NMS or Tony @ TS.

Aftermarket then Mark Shead every time , i know that may sound on the fence but i have used Karl for over 10 yrs and his weber mapping is superb and I've used Mark for my Autronic, Vi Pec and he is superb too.

My advice, chose your mapper first over ECU.

Mark Shead

Its no diff whether it be a Garret Turbo/Low compression/Engine control unit people get comfortable with what they use and don't look to improve what they do or use,
Some of them don't think they customers will pay more or use diff things,
I call it progress.

Mark

nixon_2wd

Good point!

B13 JUS

iTrader: (24)

I would go for autronic or vipec and give mark @ ma developments a call, I've used quite a few different mappers and I can't fault mark.
There's not many mappers who you can call at 7.30pm and get talked through improving a cold start map like mark has done for me. Top service.

stevieturbo

Best depends on exactly what you want it to do, what your tuner wants it to do, and what they are capable of making it do.

Mark Shead

I would guess the best being something like this LOL http://www.mclarenelectronics.com/Pr...roduct/TAG-400
My guess is 30K+,
What you should ask is what is the best unit for a budget and your chosen mapper is the best one to ask.

Mark

markk

iTrader: (2)

Sonic Boom

iTrader: (11)

Very nice
Wonder how much the rest of your car has to be worth before you start to think about fitting 30k's worth of management?
Rich

markk

iTrader: (2)

Going by what happens on here, 15k engine in a 3k car lol I reckon about 6k

foreigneRS

that's not completely true. there will be various algorithms working in the background with things like PID loops, feed forward control etc to predict and smooth the fuel/ignition and these will be more or less suited to the application depending on the ecu.

oldford

Can you give me examples of the things you mention? Like PID control, for what is that used? And by which ecu's (make, type)?. Also please tell more about the feed forward control and how to predict and smooth fuel/ignition.

stevieturbo

Anything closed loop uses "PID" controls

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller
And yes you are right in saying the ecu to a degree is always behind....that said, the ecu operates far far far faster than any mechanical component on the engine. So there would be no delays from the ecu itself.

Any slow response would be down to the mechanical components themselves. Likely the slowest as far as engine control go being the fuel injectors.

Either way, not an issue.

oldford

I have to disappoint you. Most closed loop controls - at least with factory ecu's - do NOT use a proper PID control. In some cases that would even lead to unwanted results.
With a full proper PID control the fueling could be kept on exactly lambda 1.000 almost all of the time. Unfortunately, that is unwanted because the catalyst will loose one of it's functions, which is only performed when the mixture is slightly rich.

Also look at the way the turbo boost is controlled when the intake air gets hot on Weber-Marelli ecu's. The pwm signal is modified, not the desired boost level.

I still would like to know more about the feed forward control and how to predict and smooth fuel/ignition.

LHD220Turbo

iTrader: (4)

you've got NMS & Reyland near you - ring one or both and see what they say.
whats your budget?

scoooby slayer

iTrader: (4)

does mark have any dealings with syvecs rod ?