boy-racer-1

No advantages to this kit, your engine is probably safer without it, I wonder why so many people are selling this kit on again.........

Moved from a for sale thread

Mungus

Really?

fraser9764

iTrader: (3)

Must.... Not... Spend.... More... Money

boy-racer-1

We'll I'm no engineer and I've been messed about with this kit more then enough by James as have others and doesn't take a genius to realise that all 4 plugs sparking at the same time can't be good, if each cylinder had fuel in it with that happening I think you'd be looking at possible bent rods or holes in your pistons, from my experience of the kit it's something that hadn't been fully developed and has burnt out plenty of ecu's because of that fact, I sold my kit on after receiving the ecu back from James telling me it was in perfect working order only for my customer on ebay to contact me saying his car isn't working he only bought the kit off of me because his ecu burnt out, so he sent my ecu to James to be tested for him to then say it's fucked, would not go through that hassle again of risking another Ł300 l8 ecu being burnt out by a kit that cost Ł400 and a customer service that is the equivalent if yogi bear

scholes

iTrader: (1)

I run this on mind had no problems at all , most aftermarket ecu's use wasted spark and have been doing so for years, the only was you can burn your ecu is if you don't read the instructions !

boy-racer-1

The person who bought the kit off me had it running in his car for some time before burning out his ecu..... Don't think you can blame that on instructions...

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

Sorry but that's not exactly accurate.

Your ecu did work when I tested it.
What happens to the ecu when it leaves me is out of my control, and so are the cars it is plugged into.

What I can and can't do in these situations is very limited because I only have the ecu, not the car.

The biggest issue I get from ecus being sent into me is that I won't send them back until I have tested them fully, usually on my own running car with iaw hooked up and this can take me a while to do.and people normally want them back instantly.

Weber themselves thought the wasted spark driver was ok to fit into the Ferrari F40 and ours is very similar.

If my customer service was poor I apologise,I knew nothing about any of the issues you have had other than testing your Ecu I can only do my best with the info and resources I have.
please feel free to complain to my employees and they can take it from there .Rather than completely ruining a members for sale thread.

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

I'd like to see the ecu and driver to know if you can blame the WS kit either.

Kenny has a nice stack of burnt ecus upstairs that have been sent in over the years to try and be repaired, and not one of them has wasted spark fitted. It's normally shonky old wiring that causes issues.

costina

iTrader: (1)

Never had a problem with any of mine. Many people THINK they are able to do wiring and electronics but they can't as you can see in many resto threads showing dodgy repairs on looms etc.

The wasted spark kit has been around for years as said on F40's and even on the P8 ecu with the right chip and sub loom.

The only problem that can occur it the tacho issues bth ive never have this even on mk5 Cortina clocks it worked....

IF YOU UNSURE HOW TO FIT GET A PRO TO DO IT

timster

I'm about to fit this to my car, have had first class service from James and MSD. Having an auto sparky fit mine as there's a small bit of wiring to do. As said if you're not sure get a professional to do it

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

Really got any more info on this ?

costina

iTrader: (1)

www.bigturbo.co.uk

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

I don't personally have much info about the development that went into the driver as it was way before my time at Motorsport Developments,
Stu has done a fair bit of work on it though.there are some pics floating around somewhere of the Ferrari driver.

delbee1

The car runs loads better with wasted spark fitted.

All I would say is that I would suggest buying a second new ignition amp, I dont know if its the Weber amps that dont work but a few people had problems with this

Also the rev counter issue only seems to be on Escorts, I have got mine working but it cuts out at 4k revs, I think its as I still have the wire mod at the back of the clocks, I havent re-checked yet as the car is in bits lol

I brought a wire from trigger wires which you link to each side of the coil then connect it to the green wire going to the clocks, very easy, they sell new connectors too for the coil plug, so instead of cuttin and connecting wires I cripped both wires in new connector pins in the plug

Also forgot to say, I think Ł30 to fit the driver and check the ECU all works properly is reasonable, at least not only is the driver fitted properly and they do an excellent tidy job of fitting it but the whole ECU is check that things are works as they should... cant be bad

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

Yeah I have seen some oe amps not work on WS, only very few though which is bit odd as you would think they are all the same, I run 2 oe Amps on mine with no issues, go figure lol.

You must have used a diode mod for the tacho then, we can make them on request. You will need to remove the rev counter wire if your using the diode pack mate as the voltage to the clock will be too high if the resistor is bypassed

delbee1

My oe amp worked fine on old set up but only ran on 2 with the WS lol

Excellent, I thought thats what the problem would be, I'll get that wire taken out then

timster

Didn't think you'd be interested in this conversion judging by the replies you gave on the rsbb a few weeks ago. All you and lindfoot done was ridicule it?

boy-racer-1

Don't think you can really blame wiring when both ignition amps were tested and working as was the loom, for anyone in disbelief either I have a few videos with the plugs out of the head and left in the leads to show how they spark, ie all 4 then maybe 3 then 1 etc, this caused my car to start and run like a tractor, because it's not firing in sequence, sorry but don't even try blaming a loom on that, and after you supposedly testing it before sending it out then why did you send it out working like that? My customer off ebay rung up various times as did I and asked to talk to you of which every time you were supposedly too busy, and after weeks of ecu's back and fourth to msd to be tested and fixed you admitted to my customer the wasted spark had fucked both ecu's you repaired both free of charge after my very angry customer rang up and gave you a bollocking, as for more evidence of this kit not working all you have to do is google msd wasted spark not working and you'll find various forum links to people who have spent this large sum of money for a kit that doesn't work, in my eyes your del boy selling a batch of car stereos of which only 20% work, sorry to ruin this guys for sale thread but I would rather warn someone who has just spent 5-10k on an engine rebuild about this if they intend on using it, as you James will turn around and say oh your not following the instructions properly when their engine blows up, if people are all that is at fault every time then why don't msd insist on the car being brought in to have it installed?

timster

So because it's sparked at the wrong time it's blown you're engine up? Is that what you're saying?

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

I dont I was interested to see the 2 technologies

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

Again not exactly accurate.
I tested your ecu, it worked, I can do no more without the car. Your symptoms are very strange as the system has two coils firing, so it's impossible for it to fire anything other than 2+2, all four plugs fire when you ign on, I explained why on the other thread,
but it cannot fire 3 unless a plug,coil or plug lead is dead really as each coil fires 2 cylinders. But this can be ruled out by the fact it has fired all 4 as you already said, so I would expect the plugs were not grounded on the head very well during your test.

Old engine looms with rf back feed and high resistance can cause all manner of issues as the ecu is very picky about noise even more so in WS form.

I don't remember any customers ringing and kicking off at me, although I do seem to remember the ecu you mention coming in with no spark at all,infact the ecu did not even initialise.
there were no signs at all the driver caused that issue and I had no idea it was your ecu.
I fixed it for free because that's my customer service, not for any other reason.i want people to be happy with the products we supply.

As I said I can only apologise if things didn't go as planned, it's never our intension.

porterste

It is never James's fault I thought everyone knew that

lee2cossies

iTrader: (2)

Just fitted wasted spark to my car, it starts and runs perfect but after a few minutes starts to miss fire then cuts out and won't start! All sensors are new and gapped correctly, new engine, new injectors etc. any ideas?

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

Was anything else done at the same time mate ie new chip etc? As it may be something silly like its flooding,
Worth checking to see if the plugs are soaked, and check to see if you have spark after it cuts out. And does the fuel pump run? As it might run until the fuel pressure drops.

If in doubt fire the ecu in and I'll run it up on mine, and check the wiring and components for you.

KSA-Cossie

iTrader: (4)

Had my w/s in for about 4 years now with no problems, but haters gonna hate lol

lee2cossies

iTrader: (2)

The chip was changed but run perfect in a car with same spec as mine, if it was the ecu wouldn't it not start and run ok initially? The plugs are not damp at all when u pull them out.
Will check tomorrow about the pump, what would cause it to cut out after pressure is reached?
Thanks.

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

It can be a pain to diagnose when you have done a few things at the same time as to which is the cause of the problem, your car may be the same spec as the other but you may have different calibrations and pressures,
Usually if a wasted spark system isn't going to work the car normally won't start at all, cutting out while it's running sounds like it either floods,as the plugs foul up it cuts out, or the fuel pressure drops after the initial pump prime,
Or it looses spark for some reason, which you can check by cranking with the plugs out with them firmly grounded, not floating around on the cam cover,

Either way we can help you all we can to find out what's going on.
Get a meter on the pump feed to ensure it doesn't drop its feed, have a good look at the plugs, and go from there.
Drop me an email if you need help mate, james@evolutionchips.com

lee2cossies

iTrader: (2)

Great thanks James il give all them a try tomorrow. It's a new pump and loom so imagine they should be ok. Maybe the fuel pressure regulator as that's been changed to a Bosch wrc item.?

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

Ah, well yeah the pump etc should be ok, worth checking though to be sure,

The reg is interesting though is it at the right base pressure? As that could well cause the issue

When the car is cold you have large coolant temperature adders to richen the mixture, aswell as crank decay fuelling. So if the base pressure is wrong the mixture can go from cold start rich, to the point it's so rich it floods.
Check for air leaks etc too.

Do some checks of the basic stuff and drop me a mail mate, either way so I know if its fixed or not.

lee2cossies

iTrader: (2)

Ok thanks. The regulator is the only thing I'm unsure of, iv got to go pick up some fittings to get a gauge in line to check the pressure. Spent hours going through everything so don't think there's and air leaks. But will double check. When it try's to fire there's a big back fire from the exhaust!

James @ M Developments.

iTrader: (2)

Email me some pics of your ecu install, and coil pack etc and we can go from there mate,I'm sure it will be an easy fix

They can pop and bang when they flood too sometimes as it's wasted spark it fires the plugs in pairs one being on the exhaust stroke, if there is unburnt fuel in there it will try to light it.the plugs even when wet are more likely to spark with no cylinder pressure

Paul_RS

iTrader: (4)

I've had my wasted spark for 4 or 5 years. Never had any issues I didn't cause myself

However - I noticed no difference between it and a group a coil setup.

lee2cossies

iTrader: (2)

Ok thanks james il have another look with the ideas you have just given me and let u know.

BRAMMER

iTrader: (23)

I've never had a single issue with my W/S and its been fitted since 2008, in fact it's one of those mods i would advise on a YB

focusv8

Not only no engineer but a lack of understanding of the workings of the internal combustion engine.

Car and bike manufacturers have been using wasted spark most likely since before you were born.

foreigneRS

you're clearly no engineer and no genius as with a wasted spark system on a 4 cylinder engine you only have pairs of cylinders sparking - not all 4 1 useful spark and one wasted.

and it's been commonplace on engines for at least10 years now, so is obviously a flawed concept

what a prat

haz87

Think you totally misread his original post. As its pretty clear he means his faulty WS system was sparking all 4 at once. Not that he "thinks" all 4 should be sparking when WS is used

costina

iTrader: (1)

Nick wasn't it Simon that started the wasted spark kit for cossies?

The only problem with cossies is the delay on start up due to I guess only having 4 reference points on the crank pulley.

Paul

mk2cossy

iTrader: (1)

Mine has been fitted for a few years now and ive had no trouble with it.
I changed the coil pack for an american MSD unit only because my old one had cracked.

boy-racer-1

Foreigners I think you must have blurt eyes from being at the computer too long throw some water on your face and read it all again please, I've just seen a message in my inbox of yet another person having the same problem and asking if I solved mine and yet another thread has come up on this forum less then a week after this thread about ws not working yet again! I must be the biggest cunt in the world for warning people of this time and money wasting piece if shit kit