The initial question was why the Celica is worth a fraction of what an Escos is worth. You suggested that it's because of rallying success - To which i pointed out that the Celica was more successful than the Escort.

Ford have made faster, more powerful, better handling cars with better build quality, more equipment, and better reliability since the Escos. I don't think for a second that they hold their value because they're the best car Ford have ever made. They hold your value because there's something intrinsically cool about the Escos despite it's failings. They have a strong following, keeping demand high, and prices up.

 

I did not mean to compare the celica directly to the escos, I used it as en example because I have one
Pulsar gti-r, subarus ect could all be used in place of the celica.

Ive looked on a website and theres apparantly 61 ST205s left on the road.

I belive the ST205 was banned for something to do with the anti-lag or turbo restrictor,
Its the Celica ST185 that everyone remembers for rallying really, in the hands of Carlos sainz

I would love an escort cosworth, and im hopeing one day I will, I was simply wondering why in owners opinions they are worth so much more than a car that is as capable on paper and cost much less.

I mean I do things in the Celica I wouldn't dare do in an esCos for fear of breaking it as it costs so much
And I use it everyday

Thanks for all the replys

regards

Dean

 

Ah sorry got ya mate ... As above I think mainly ... Short demand etc

 

One major reason why the Jap cars are worth so little in comparison is the Import market. The UK was flooded with dirt cheap cars - they fell into the hands of people who didn't have much cash, and couldn't really maintain them, so there are a lot of ropey ones about. Dodgy Japanese build quality doesn't help matters, and it doesn't take long before your import has turned into a banger.

Although the Escos isn't the best screwed together car ever made - it was an expensive car when new, and limited supply, and desirability have kept the second hand market buoyant.

If you compare the cars statistically there is no real reason why the Escos costs so much more, but there's a lot more too it than paper figures. There's strong brand loyalty, the 'RS effect', motorsport halo cars, that wing! and a very dedicated following that have all propped up prices over the years.

 

And mainly, the fact people still think they're cool.

Theres no denying 90% of the 'expensive' cars out there are only justified cause they're cool.

By expensive i mean relative to 'similar' cars. An escos is expensive compared to the celica, but cheap compared to a Dino. Which is in my opinion far less cool than an EsCos.

 

There are loads of better cars on the market for a fraction of the price. My old E36 M3 for one, drove like new, went like a scolded cat and was always really reliable. Cost around £15000 more to purchase from new than a Escos/GT205/Scoobie/Evo etc but does not hold the value it should now.

Could be down to a number of things, no big rallye arches, crazy body kits and turbo charged engines? or the fact the car was NEVER used for motorsport (even though two of the engines was strapped together to make the MF1 Engine) The fact it was a car that was miles better than the cars in comparison from new and there for have been looked after more and/or just a better built car that lasts longer, the more you have on the road, the less they are worth. Get them numbers down and your looking at decent money for them as the small portion of people that want them, will pay a premium for the right car.

Eitherway, the Cosworth brand is all over priced for the car your getting on paper. But as we all know, not much compares to how a Cosworth can make you feel. Yes it will ass rape your wallet but when it is on song and going strong and it boosts up and goes like a scolded cat, not much will give you that kind of smirk on your face.

This will sound odd, but when I had my M3's etc... I always knew no matter what, I would turn that key and it would start and drive...

Where as the Cosworth, you sit in her and just before you turn the key round, you pray a little, you have that dought in your head, is it going to start? did I abuse it a little too much last time? but when she fires and sounds sweet, that smirk comes back

 

Yep its, strange , sad , but true!

 

LOL

In a strange way you become complacent in a more modern 'reliable' car so when something actually does go wrong you're like WTF, and almost panic.

If an old ford has a hiccup you just roll your eyes and sort it out.

You wouldn't have highs without the lows!!

 

Thats something i dont do.I just get in my saff and drive it.I dont worry about if its gonna break cause i know it will be ok.

Yeh cossies are old cars and old technology but they are a cool fun car.Mine always turns heada when im out in it.

 

There's a lot of dodgy comparisons on this thread.

A Dino with an Escos? Really?

 

Escort Cosworths were a classic from day one and will always go for top money. If you don't want one after watching the promo you must be gay.

 

There IMO the ultimate 90's rally car, imperial blue large turbo would be my dream car as such id pay a lot more for one, than say a version 5/6 Subaru which I love but wouldn't pay as much for. Also a shed load of these have been imported meaning there not that rare (special editions aside) in comparison.

As well the same as most classics 20 year olds couldn't afford them when they were new, but now with some money in there pocket they car afford to buy the car which they wanted etc

 

and thats not only in the UK here on the mainland there worth even more
http://www.autoscout24.nl/ListGN.asp...2CU&sort=price
http://suchen.mobile.de/auto/ford-es...&ambitCountry=

it also just the incredible looks of the car in real live

 

they never fail to turn heads when they drive by whether people know or dont know what they are .
unfortunatley the same cant be said for most of its competition ,including much later machinery like m3,s/m5,s,subaroooos,evoooos etc

 

I'd also say a lot of it is down to loyal fans, plus in a way we are stuck with it.

The jap car scene have a lot more to choose from performance car wise, but we got to the Escos then that was it. A few half arsed attempts until the Focus RS but nothing otherwise.

 

Back in 1994 id owned my escort Monte for a few weeks when i took my brother in law to pick up some food when i parked beside a Lotus Carlton,few young lads came running up the rd shouting Cosy! look at the cosy Asking all sorts of daft Question's About how fast it goes.
The guy in the lotus Carlton couldn't believe all the attention the shonky ford was getting over his 40k motor.Only the most die hard of car nuts would have known what his car was back then, but every young lad new what a cossie was .. I still have it and wouldn't swap it for any other car out there . i have had lots of other car's but nothing puts the smile on my face like the old girl.
Frank

 

Defo agree with that.I always get people looking at my car when im out and about.

 

i was at the ring with my escos and i was surrounded by all these porsches and lambo's but geuss were the most picture were taking from

 

I was only using it as an example for pricing. I wasn't playing one off against the other. It's for perspective purposes.

Obviously the Escos is the better car. I don't dislike old ferraris but I've driven a couple and they aren't all that. They're cool, but an Escos is more bang for your buck.

 

Reply to dans reply to my ^comment

Ford have made faster, more powerful, better handling cars with better build quality, more equipment, and better reliability since the Escos. I don't think for a second that they hold their value because they're the best car Ford have ever made. They hold your value because there's something intrinsically cool about the Escos despite it's failings. They have a strong following, keeping demand high, and prices up.[/QUOTE]



Thats not my point. Of course more equipment and faster cars are made by Ford and i never said ESCOS is the best car by Ford. Its just they dont make anything like the cosworth cars imo . Maybe im getting old lol.
Oh n i goosed the quotation thingy ooops

 

There can't be many one owner cars from new. Any pics of her

 

it`s just the aura this car has...every time i see one i can`t stop staring at it...

there`s this older guy that had his red ESCOS for as long as i can think and still everytime i see the car i am all fascinated like the first day i saw one...

i`d love to have one...

 

Think theres a few out there with low mileage aswel i have one im the 2nd owner and theres another one with half the mileage of mine i think its got 87 miles on the clock and thats 1 owner or something

 

!!!!!!!!

 

How honest were the toyota wins though? And the money that toyota could put into their rally programe was considerably more than most (they say 3 times more than what ford ever could).

 

if you aren't cheating in motorsport... you aren't trying hard enough

and you can't moan about budgets either!

 

im genuinely lol at some of the comparisons in here

 

The escos are falling in price though, the sapphires are going up now.
4years ago there was no chance of a 6K escos, and 100 odd sapphires all up at £2/3 grand.
Now, i struggle to find any sapphires less than £3K and i probably could find a 6K escos, i wouldn't just dismiss the idea as stupid.
Japenese stuff is very cheap as its very common in some cases, its supply and demand.
there are 1000's of classic shape impreza's and they have no class, the cossys often are 2nd cars, garaged mollycoddled babys. Classic impreza's are usually found on council estates these days

 

a 6k Escos!!! have you been drinking?

I have seen trimmed shells sell for more than that.

a 6k cossie will be rusted to fuck, blown engine and a CAT car.

 

Escorts are currently in the slump of their values IMHO, it happened to 3 doors & sapphires about 6 years ago, an mot'd non cat 3 door could've been had for 6-7k upwards, a saff clinging onto a ticket was 2-3k.. As the numbers have fallen the good cars are getting harder to find, so values are creeping up.

Try finding a tidy, clean 2wd saff now, it's quite hard to do!

Escorts are bottoming out, the rough ones will get broken, the good ones will go up. In 3-4 years I expect to see prices rising steadily for the good cars.

Across all the Cosworths it comes down to being an icon of the decades that they were made in, and the rarity. Look at Mk1/2 Escorts & RS500s for reference!

 

You can, and i will, besides, at national level (up to european championship level) the escort cossie was very succesful, probably a fair bit more than the toyota, it was also very good in group N. Also, in a random one for you, in 93-95 it was the quickest WRC car in a straight line.

 

I think if you have to resort to cheating in motorsport you should probably retire.

There's nothing better than winning hands down ahead of someone who is cheating.

 

i hope this is true as i have a low mileage genuine st205 wrc sat in my garage, cant realy compair to a escos as i have never owned one but the Toyota build quality is next to none, the st205 came with super strut suspension, the same as the new focus rs revo knuckle system. years ahead of there time and excellent spec for your cash

 

i thought in ms its only cheating if your caught, loops holes are there to be exposed how one interprets the rules may be different to the next