Fil

was just about to post that, not trying to hide anything with that one

booner999

yep, full genuine cosworth on the log book

Madgit

It's totally your choice obviously but I could never knowingly buy a car with shall we say "questionable history". If you find out later then that's different, like as has been mentioned earlier, lots of people on here have probably found out something about their car once they've had it a while.

davidnormanuk

Update

The shell is a Ford Motorsport Shell bought from a place in Ireland. I have spoken to the person who sold it. It was sold without numbers on due to being a Motorsport Shell but came with a plaque on the front of the car to verify this. So the shell is genuine. I'm just trying to find out where the engine came from. It looks like the block was bought new but I'm awaiting receipts to prove this but the internals etc arn't verified as yet.

The id of the shell is not genuine. It should have come over, been built and then put on a Q plate to show it has been made up out of parts new and second hand. I assume the car would have then been given numbers to be stamped on to make it a genuine car made up out of parts.

Iain Mac

Replacement Ford shells don't come with a VIN. The tag on the slam-panel should say something like "Escort Cosworth - Sliding Roof, Daventry" or similar. Having that tag would be nice.

The chassis number would begin SABTVRO if it was registered as built up. I still think this one has just used an RS2000 id.

therebelsc

My car,sold last night.

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

indeed.

Pretty much all new shells from ford come with the slam panel tag listing the part identity rather than the normal VIN tag.

My puma still has the parts department tag but with the SABTVR VIN stamped on it.


at least with the correct shell tag and some reciepts for new parts such as engine, you could probably blag the rest as they are none age provable parts or get a mate who works at a dealer to knock you up receipts for the minor parts.

However without proof the shell was new, you are always fucked as you are likely using parts from 2 different vehicles as the VOSA men will see it and be doomed to a q plate.

carlo

iTrader: (4)

Another spanner in the works , a recipt for a new shell dosent mean this car still isnt a choker ! ring the stolen car with the id sell the new shell on again job jobbed you will be able to tell if its a motorsport shell anyway im sure the sealer is different might be worth asking the question to more people in the kow the differences or get yourself on to www.escortrscosworth.com the lads there will be able to tell you how to spot a motorsport shell from ford

carlo

iTrader: (4)

H mate i had another look at the advert there and sorry to piss on your bonfire but thats not a motorsport shell its a lux shell with sunroof , im not saying that a motrsport shell wasnt purchased but it certanly wasnt used , the advert cntradicts itself as well he says its a genuine small turbo escort cosworth not a replica but its been built up from parts and its ona rs2000 book

Martin-Hadland

iTrader: (2)

How can you tell its not a motorsport shell from the pics Carlo? I will answer for you, you can't

carlo

iTrader: (4)

It has a sunroof for a start martin

carlo

iTrader: (4)

But im sure there are more ways than one to tell i have read a similar post on escort cossie . com

Martin-Hadland

iTrader: (2)

And roof skins aren't easily changed in about 3 hrs?? Done it loads of times, next you will be telling me that my Citrene yellow Escort didn't have a motorsport shell (had electric sunroof, leather and e/w.

carlo

iTrader: (4)

They are i know this , are you telling me you think this is a genuine built up car ?

Martin-Hadland

iTrader: (2)

I'm not saying that at all but you don't know either way too.

carlo

iTrader: (4)

Martin it settles a argument for the op then , take someone to the car thats really good with bodywork and get him to see if its had a roof skin or not no matter how good its done im sure a good panel beater will be able to tell no ?

Martin lets not be daft here i know your not daft and know a bit about a bit does this car's story tie up with you genuine question ?

carlo

iTrader: (4)

I know i dont know either way but i know where my money would be in a bet the op has put it up on a forum keeps coming back with excuses that he is given , but they are the same on all the moody esort threads he is doing homework so why not put all these questions out there so he can make sure he has done everything possible to save his money ?

Martin-Hadland

iTrader: (2)

Agreed, anyone worth their salt in the trade would be able to detect if a roof skin had been fitted if the job wasn't 100% but if someone made a proper job of it I think you'd struggle to tell on a built up car with screens in place, you would not have been able to tell on my yellow car and I have step by step pics of the actual job to prove.

I don't know the cars story but I do know the part about the guys brother dying is correct, he was pretty young and sadly had a blood clot get into his liver and killed him

carlo

iTrader: (4)

Not so good about his brother

Motorsport shells have no sealer is that correct ? surley you would be able to tell if the sealer was hand done on this car also ? the sealer isnt by any means done neat from the factory but with a few dateiled pics you should be able to tell as well

Martin-Hadland

iTrader: (2)

It depends what shell he actually got hold of...

Trimmed shells had no sealer and were painted white
Replacement shells were sealed and came in grey (with a green tint) primer
Motorsport shells had no sealer and came in black coating
Original and Stolen cars would have been sealed from the factory

carlo

iTrader: (4)

The above info should give him plenty to look for if he views the car . pull rear inner quarter tirms back see if he can see the inner frame and what colour the primer is

davidnormanuk

Please see pics below sent over to me.

I think it has had a sunroof put in but not 100% sure





Cheers
Dave

carlo

iTrader: (4)

It must have had mate as there are pics without one and then one with a guy standing out it , Looking at what martin wrote that looks like a trimmed shell with no sealer are you taking anyone with you to check the roof panel & sealer ?

carlo

iTrader: (4)

Also that tunnell looks mallard in that pic ? someone has started paining it

davidnormanuk

I'm not going to see it at the moment due to wanting to clear everything up before anything else. I've contacted Vosa and the DVLA via email to see if anything comes back. Once they come back to me next week I'll get back in contact with him if the cars still for sale.

carlo

iTrader: (4)

Cool , says the engine was built up new from ford it looks like its been droped complete from a escort in that pic

Minirotty

The red one was built from a shell, I know the lad who has it and did it, well the most of it.

It's on an RS2K book to avoid Q plate, the car has also been taken to VOSA and been fully checked over, they know it's cossie runing gear etc... not sure what DVLA know about it though?

It's not a ringer as in stolen parts, but yes, it's a runger as in wrong log book.

I know of dozens of escort cosworths on the road with 2K log books, and a few of um here that you'd never guess were 2K's up too!

My mate who was building the RWD V8 escos from motorsport shell, had it on log book from a 2K, completed engineers report for it to have the V8 and chasis mods, and RWD, sent all details to DVLA and they were more than happy with it!

Really isn't that hard to get your head around and DVLA are fine with it, as long as you tell DVLA it's runing the cossie gear or whatever you have in it.

DVLA aren't as bad as people think, you just have to be honest with them.

davidnormanuk

Hi all,

I'm going to see the car at the weekend so if anyone has any suggestions as to what to look for it would be appreciated.

Cheers
Dave

Cossy Mike

iTrader: (4)

Off topic slighty but my cossy has 2 mistakes on the VIN number on the V5.....

These are plainly obvious when you read them off the car, V on the car is a U in the logbook as is the digit 1 has gone down as an I

I contacted DVLA and they said they would change the V5 document but would show as being ammended.

NO WAY I'm devaluing my cossy, stating numbers have been changed, I'll leave the obvious mistake's

liam-rst

iTrader: (1)

The short answers are they are ringers, I know someone who built an escos from a new shell and parts and that was registered on a w reg not a q, the logbook stated ford escort 2.0 turbo and said 4x4 in the drive train part, so if this is possible and these were built from new shells why would you not register it as above, got to be better than a moody id

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

although the guy should have put the correct information on the form then it would have a V5 stating it was an escort cosworth.

liam-rst

iTrader: (1)

No I specicially remember him telling me that he could not register it as a cosworth as cosworth are a seperate company and had nothing to do with the build if this it yrue or not I dont know

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

Ford escort "RS cosworth" is a model name so id imagine the DVLA were being bell-ends.

liam-rst

iTrader: (1)

But my point is why would you use a rs2k I.d when you can do the above, even if you did have to register it as a 2.0 turbo at least you would have a genuine sounding story

PAUL S

iTrader: (8)

DVLA offices around the country were issued with a memo in the late 90s specifically telling them not to register any built up cars as Escort RS Cosworth after a spate of ringers using new shells.

The guy from DVLA showed it to me when I built up my 3dr, weirdly enough they had no issue with mine being properly listed as a Sierra RS Cosworth.

Iain Mac

They were happy to call mine an XR4i.

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

i dont get why they did that paul. no matter wether its built out of new or second hand parts, its still an escort RS cosworth. No car other than an "escort rs cosworth" was available with that shell.

Iain Mac

The thing is that new shells were relatively cheap, so steal a nearly-new EsCos, buy a new shell, do something with the engine number, and move everything over.

Make upa few invoices and you've now got a home-built car with a VIC and real V5 to prove it is all legit.

So if the authorities stopped rebuilt cars being registered correctly they removed at least some of the incentive for the crime.

PAUL S

iTrader: (8)

He said there was a big court case and a ringing gang broken up so DVLA had to act as a result. As Iain mentioned once Ford stopped producing the escos they sold off a load of trimmed and motorsport shells and these fell into the wrong hands, the system back then for registering a built up was quite simple so take one new shell, a stolen escos and a weekend in a lock up and hey presto brand new escos.

I imagine as a result the ringers started registering them as RS2000s instead to get around the memo, hence why lots are around like that instead

mechanic28

iTrader: (5)

too much what ifs on this car i would walk away mate