Rogeyboy

iTrader: (2)

I am toying with buying a new car, got around 6-7k to spend, ive got a shortlist of cars i want to view/testdrive. It will be a toy as my orion is becoming less and less used everyday and turning into a long-term project, but i still want to have something exciting to drive.

Several factors come into account here...

Handling - i love to drive hard round country roads and push the car through bends and roundabouts, so strong brakes and cornering ability is a must.

Performance, i want something fairly fast - obviously...

Running costs, im not wanting to run a car on a budget but at the same time i dont want to be paying out massive service bills and stupidly high premiums on parts etc. Fuel consumption is niether here nor there at the moment, lets face it fuel is massively expensive in pretty much any car at the moment and its only going to get worse, so i intend to enjoy my "toy" whilst i can without worrying about mpg too much.

Modification potential, im not intending to go mad but i'm thinking at least an exhaust, filter and some sticky tyres. Now some of the cars won't need them things, the M5 for example is pretty quick out of the bag i imagine.

The cars:

E39 BMW M5 - 400bhp rwd v8 powered sports saloon. High running costs, but a lovely looking car that i imagine i could have alot of fun in.

Mk1 facelift Jag XKR - 400bhp rwd supercharged v8 coupe. Only avail in auto, which means the mrs could drive it on long road trips, should be fairly fast and sound good too.

Mk1 Focus RS - 220ish bhp FWD sharp handling hot hatch. Possibly the most aggresive looking car ive ever seen, i love the looks and they are said to be superb in the twistys.

Mitsi Evolution 8 - 300ish bhp 4x4 sports saloon. Again great handling, but abit dull inside. Plenty of tuning potential tho and i imagine loads of fun sliding around with the AYC etc.

Now its worth noting here that i havn't driven any of these cars, they are my favorite cars based on what ive seen on the road and from what i've read/heard about them.

In an ideal world, i'd like to view and take on a hard test drive several examples of each and then compare them. I don't know if this would happen though as i don't want to start abusing other peoples cars. Unless i could get another owner to take me out and drive each example fairly hard.

So i thought i'd ask people opinions and see whats what...

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Driven them all many times, both standard and modified versions, owned three of them personally, all very good cars but all quite different.

If your local to me, call in and you can try the M5.

Mr S1

iTrader: (2)

M5 definately wins in my book, followed by the Jag. The others are good, but not as refined or comfortable as the first two.

Top offer from Stu as well !

CliffRS4

iTrader: (1)

Now there's an offer you can't refuse!

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

If you want refinement AND handling, drop the Jag from your list right away, its chassis is set up for old businessmen and its soft as they come.

Mike C

iTrader: (1)

I've seen a few very nice E39 M5's recently for around the £6000 mark. One for a shade under sounds very nice in the classifieds of this week's Autocar.

You mention long road trips when talking about the Jag, and that would be a great car for driving across to the continent in. If that's something you plan on doing or long tours of the UK then it's really the Jag or the M5 only out of that list. The M5 having the bonus of a lot more room and the Jag having the bonus of being auto for long-distance driving.

The Focus and Evo would be great for a quick blast.

Another car to consider for me would be an Impreza STi Type R. I'd take one of those over the Evo any day and Mike Lomax is selling a superb-looking one in the for sale section for only £4.5k, here it is:




A bit of a wild card suggestion as well because they always seem to get overlooked at the moment, but that means they're great value would be an Alfa GTV6. I've got one in my collection at the moment and am really enjoying it.....





Is amazing on the twisty country lanes near me. The steering is superb, equipped with 4-pot Brembos as standard, MOMO seats with great quality leather, and THE best-sounding V6 engine ever. Mine with an upgraded exhaust and Filter sounds incredible at full chat, really torquey and alive. Would get spanked by the Evo/Scooby, but feels like a little junior supercar as a package and the throttle response is great. 220BHP like the Focus, although there's more scope for reasonably cheap upgrades with the Focus. Reputation for feeble Italian electrics etc put a lot of people off, but it drives values down and would get lots of change. It's a good kinda "halfway house" between the luxury types of the M5 and Jag or the hooligan types of the Evo and RS.

Or a third other option, have you considered something like a Boxster S? No drop top on your list, but a proper mid-engined sportscar, perfect for twisty roads, beautifully built and strong performance.

Robs Frst

Would have to be the M5 with your budget.

If your going for a 8 has to be a MR, though you wont get a MR for 6-7k not even sure you will even get a decent 8 Fq with that budget.

Dingy

Got an evo 8 and a evo 6 - take the 6 all day every day - so much more fun...

Was never impressed with the old m5 - sooner have a saph....

Rogeyboy

iTrader: (2)

Some good reviews, thanx guys...

Stu - many thanks but im along way away in essex, if im ever in blackpool i'll pop in and say "hi" and you can take me for a rip.

I like the alfa gtv, wouldn't mind a boxster - had a go in the father in law's 3.2S and it was quick and pretty as nimble through the bends but needs an extra 50-60lbsft or bhp in the mid-high rev range to properly shoot out of corners etc, mind you the mrs loved it and they are getting quite cheap now - but i'd get branded as a poser or poor mans porsche driver. No interested in a scooby im afraid, altho they sound nice the flat 4 burble!
I've had a go in a few saff's all 4x4s, and wasn't overly impressed performance wise - altho they werent the best of examples. But the driving position felt restrictive and for the money i'd sooner something abit more... modern i guess?

Is the evo6 really better than the 8 - talk to me - how?

Robs Frst

No point discussing whether 6 or 8 better. Drive them both, then make your own mind up after you will have to live with it.

Before buying my 6 I test drove a 9 340, I know which I preferred. even test drove a MK1 Focus RS.

Both have the plus and negative points like all cars. just depends which suits your needs.

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

I would say the M5, I actually considered two of the cars you mentioned, M5 and XKR, thing is though you then go on to say you don't want an expensive car to run which all of them are, I have been looking at M3's and M5's and a guy said he had just spent £800 on front brakes in the advert, albeit the bulk of that was probably labor, even DIY as I would, I suspect the actual parts are still expensive!

I do like the both variants of FRS as well, XK is good but I don't like automatic cars, no true sports car is!

It seems E39 M5 is cheaper than M3's from what I can see?

Plus I think the M5 is more powerful from memory, I think in fact XKR is around 370HP and the XK8 around 300HP.

Martin

Ima Racing

iTrader: (1)

XKR roling on detroit 20's, my one:



As Stu says, not if you want handling!

pee vee

the cars are all totally different..

but if you wanna go fast round country roads and roundabouts..the evo8 is the weapon of choice... they are very effective in what they do, almost to the point that they ain't as 'fun' as a mk1 FRS. (if wheelspinning and being a hooligan is your bag,, which it sounds like it might be )

never driven any of the others, but they all appear to be big and heavy to be going round country lanes... but ive heard them M5s are fairly brutal. lol

rog

iTrader: (2)

I agree with Dingy on his comments, especially after what you said in your initial post.
M5 handles ok, but it's a heavy car and the brakes are shite. But It's a brilliant car and ridiculosly fast in standard form, it just doesn't stop going in any gear. Having said that, I dont own a focus or evo or jag, so they might be even worse. Personally from looking at your list, Id say Focus. It'll be easy to drive, quick, good brakes, cheap to fix and service (by comparison).

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Brakes are easy to upgrade with a few simple tweaks, as standard with cheap pads and fluid they are indeed lacking. Handling is also easy and pretty cheap to sort. Everyone who drives mine is shocked at its high speed cornering ability.

rog

iTrader: (2)

Would be interested to hear more on this!
I stuck on new discs with yellow stuff pads and changed the fluid, it did make a big improvement right enough. What about your suspension?
Just swapped the xenon headlight (dipped) bulbs for 4300k items, big improvement, it has dangerously rubbish lights as standard for any kind of high speed driving on a dark road unless you can have full beam on all the time. Not sure if the previous owner changed the bulbs but they looked standard when i took them out.

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Add the cooling vent ducts from the 540 (IIRC) to the front, these brakes take a beating trying stop the big old girl and they appreciate the extra cooling performance greatly.

Poly bush all the usual parts then drop her down onto a set of progressively rated Eibachs with nice new dampers if yours are worn. The difference is night and day, including braking stability. 10 years and neigh on 2 tons takes its toll on all these parts.

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Please tell me more?

Rsmat

iTrader: (2)

Yes agree there... When I went out in yours Stu.. It went and stopped superb I Was very impressed with how refined it did it as well..!..I'd take a M5 any day of the week.

RSNUT!

bit of info on the alfa GTV6, wiper blades are NLA but the wiper arms are available
(comes with the blades) £86 each!!! and thats just wiper blades.... running costs for italian cars are a joke!!!

and for Mike C whatever you do dont lose your keys... they come in at just over £200

Mike C

iTrader: (1)

Wipex do a pair of for about £20 or nice flat ones for £24 and are the best out there according to most, better than OEM, but there are other sources.

I don't intend losing my keys *touch wood* although I only have 2 and think there should be a third.

rog

iTrader: (2)

Well having had the car for nearly two years and the winter coming in I got immensely annoyed at the poor quality of the lights.
So as the story goes.... I went for an MOT and the car failed on the lights, the adjuster mechanism inside the lights were broken, on both sides.
Are you aware of this issue, it effects every facelift M5 at some stage or another, basically the headlight innards are made of plastic and become brittle and break, so the whole inside of the light isnt attched to anything and wobbles around or just points downwards all the time.
BMW dont sell the parts, the only sell the light at 400 +vat each! but you can buy aluminium replacement parts off ebay and use a heat gun to take the light apart and replace the parts for around 30 pounds.

Anyway having done all that the car passed and the lights were better but still not as good as they should've been, so i did a bit more digging and found out that the most effective xenon temperature is around 4300k, BUT most manufacturer dont fit these bulbs in high end cars, they fit higher temperature bulbs that look blue so that it "looks" expensive and thats what people have come to associate with these types of cars.
So anyway, got onto ebay for a replacement set of bulbs, for about 20 quid posted, the ones you need are caled D2S, you cant buy them in halfords or any other regular auto store, not here anyway. Dealers sell them but they want about +50 quid per bulb.

If your changing the bulbs id remove the whole headlight, its much easier and it actually quicker than fiddling and breaking something.
Heres a couple of supporting pages.
http://www.hidplanet.com/forums/show...5000k-vs-6000k

http://www.autobulbsdirect.co.uk/Xenon-Bulbs.html

Hope that helps.

**Also forgot to add, the lights aren't yellow, they're more white now, lower temp bulbs like 3000k are the yellowish ones.

xr4x4rs

iTrader: (5)

the evo is a killer on fuel id imagine the m5 is aswell, but out the list its the m5 or evo all depends on what you want

but what are the servicing costs like for the m5 compared to the evo as id imagine bmw parts a re lot more expensive

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Thanks Rog, will look at those for mine.

Rsmat

iTrader: (2)

Apart from the M5... If your wanting a cheap go-kart them the FRS is the ideal toy... As there cheap to service ect...

Rab

7k for an Evo 8? I wouldn't buy a cheap Evo... If I had 7k it'd be a 6. With low miles.

Robs Frst

Even 7k for a good 6 is hard going, paid much more for mine but I wanted a low mileage, low owners rot free car. had it 2 years not one issue just will be having more power over the next couple of months.

will get a nice 5 GSR or RS with that money.

Glenn_

iTrader: (1)

MIKE C i used to work on alfas and did a lot of work to the GTV.s The back suspension arms used to wear all the time.The arms used to cost a fortune. Had a few engines out of them to.Me and a lad i used to work with had 160 out of one of these on the A1 years n years ago.

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

i drove a mk1 jag xkr last week actually lol
for the size of the thing it did go very well and the sc sounded cool lol, but the brakes were total dog shit and the handling was very wallowy. the top mounts were also worn on the one i drove as it was knocking its tits off lol
this was all b road bashing too.

good power tho! comfy fast cruisers they are basically, but not as big inside as you may tihnk due to the size of them. back seats are no good for anything over a midget, and the front seats are quite enclosed by the dash and centre consol

imo, id get an e46 m6 lol

Rab

I think it is do-able in the current financial climate. I got mine for 7k, with 59k in mint condition with a full documented history in a leather bound book!

But a very low milage 5RS would be a much better way to spend your dosh!

Robs Frst

You where lucky to find it in the colour you have.

Admittedly was modified and the book tells a painfull spending story. but ive still spent this month again with Ross Sport.

Really is a bad addiction.

Rab

What addiction. I don't have an addiction. Not me. I'm clean. No addiction here. Nope. Don't need to spend any money on mine mate. Na-ah... Not me. I'm fine. Seriously. No problems here..... WHERE'S MY CREDIT CARD!!!!!!!!!!! PARTS FOR SALE HERE I COME!!

Robs Frst

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

Mk1 frs you could get one with 280+bhp for you budget

Cheapest to run and cheapest to insure for me and bloody good fun too

RS Grant

iTrader: (1)

What are the servicing costs for an E39 M5 at an independant for an Oil Service?? Inspection 1?? Inspection 2??

You won't get one of those ultra-rare beasties for £7k IMO.


Cheers,
Grant

Rsmat

iTrader: (2)

Grant that's why I think for the most fun on the cheap the frs is just the ticket.

RS Grant

iTrader: (1)

I think you're right as it goes bud... cause although purchase prices are the same, running costs are likely to be a fair bit higher in the BMW.

I was just interested in what it would actually cost to keep an M5 serviced correctly. I drove an E46 M3 and was really surprised at how much I liked it and how impressed I was at the drive of it... it would be hard for me to ignore an E46 and E39 if looking at cars around this price bracket.

BUT... I'd more than likely go for the FRS since I've wanted one for a while and it would give me some turbocharged madness back in my life.


Cheers,
Grant

Dingy

as far as the 6 and 8 evo goes, i just found the 6 more fun......and on the subject of brakes - evo brembos are wank.....ap's are a must upgrade.

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

are you taking the piss? there is a shitload on ph for 7k.

although for 8k id be seriously tempted ith lambchops that is for sale on here

RS Grant

iTrader: (1)

Yep.

E46 M6...

Cheers,
Grant