Coilover comparison anybody? GAZ/AVO/Leda/any other make
20-01-2005, 12:28 AM
#1
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Coilover comparison anybody? GAZ/AVO/Leda/any other make
I'd like to know some more on coilovers which ones are better which one worse, wich ones more bling 
. I know basic theory, what are external fluid reservoirs on some models and so on. I would like some info on which ones include what, are easier/harder to fit, work better on road, track, stage, gravel, tarmac and so on. Maybe there was some kind of test in some tuner magazine? Some interesting input would be nice :-D
When my Bilsteins die I think I'm going coilover route :-D + ZOO Goodies
. I know basic theory, what are external fluid reservoirs on some models and so on. I would like some info on which ones include what, are easier/harder to fit, work better on road, track, stage, gravel, tarmac and so on. Maybe there was some kind of test in some tuner magazine? Some interesting input would be nice :-DWhen my Bilsteins die I think I'm going coilover route :-D + ZOO Goodies
20-01-2005, 01:11 AM
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AVO, in my experience=rubbish. I've taken mine off the car as I'm pissed off with them leaking constantly. I know two dealers who have stopped selling them as they're pig sick of the returns.
Bearing in mind that refers to mainly road applications.
Bearing in mind that refers to mainly road applications.
20-01-2005, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by NUTS RuS
I think pictures will help Jakub too 
Should be plenty 2nd hand ex motorsport stuff being sold around UK and Europe. Have you not given that a thought ?
For sure I wouldn't buy 2nd hand motorsport stuff in POland as it's most likely to be damaged beyond repair.
20-01-2005, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Fastmaul
I've had some AVO's on my road car for the last 3/4 years with no problems.
What is adjustable on them? How are they fitted? No problems? Any mods required?
20-01-2005, 06:41 AM
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Jakub, as I said in your last post, I run avo coilovers. There are not quite a year old but have been spot on ever since I got them. I think quality has improved a lot as when Sean from Zoo saw them, he said they looked far better than the set he used to run on his car. They look the part when they come out of the box 
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20-01-2005, 06:42 AM
#8
Bilstein coil overs are very good for the price, the rest in your list are cheap max power items in comparision.
Thing is with suspension, you need to give your self a budget cause it can be an expensive affair, not just buying the stuff, but the rest of the bits to make em work properly.
Thing is with suspension, you need to give your self a budget cause it can be an expensive affair, not just buying the stuff, but the rest of the bits to make em work properly.
20-01-2005, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by dingy
Bilstein coil overs are very good for the price, the rest in your list are cheap max power items in comparision.
Thing is with suspension, you need to give your self a budget cause it can be an expensive affair, not just buying the stuff, but the rest of the bits to make em work properly.
Thing is with suspension, you need to give your self a budget cause it can be an expensive affair, not just buying the stuff, but the rest of the bits to make em work properly.
Bilstein coilovers - any info or link? In Bilstein dealership in Poland they say there are none for Cossies in the catalogue, no B9 or B12 (PSS-9) models.
Of course it's extremply expensive - eveything that make a difference is :-(
What do you mean by the rest of the bits?
20-01-2005, 06:53 AM
#10
Not sure in poland, you need some GRP A bottom's, these can be 2nd hand then just new inserts for the front.
Rears, gravel spec ones are apparently best for a cossie for general use, but you best speaking to someone like steve scott and the like who have set loads of escorts up. They made a massive difference over the koni's on a mates escort.
Rears, gravel spec ones are apparently best for a cossie for general use, but you best speaking to someone like steve scott and the like who have set loads of escorts up. They made a massive difference over the koni's on a mates escort.
20-01-2005, 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by dingy
Not sure in poland, you need some GRP A bottom's, these can be 2nd hand then just new inserts for the front.
Rears, gravel spec ones are apparently best for a cossie for general use, but you best speaking to someone like steve scott and the like who have set loads of escorts up. They made a massive difference over the koni's on a mates escort.
20-01-2005, 08:09 AM
#13
Azrael,
Please be advise that the AVOs aren't really suited to much more than a fast-road set up (see this month's PF for their company profile, where they actually state this themselves).
Out of all the ones you listed the only ones that are purpose built for track use are the LEDAs. These start at around £1100 for the basic set up for the Escort and you can go as high as £1800 for the rose jointed / remote gas reservoir, 3-way adjustable ones.
For a track day car, I would recommend the £1300 kit, which includes for the Eibach springs, rose joints and gas filled dampers (to prevent over-heating) - one way adjustable (24 position). Having just fitted a similar set up to my car, I am in a very good position to advise you on a suitable set up for bumpy roads....
Please be advise that the AVOs aren't really suited to much more than a fast-road set up (see this month's PF for their company profile, where they actually state this themselves).
Out of all the ones you listed the only ones that are purpose built for track use are the LEDAs. These start at around £1100 for the basic set up for the Escort and you can go as high as £1800 for the rose jointed / remote gas reservoir, 3-way adjustable ones.
For a track day car, I would recommend the £1300 kit, which includes for the Eibach springs, rose joints and gas filled dampers (to prevent over-heating) - one way adjustable (24 position). Having just fitted a similar set up to my car, I am in a very good position to advise you on a suitable set up for bumpy roads....
20-01-2005, 08:16 AM
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Personal opinions follow;
Bear in mind I only sell the ones I list
GAZ.....very very good. I sell loads of these everyweek, and lots to people on here. I have had......1 complaint about them, and that was from me!!!But that issue is now sorted. I have GAZ coil overs on my orange Cossy.
AVO.....greatly improved over the past year, but for the money, still fall behind GAZ. 2 problems with AVO's. Firstly the threaded body is too fine, causing them to seize more quickly. Secondly the ride comfort adjuster is like a 'pin' and can often round off leaving no adjustment at all.
H&R.....These are my current suspension on my blue cossy. They are a combination of Bilstein shocks, and Eibach made springs to a specification that has been tried and tested. H&R do alot of stuff for track/road cars, and their testing ground.......Nurburgring They are dearer...not £1000 though, you know me I can get them cheaper for you. They ARE NOT ride comfort adjustable, nor height adjustable on the rear, but they are 
KONI.....Not coil overs but fixed pan. Living on a name they earned years ago. Very dated now though.
There are lots of other kits on the market, and I sell loads of othe fixed pan adjustable and non adjustable kits and there are a few gooduns as well.
Look at the thickness of that piston rod
Quality
I have busted a leg on the front of my H&R...they replaced it in a week
Bear in mind I only sell the ones I list
GAZ.....very very good. I sell loads of these everyweek, and lots to people on here. I have had......1 complaint about them, and that was from me!!!But that issue is now sorted. I have GAZ coil overs on my orange Cossy.
AVO.....greatly improved over the past year, but for the money, still fall behind GAZ. 2 problems with AVO's. Firstly the threaded body is too fine, causing them to seize more quickly. Secondly the ride comfort adjuster is like a 'pin' and can often round off leaving no adjustment at all.
H&R.....These are my current suspension on my blue cossy. They are a combination of Bilstein shocks, and Eibach made springs to a specification that has been tried and tested. H&R do alot of stuff for track/road cars, and their testing ground.......Nurburgring
They are dearer...not £1000 though, you know me I can get them cheaper for you. They ARE NOT ride comfort adjustable, nor height adjustable on the rear, but they are KONI.....Not coil overs but fixed pan. Living on a name they earned years ago. Very dated now though.
There are lots of other kits on the market, and I sell loads of othe fixed pan adjustable and non adjustable kits and there are a few gooduns as well.
Look at the thickness of that piston rod
Quality
I have busted a leg on the front of my H&R...they replaced it in a week
20-01-2005, 08:24 AM
#15
Do NOT put a Leda strut anywhere near a bumpy road.
Mates just sold a set on Ebay, we wre sick of returning them to be straightened out, to sort out the leaks and we'd had enough of their awful customer service never again.
Seems everyone must know about Leda too as they fetched the sum of £77.05p
The new generation AVO's are actually pretty good. They now work like a Bilstein strut.(like the pic of the H&R) but its got to be new.
Mates just sold a set on Ebay, we wre sick of returning them to be straightened out, to sort out the leaks and we'd had enough of their awful customer service never again.
Seems everyone must know about Leda too as they fetched the sum of £77.05p
The new generation AVO's are actually pretty good. They now work like a Bilstein strut.(like the pic of the H&R) but its got to be new.
20-01-2005, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Azrael,
Please be advise that the AVOs aren't really suited to much more than a fast-road set up (see this month's PF for their company profile, where they actually state this themselves).
Please be advise that the AVOs aren't really suited to much more than a fast-road set up (see this month's PF for their company profile, where they actually state this themselves).
They are so special that most rally teams from outside POland say they have no possible suspension settings (e.g. every possible tarmac spring on 306 Maxi was to hard) for Rally of Poland (Euro championchip round with 10 factor)The result is the suspension must be durable and have enough adjustment not to destroy the car/wheels very quickly.
Out of all the ones you listed the only ones that are purpose built for track use are the LEDAs. These start at around £1100 for the basic set up for the Escort and you can go as high as £1800 for the rose jointed / remote gas reservoir, 3-way adjustable ones.
For a track day car, I would recommend the £1300 kit, which includes for the Eibach springs, rose joints and gas filled dampers (to prevent over-heating) - one way adjustable (24 position). Having just fitted a similar set up to my car, I am in a very good position to advise you on a suitable set up for bumpy roads....
Vary interesting input on Leda Mike
20-01-2005, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by cossymad
Personal opinions follow;
Bear in mind I only sell the ones I list
Bear in mind I only sell the ones I list
GAZ.....very very good. I sell loads of these everyweek, and lots to people on here. I have had......1 complaint about them, and that was from me!!!But that issue is now sorted. I have GAZ coil overs on my orange Cossy.
AVO.....greatly improved over the past year, but for the money, still fall behind GAZ. 2 problems with AVO's. Firstly the threaded body is too fine, causing them to seize more quickly. Secondly the ride comfort adjuster is like a 'pin' and can often round off leaving no adjustment at all.
H&R.....These are my current suspension on my blue cossy. They are a combination of Bilstein shocks, and Eibach made springs to a specification that has been tried and tested. H&R do alot of stuff for track/road cars, and their testing ground.......Nurburgring They are dearer...not £1000 though, you know me I can get them cheaper for you. They ARE NOT ride comfort adjustable, nor height adjustable on the rear, but they are
They are dearer...not £1000 though, you know me I can get them cheaper for you. They ARE NOT ride comfort adjustable, nor height adjustable on the rear, but they are
KONI.....Not coil overs but fixed pan. Living on a name they earned years ago. Very dated now though.
There are lots of other kits on the market
I have busted a leg on the front of my H&R...they replaced it in a week
20-01-2005, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Azrael
Originally Posted by cossymad
Personal opinions follow;
Bear in mind I only sell the ones I list
Bear in mind I only sell the ones I list
GAZ.....very very good. I sell loads of these everyweek, and lots to people on here. I have had......1 complaint about them, and that was from me!!!But that issue is now sorted. I have GAZ coil overs on my orange Cossy.
We get them built to your spec's if required so we can do a 'Polish Setting'
AVO.....greatly improved over the past year, but for the money, still fall behind GAZ. 2 problems with AVO's. Firstly the threaded body is too fine, causing them to seize more quickly. Secondly the ride comfort adjuster is like a 'pin' and can often round off leaving no adjustment at all.
H&R.....These are my current suspension on my blue cossy. They are a combination of Bilstein shocks, and Eibach made springs to a specification that has been tried and tested. H&R do alot of stuff for track/road cars, and their testing ground.......Nurburgring They are dearer...not £1000 though, you know me I can get them cheaper for you. They ARE NOT ride comfort adjustable, nor height adjustable on the rear, but they are
They are dearer...not £1000 though, you know me I can get them cheaper for you. They ARE NOT ride comfort adjustable, nor height adjustable on the rear, but they are
They are not coil overs, they retain the original mounting points for springs & shocks on the rear
KONI.....Not coil overs but fixed pan. Living on a name they earned years ago. Very dated now though.
There are lots of other kits on the market
I have busted a leg on the front of my H&R...they replaced it in a week
20-01-2005, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by cossymad
You know you will. Did you get the othe parts yet?
Yep, I know
I'm your best Polish customer you know No, I didn't get them no news at all
But it's been 9 days I think so not that long so far. I just got ECu which went to me about 2 weaks by airmail.
20-01-2005, 09:11 AM
#22
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AVO's have a habit of knocking.
Leda are very good, especially for the track.
H & R are also very good in my opinion.
If money's no object go for the Leda's.
Leda are very good, especially for the track.
H & R are also very good in my opinion.
If money's no object go for the Leda's.
20-01-2005, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by M7 COS
Leda are very good, especially for the track.
If money's no object go for the Leda's.
If money's no object go for the Leda's.
20-01-2005, 09:26 AM
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im going for GAZ coilovers on my esc cos this weekend hopefully, purely so i can adjust the harshness and the ride height. Its used as a road car, not a track day cart.
if they are shite, then watch chris bounce down the A127 with one up his arse
Dingy, i hardly think they are 'max power' not everyone needs full on track day specced suspension.. i think these are the perfect idea for someone that wants adjustable suspension at a cheap price compared to the serious top range gear
if they are shite, then watch chris bounce down the A127 with one up his arse
Dingy, i hardly think they are 'max power' not everyone needs full on track day specced suspension.. i think these are the perfect idea for someone that wants adjustable suspension at a cheap price compared to the serious top range gear
20-01-2005, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by DaveEscos
chris, did yours knock on the back of your esc cos? if so.. i hope craigs got a big hammer so mine dont!
20-01-2005, 11:11 AM
#33
In my experience, it is also all the above companies policy to spec overly hard springs for the dampers, which causes poor handling (afterall, the tyre has to be in contact with the road to work ) and premature damper failure.
I have no idea how they calculate the spring rates, as the figures that even the road spec ones come up with are a complete mis-match and TOTALLY unsuitable for the road.
) and premature damper failure.I have no idea how they calculate the spring rates, as the figures that even the road spec ones come up with are a complete mis-match and TOTALLY unsuitable for the road
.
20-01-2005, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
In my experience, it is also all the above companies policy to spec overly hard springs for the dampers, which causes poor handling (afterall, the tyre has to be in contact with the road to work ) and premature damper failure.
I have no idea how they calculate the spring rates, as the figures that even the road spec ones come up with are a complete mis-match and TOTALLY unsuitable for the road.
) and premature damper failure.I have no idea how they calculate the spring rates, as the figures that even the road spec ones come up with are a complete mis-match and TOTALLY unsuitable for the road
.Well this overall problem with tuning suspension parts. Too hard. And the strange thing is that competition car would be lower so the spring even tarmac one wouldn't need to be harder at all. Don't get it :-/
Mike (or anybody else) - do you have any experience with road aplicated stuff like Proflex, Ohlins and similar famous competition brands? I don't know they product range that weell but I think they do some fastroad/competition stuff or maybe just too expensive and overkill. I've heard (from Scoobie peolple) that those most expensive suspensions need to be serviced to often to be effectively run on road.
Oh and one other for this popular kits- it I iwnd them all the way up and ease with ampening - will any of this will be suitable for light gravel practise?
20-01-2005, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by cossymad
Nah angle grinder.
Oh one more thing. I think I've seen photos of a coilover set on a COssie which had two springs in the rear - one in original place and one on the damper - anybody know anything aboutthis kind of solution? I think it would probably also make you able to adjust height by some margin.
20-01-2005, 12:16 PM
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The king of BLING has to be Ohlins
Got a set of WRC spec 5 way adjustable, remote reservour coil overs on my escort. Had them fully serviced and rebuilt by Ohlins and worked extensively with them on the valving and spring rates for a track car. They are actually off a WRC recce car, so have the top and bottom mounts to fit standard hubs
These pictures show new springs etc on the car.
These are probably up for sale as well, so if anyone is interested in having the ultimate set of coilovers on there car, let me know. I am looking for £3,500 for them. But bear in mind they would cost you £12,000 brand new. Mine have done ZERO miles since being fully rebuilt with all new valves and springs etc.
Sean..
Got a set of WRC spec 5 way adjustable, remote reservour coil overs on my escort. Had them fully serviced and rebuilt by Ohlins and worked extensively with them on the valving and spring rates for a track car. They are actually off a WRC recce car, so have the top and bottom mounts to fit standard hubs
These pictures show new springs etc on the car.
These are probably up for sale as well, so if anyone is interested in having the ultimate set of coilovers on there car, let me know. I am looking for £3,500 for them. But bear in mind they would cost you £12,000 brand new. Mine have done ZERO miles since being fully rebuilt with all new valves and springs etc.
Sean..
20-01-2005, 12:18 PM
#38
Azrael,
Chris was joking, but you DO need to beat the inner wing with a hammer to get sufficient clearance to stop the springs chafing and making a knocking noise.
You need to find an Ohlins dealer in your country, as I understand from my own enquiries that they will replace the springs once FOC if the first set are not suited to you.
Chris was joking, but you DO need to beat the inner wing with a hammer to get sufficient clearance to stop the springs chafing and making a knocking noise.
You need to find an Ohlins dealer in your country, as I understand from my own enquiries that they will replace the springs once FOC if the first set are not suited to you.
20-01-2005, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Azrael,
Chris was joking, but you DO need to beat the inner wing with a hammer to get sufficient clearance to stop the sprongs chafing and making a knocking noise.
Chris was joking, but you DO need to beat the inner wing with a hammer to get sufficient clearance to stop the sprongs chafing and making a knocking noise.
You need to find an Ohlins dealer in your country, as I understand from my own enquiries that they will replace the springs once FOC if the first set are not suited to you.
Anyway I was kind of joking as most probably I can't ever offord sometig like Ohlins. More expensive Leda's seam to me everything I could pay when it comes to shocks/springs