Chip

iTrader: (3)

No mate, the sterilisation would be filmed, shit like that fetches loads of money on the net, so it would be self funding.


That would be her parents responsiblity for letting her out of the country.
If she doesnt have parents then we would default back to the current benefits system, but im convinced the number of cases would go down from millions to a handful.


Again it would drop back to the existing system for these very rare cases, although I will certainly consider the unisol program, but I feel thats a little unfair on the child really as its not it's fault that its mum was a lieing slut who pretended to be 16 or father was a foreign rapist, so not really fair to punish it IMHO, but I always have been a bit of a soft touch like that.

gaz s1

Agreed but the trouble is we dont have full employment and aint going to have in the near future and immigration is still a big issue as they will be taking jobs and no party can solve this while we are still in the eu. as they have a right to work here so tensions will just rise again!!

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Cameron is interested in repatriating some of the decisions currently made by the EU. Clegg too I believe.
So hopefully they will get somwhere with that, although I doubt it.

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

ahh but the real point is, Ł1.50 (to use your example) was the REALISTIC price that everyone had to pay. And they did pay it. we have now got USED to cheap goods. That needs to reverse if we want to make our economy sustainable, although i fear the damage is irreversible with many of these lost industries.

In the good old days, a family saved for months to get a VCR or a color TV or if they were lucky to have decent income they got one on weekly payment.

Its only a recent phenomena that your average family can just go out and buy this stuff now because its affordable.

think about it, DVD players cost fuck all these days. We couldnt afford to buy them if we paid a fair price or bought stuff built in UK. and thats how it should be.

Its pretty simple that if we want a sustainable economy with good wages then the cost of luxury goods has to go up. And people need to realise that includes most of the things they take for granted.
The real point is that benefits are too high in the first place. You have a kid, it needs childcare. Pretty obvious expense. For a single parent family yeah its a bitch but life is hard. get over it and get on with things. For a couple you just plan your expenses. If it means its better for one parent to look after kids rather than work, then so be it.

There is a lot to be said for family values. A family unit based on 2 adults does work

The benifits are waaayyy too high at present. A simple example, a co-worker at the charity i work at is a single mum of 2. She split up with her boyfriend and got depression (already existing mental health as well). It worked out she was better off quiting work and living on benefits. And thats with the fact her kids dont need childcare as they are at school.

Benefits should be the bare minimum necessary.

Whats even more worrying is the "thick" genes are passed onto the next generation and we end up with more and more thick people with every new generation

Lee Reynolds

Oh dont get me wrong mate, ive voiced over this issue many times, whilst i agree with cameron i also think its nigh on immpossible to implement!

.Ross.

iTrader: (2)

Your all Heart there Chip ... Get a party going and I be the Sunderland South candidate ..

How can they stop EU citizens from working here? Implement a Work Permit system where a Labour Market Opinion for the area and Job need to be assessed?

How could they push this through as its Europe who have overall control of the boarders? I dont think they will allow it TBH .. It either in or Out .. Even with a UK president.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Ive already started construction work on the party headquarters mate (although ive been pretending its a workshop), its foundations are as solid as the moral foundations of the very principles on which the party is founded (me getting less tax and more sex)


Sadly they are on a hiding to nothing I suspect with that one!

gaz s1

Cameron made a big thing on immigration knowing he aint got the powers to stop it unless he really has got balls to take on the eu and get our borders back while going back to the original concept of the euro trade agreement or common market, i doubt he has but if he does then he will probably get my vote next time.

.Ross.

iTrader: (2)

Aye well the only way to Amend the No EU immigrant (Asylum seeker etc) Would be to Either hand total power to the EU or Amend the Human Rights Laws.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

He made a huge deal out of immigration, however if you sit back and watch now he will do NOTHING of consequence about it!
Tory's lieing? well its hardly a new thing

gaz s1

I have no problem with genuine asylum seekers(but why thy have to go through several countries to get here is another question) but eu workers having a right to work here is just plain stupid, especially now we have a government saying if you can work you should work, how can they enforce that when we dont have full employment and have eu workers here already taking up jobs!!

gaz s1

as said before chip its new times and new politics now we are in cameron and cleggs big happy society lies will not be tolerated

rubinsbin

how many do you know working then????

.Ross.

iTrader: (2)

Aye ... I have nothing against people trying to escape polictial persicution.

The EU needs to level the playing field for us here .. People wouldnt risk life and limb to cover the whole of Europe to get here if they got the same at the first EU country. They aint coming here for the weather, Maybe they like tea and crumpets.

The same should be the case for EU citizens .. A fixed system for any Non Citizen EU member .. Regarless they should only be allowed benefits set by Europe .. This will be the same for UK citizens in Europe.

Employers would have to provide medical cover for them here ..

All the benefits for UK citizens should be for UK citizens only and EU Immigrants should have a set system regardless of Country they reside ..

rubinsbin

----------------------------------------------------
problem is they work for food!! and as long as they do we dont stand a chancefuck them of back now!!!!!!!!!!!!

gaz s1

now your talking sense, politicians would never go for it..................

Glenn_

iTrader: (1)

Ross for parlement...

MikeR

The has been a lot of sense talked on this thread, Warren in particular,

Labour got us in this mess and Gordon did fuck all about bank regulations whilst the money was going in the treasury but when it went tits up it was everybody's fault,

Lieing about the armed forces is disgusting, they fight and die for our freedoms atleast support them when it counts.

Sometimes a change is good so lets give it time, but one thing is for sure all you tax payers are going to be hit to dig us out this hole the country is now in,

Mike

Lee Reynolds

Lol ive been saying that from the start! Wont do and can't do fuck all about it!

massivewangers

iTrader: (1)

I think what made me laugh was that they all slated each other's immigration policies when none of them can do anything about it

Lee Reynolds

Lol at a facebook page...

Cameron is saying he wants change, give the cunt 30p and tell him to fuck off!

Lee Reynolds

People fall for it though thats what amazes me, then theyre allowed to vote!

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

Lee,

It would seem more of the country beleived David than any other. Just have to see how it all pans out

Lee Reynolds

Tell me how that calcualtes then Rich? Seeing as out of 30 million votes the cons got 10 mil!

To me that means a third of the voters beleived him and two thirds didnt!

gaz s1

we now have an unelected prime minister again and a party in crime propping them up that lost seats, aint democracy great

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

Because of the 1st past the post voting system we have in this country. If you break that down into actual votes:

Conservative - 10.7 million
Labour - 8.6 million
Lib Dem - 6.8 million

But its seats that count: Labour lost 94 seats, Lib lost 13 and Conservative gained 100. Not much anyone can do about the way the voting system works until now. AV will be introduced apprently which should make the number of votes actually mean something.

gaz s1

the irony is how many voted lib dem to keep the tories out and how long till the hippy grass roots lib dems turn on their leaders and parliamentary party and cameron cant be in a great position with the right wing in his party as well, their lust for power made them do the deal but its just waiting to fall apart!!

Labour made the wise move getting out and not cobbling together a deal with the lib dems, sit in opposition and watch them self destruct

best time to be in opposition,economies probably going to go tits up thanks to osbourne public sector strikes, and this sham of a coalitionfalling apart, and the lib dems falling into the political wilderness, not that they was not anyway

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

hahaha are you joking?

The one eyed fool stayed in 10 for as long as he could, if he could have made a deal with the lib dems he would have.

Blair was intelligent enough to run away before the shit hit the fan and leave Brown to sift through said shit..... he was also 'intelligent' enough to give A LOT of money to Europe.... funnily enough he did that just before he stood down and went for EU president didn't he??? Wow what a load of honest great guys the labour party are. lol wise move lol

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

Not sure who said this but it wasnt Labour's choice to not cobble a deal with Lib Dems. It was Lib Dems choice not to go with Labour. BIG difference

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

Exactly! Its an insult to the memory of those who've died fighting our dirty wars.

rog

iTrader: (2)

Warren, agree with your comments, i just think it's important that the cost of childcare is adressed also, if people are forced back into work for less than their benefits (especially unskilled/low paid jobs), they won't be able to afford childcare, so won't be able to work at all, catch 22 really.

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

rog the point is the benefits are too high in the first place if thats the case. especially with single parents, if they choose to work rather than live on benefits then the childcare should be free for those below a certain earning threshold as long term its far better that they work as in 4 years when the kid goes to school then childcare isnt needed as much and as a result youll have a family supporting itself for 14 of the 18 years rather than now where often they live off the state for all 18 years with more sprogs popped out as needed to ensure benefit income is protected

gaz s1

The lib dems have stated that it was mandelson and odonis who were serious about talks and the mp,s involved did not take it seriously, this is straight from the horses mouth so to speak and since we are in a new age of politics where they all tell the truth who am i to disagree

Totally agree with you on blair he is the biggest cunt of them all and could see what was coming and got out sharpish leaving his best buddy brown to take all the flak

Chip

iTrader: (3)

The way to make it more attractive to return to work, is to not give ANY benefits out, and only to give them a government funded job instead.
I dont care if the job is 1000 people digging holes and then 1000 people coming back and filling them in again, no one should get ANY benefit for nothing, with the exception of the newly unemployed who are genuinely job seeking and the disabled or elderly who cant work.


There are LOADS of useful jobs the unemployed could be doing, the streets are largely dirty and covered in chewing gum and fag ends etc for a start, that could all be picked up.
Likewise they could be utilised in government funded child minding facilities, they could be assigned to various charities, the potential is there for the unemployed to be useful not just a fucking annoying burden to the rest of us!

gaz s1

Makes me laugh people commenting on child care on here be interesting to know how many of them actually have kids so are experienced on the matter!!!

gaz s1

thats fair enough if we have got full employment and no foreighners taking jobs but we havnt have we???

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

gaz s1 what the fuck has having kids got to do with it???

just because someone doesnt have kids doesnt mean they know fuck all about childcare etc.


Or is this another one of those "you cant comment unless your a parent" things

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Im of the opinion that Blair is a self centred cunt who was PM because it suited his needs for power, where as I actually believe Brown genuinely cares about this counrty and wanted to make a difference.

I think Brown had no chance given the circumstances he came to power in and its a real shame as I think he is one of the better PM's we have ever had, but it never looked that way as he was at the helm of the ship during such a storm that a bumpy ride was unavoidable, I think with any other PM though, it would have been even worse.
Feel genuinely sorry for the bloke in that he never really got a proper chance!

gaz s1

the irony of your answer mate

Psycho Warren

iTrader: (5)

its like being promoted to captain of the titanic just after it hit the iceburg