View Poll Results: What Would you Have
RWD Saff 330-400 BHP
55
59.14%
4WD Saff 330-400 BHP
21
22.58%
Focus RS 
17
18.28%
Voters: 93. You may not vote on this poll
A Real GD Thread 2WD or 4WD
08-04-2010, 07:44 PM
#43
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Mine is a 2wd. When I bought it it was fucking lethal, purely due to a random tyre combination of Kumhos, LingLongs and other shite. Was actually rediculously tail happy, nearly stacked it on several occasions. Would go sideways in the wet at 1500rpm
Replaced all 4 tyres with a set of Eagle F1s all round, which has transformed the car. Now grips great in the dry and pretty damn good in the wet. Will still easily break traction in the wet but at least you need to provoke it a little.
Replaced all 4 tyres with a set of Eagle F1s all round, which has transformed the car. Now grips great in the dry and pretty damn good in the wet. Will still easily break traction in the wet but at least you need to provoke it a little.
08-04-2010, 08:03 PM
#44
Get one bought!! 
definately don't rule out buying a fourby and converting to 2wd though. As mentioned above, you get the better, stronger 200 block and also, IMO, the later ones seem to be that little bit nicer and not quite as dated (not that even the latest ones are that modern!!). The money you would get from selling your fourby bits, would go a fair way to paying for the 2wd stuff! 
definately don't rule out buying a fourby and converting to 2wd though. As mentioned above, you get the better, stronger 200 block and also, IMO, the later ones seem to be that little bit nicer and not quite as dated (not that even the latest ones are that modern!!
). The money you would get from selling your fourby bits, would go a fair way to paying for the 2wd stuff!
08-04-2010, 08:09 PM
#45
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Ive had a couple of well set up stage 3 saffs both were rwd and certainly kept you on your toes.Mainly in the damp/wet when they came on boost can catch you out if your not ready but in the dry with some good tyres i never found them a problem sure if you wanted to you could get the arse end out easy as anything but you soon get to learn the cars limits like any car, infact ive found the s2 ive got now can keep you on your toes more so than the cossies did infact which sounds like madness as its an rs turbo.
Last edited by jaiscossie; 08-04-2010 at 08:12 PM.
08-04-2010, 10:28 PM
#46
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Sorry to butt in but are 4wd Saffs permanent 4wd?
IMO i'd go for a 2wd, theyre only going to be as lethal as your right foot says....
When I get one i'm certailnly going for 2wd for the fun factor, always had a fascination with a decent specced Saff stomping up the road sideways =)
IMO i'd go for a 2wd, theyre only going to be as lethal as your right foot says....
When I get one i'm certailnly going for 2wd for the fun factor, always had a fascination with a decent specced Saff stomping up the road sideways =)
09-04-2010, 10:58 AM
#54
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I have owned 3 RWD saffs, still have my current 2wd (converted from 4x4), and also have my Escos which is 4x4....
They are totally different driving experiences, the 4x4 you can drive like an absolute animal, throwing it into corners hard and using left foot braking to balance it, generally a standard cossie (suspension wise) will understeer unless you really provoke it. In a RWD car you have to think about your driving much more, slower entry speeds and steer in smoothly to get the grip, then building the boost so as soon as the corner opens out you can squeeze the throttle to fire the car out of the turn, but not using enough to make the back step out... You can drive a 2wd very very quickly if you are smooth, but you HAVE to understand the physics of what's going on, too many people use the throttle like an on/off switch and wonder why they are facing the wrong way.
But, this might upset quite a few people, the reason 2wd gets a bad reputation is mainly because the car is in poor condition, and the monkey driving it expects a rwd turbo saloon to drive like a light fwd hot hatch...
Most cossies by now will have 400bhp ish, but they will also have old shagged bushes, an old droopy set of konis that are way too low to make the car handle, and an LSD that is loose and unpredictable... And the main problem in all cossies, the horrendus rear beam. People don't like spending money on suspension, but a six degree rear beam will TRANSFORM the car, and make it much more predictable and tractable.
Also, a 350bhp rear drive cossie would need 400+ in a 4x4 to feel as fast, I love how lively a good stage 3 t34 rear driver feels, very little around that can live with that. A genuine 350rwd cos is a very very quick car in the real world.
So in short I would go RWD, but spend some money in the right places to make it good! I have always said a RWD saff is the nicest cos to drive by a mile.
They are totally different driving experiences, the 4x4 you can drive like an absolute animal, throwing it into corners hard and using left foot braking to balance it, generally a standard cossie (suspension wise) will understeer unless you really provoke it. In a RWD car you have to think about your driving much more, slower entry speeds and steer in smoothly to get the grip, then building the boost so as soon as the corner opens out you can squeeze the throttle to fire the car out of the turn, but not using enough to make the back step out... You can drive a 2wd very very quickly if you are smooth, but you HAVE to understand the physics of what's going on, too many people use the throttle like an on/off switch and wonder why they are facing the wrong way.
But, this might upset quite a few people, the reason 2wd gets a bad reputation is mainly because the car is in poor condition, and the monkey driving it expects a rwd turbo saloon to drive like a light fwd hot hatch...
Most cossies by now will have 400bhp ish, but they will also have old shagged bushes, an old droopy set of konis that are way too low to make the car handle, and an LSD that is loose and unpredictable... And the main problem in all cossies, the horrendus rear beam. People don't like spending money on suspension, but a six degree rear beam will TRANSFORM the car, and make it much more predictable and tractable.
Also, a 350bhp rear drive cossie would need 400+ in a 4x4 to feel as fast, I love how lively a good stage 3 t34 rear driver feels, very little around that can live with that. A genuine 350rwd cos is a very very quick car in the real world.
So in short I would go RWD, but spend some money in the right places to make it good! I have always said a RWD saff is the nicest cos to drive by a mile.
09-04-2010, 11:12 AM
#55
cossie fan (unluckerly)
There both good cars i like 2wd more myself depends on if your going to tune it. 4x4 transmission dosent stand up to big torque unless u have lots of money! So if your going to mod it id go rwd
09-04-2010, 11:32 AM
#56
cossie fan (unluckerly)
09-04-2010, 12:26 PM
#58
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I prefer the 4wd the only thing that always swayed me to 2wd was how much power you can get thru the std tranny, with a 4x4 the transmission is shocking std so you are always shitting yourself the box or front diff is gonna explode even at 300bhp. Now i have one with proper transmission and around the 400bhp area its fantastic and i know it can take up to 500bhp if i want more bhp....with a std 4x4 i was shitting it at 350bhp knowing it was a timb bomb..lol...its nice to hear the cut gear whine knowing its not a fucked std box..lol
A t4 2wd on the road is pointless as you need to go above 100mph to feel the real benefit.
A t4 2wd on the road is pointless as you need to go above 100mph to feel the real benefit.
09-04-2010, 12:35 PM
#59
Lots of good points raised already.
Have owned both, 2WD only for a short while (sold it a couple of months ago), 4x4 I've had for 9 years and still own, and I can say in that short period of time i had the rwd saph I MUCH preffered it, "it was my favourite"
Like everything, will/won't appeal to what yor looking for. For me it felt better on the road, steering was much better and lighter, pulled better with less power.
Technical benefits, less to go wrong, more power thru standard transmission.
Disadvantages, older design of engine, older car, more dangerous in the wrong hands.
personally I wouldn't even DARE to compare a 20+ yr old RWD car with a 330i or any new RWD car, totally different, technology is so far advanced since then that a beemer would out handle it anyday and be far safer to drive. It is what it is!
Have owned both, 2WD only for a short while (sold it a couple of months ago), 4x4 I've had for 9 years and still own, and I can say in that short period of time i had the rwd saph I MUCH preffered it, "it was my favourite"
Like everything, will/won't appeal to what yor looking for. For me it felt better on the road, steering was much better and lighter, pulled better with less power.
Technical benefits, less to go wrong, more power thru standard transmission.
Disadvantages, older design of engine, older car, more dangerous in the wrong hands.
personally I wouldn't even DARE to compare a 20+ yr old RWD car with a 330i or any new RWD car, totally different, technology is so far advanced since then that a beemer would out handle it anyday and be far safer to drive. It is what it is!
09-04-2010, 12:50 PM
#60
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...500bhp in a rwd ='s lunacy....500bhp in an M5 ='s any idiot can drive it with m set t/c but turn it off and you get lunacy and grip! lol
my 4x4 is really well set up handling wise feels really stable and the steering is ultra precise.
but turn it off and you get lunacy and grip! lolmy 4x4 is really well set up handling wise feels really stable and the steering is ultra precise.
09-04-2010, 03:56 PM
#61
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Try finding a good 2wd 
I've been looking around for one but in the end I've bought a 4x3 and converting it to 2wd.
I've contacted most of the 2wd ones on Pistonheads and been to look at a few of them but they were a waste of time.
I've got some more pics of the one in Northumberland I was going to look at it but decided not to after seeing the pics.
The one in Notts with NMS in the title IMO is a shed the pics look like they were the ones from when he bought the car.
The staffs one with a t-shirt in the engine bay looks nice but is covering up a badly welded in battery tray.
goodluck
I've been looking around for one but in the end I've bought a 4x3 and converting it to 2wd.I've contacted most of the 2wd ones on Pistonheads and been to look at a few of them but they were a waste of time.
I've got some more pics of the one in Northumberland I was going to look at it but decided not to after seeing the pics.
The one in Notts with NMS in the title IMO is a shed the pics look like they were the ones from when he bought the car.
The staffs one with a t-shirt in the engine bay looks nice but is covering up a badly welded in battery tray.
goodluck
09-04-2010, 04:46 PM
#62
well i have had 4x4 cars and now a 2wd car and i prefer the 4x4 cars.
i want it to go fast and grip,i'm not getting that in the 2wd car, just spins the wheels which imo is totally pointless.
if you are a hooligan and want to wheelspin everywhere then go for the 2wd cars,4x4 cars are for drivers.
i want it to go fast and grip,i'm not getting that in the 2wd car, just spins the wheels which imo is totally pointless.
if you are a hooligan and want to wheelspin everywhere then go for the 2wd cars,4x4 cars are for drivers.
09-04-2010, 04:50 PM
#63
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well i have had 4x4 cars and now a 2wd car and i prefer the 4x4 cars.
i want it to go fast and grip,i'm not getting that in the 2wd car, just spins the wheels which imo is totally pointless.
if you are a hooligan and want to wheelspin everywhere then go for the 2wd cars,4x4 cars are for drivers.
i want it to go fast and grip,i'm not getting that in the 2wd car, just spins the wheels which imo is totally pointless.
if you are a hooligan and want to wheelspin everywhere then go for the 2wd cars,4x4 cars are for drivers.
,Yeah you'll get outta the corner's faster but as for raw power 2WD hand's down pull so much better and feel more alive than any 4x4 of the same power Spin up not of you use a good tire mate In the wet both 4x4 and 2WD could be dangerous
09-04-2010, 05:07 PM
#64
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You have to be so much more commited to showboat in a 4x4.
If you want to watch other people playing get a 4x4, if you want to play get a 2wd
A modded beam makes the 2wd so much more predictable and better to drive.
either way if it goes wrong you will be fucked 2wd or 4x4 BUT if its 2wd at least you'll go backwards through the hedge
If you want to watch other people playing get a 4x4, if you want to play get a 2wd
A modded beam makes the 2wd so much more predictable and better to drive.
either way if it goes wrong you will be fucked 2wd or 4x4 BUT if its 2wd at least you'll go backwards through the hedge
09-04-2010, 07:21 PM
#65
saff is working!!!...atm
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Have a little argument there, Transmission loss for one fast.....not compared to a RWD ,Yeah you'll get outta the corner's faster but as for raw power 2WD hand's down pull so much better and feel more alive than any 4x4 of the same power Spin up not of you use a good tire mate In the wet both 4x4 and 2WD could be dangerous
,Yeah you'll get outta the corner's faster but as for raw power 2WD hand's down pull so much better and feel more alive than any 4x4 of the same power Spin up not of you use a good tire mate In the wet both 4x4 and 2WD could be dangerous
09-04-2010, 07:26 PM
#66
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09-04-2010, 07:31 PM
#68
well i have had 4x4 cars and now a 2wd car and i prefer the 4x4 cars.
i want it to go fast and grip,i'm not getting that in the 2wd car, just spins the wheels which imo is totally pointless.
if you are a hooligan and want to wheelspin everywhere then go for the 2wd cars,4x4 cars are for drivers.
i want it to go fast and grip,i'm not getting that in the 2wd car, just spins the wheels which imo is totally pointless.
if you are a hooligan and want to wheelspin everywhere then go for the 2wd cars,4x4 cars are for drivers.
I can put my foot down in any gear and know they will be very little drama, 2wd might be faster then a 4wd on a perfect day, but that's about it!
09-04-2010, 08:37 PM
#71
Redumbdancy
This is an excellent thread
Some good points have been mentioned regarding poor 2wd rear beams and bushes being the cause of a lot of issues, whereas the 4wd's won't rely on these elements as much.
I like the idea that, with a proper suspension setup, the 2wd's can be a more involving drive because you need to think more about steering angles, corner entry speeds and throttle positioning. For me thats what the art/fun of driving is all about.
Are 4wd's noticably less involving to drive in comparison to 2wds?
Some good points have been mentioned regarding poor 2wd rear beams and bushes being the cause of a lot of issues, whereas the 4wd's won't rely on these elements as much.
I like the idea that, with a proper suspension setup, the 2wd's can be a more involving drive because you need to think more about steering angles, corner entry speeds and throttle positioning. For me thats what the art/fun of driving is all about.
Are 4wd's noticably less involving to drive in comparison to 2wds?
09-04-2010, 10:07 PM
#72
RWD for me
mine was strong stage 3, approx 360-380hp, but i never drove mine in the wet.
To be honest it only got scary if i wanted it to get scary. If i came to a roundabout in 2nd gear i could make the back end come out, but i would have to try.
As i said i wouldnt drive it in the wet as traction was an issue.
IMO i dont think you need to be Ken Block to drive it, just know what to do if the it does get a bit hairy - and lets be honest its not rocket science, just practice.
mine was strong stage 3, approx 360-380hp, but i never drove mine in the wet.
To be honest it only got scary if i wanted it to get scary. If i came to a roundabout in 2nd gear i could make the back end come out, but i would have to try.
As i said i wouldnt drive it in the wet as traction was an issue.
IMO i dont think you need to be Ken Block to drive it, just know what to do if the it does get a bit hairy - and lets be honest its not rocket science, just practice.
09-04-2010, 10:24 PM
#74
either car suits my driving style,which only tends to be fast in a straight line .
i dont think im brave enough to push my 4x4 to the limit as it just grips and grips .when i got it id had 4 2wds and i said i wouldnt get another as they were to lairy in the wet,so guess what ive got another but i will never drive it in the wet
.i dont think im brave enough to push my 4x4 to the limit as it just grips and grips .when i got it id had 4 2wds and i said i wouldnt get another as they were to lairy in the wet,so guess what ive got another but i will never drive it in the wet
10-04-2010, 08:36 AM
#77
I agree about the difficulty
Ive been looking solidly for 2 days now and nothing can be found, I think im going to wait till i sell my BMW and buy a 3 door.
Theres a grey saff on ebay that looks ok but wont say what he wants for it and to me hes clearly bidding it up. Its been on before aswell (has anyone looked at it)
There seem to be more 3 doors than 2wd saffs which is a bit shocking.
Ive been looking solidly for 2 days now and nothing can be found, I think im going to wait till i sell my BMW and buy a 3 door.
Theres a grey saff on ebay that looks ok but wont say what he wants for it and to me hes clearly bidding it up. Its been on before aswell (has anyone looked at it)
There seem to be more 3 doors than 2wd saffs which is a bit shocking.
10-04-2010, 09:34 AM
#79
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The 2WD i would have more care for 
There's pro and con's to each model
I love our RWD sapphire she's a beast on full boost the handling aint bad either
As you said mate it rocket science just gotta take your time and learn the car i have thrown the 2WD out a few time's not on purpose but corrected it very quick and on my way again The 4x4 we had just didn't have the poke the 2WD has I'm sorry you don't buy a cossie to feel like a fast mondeo (4x4 cossie) as genuinly that's how it felt for me a fast mondeo that's the nearest thing can explain it too
IMO anyway .