Inlet manifolds for Zetec turbos, why frst?
18-01-2005, 09:48 PM
#42
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wiltshire UK
Posts: 3,795
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by PhilM
I'd rather have machind pistons any day over a spacer plate, at least you have propper sealing between head and block then!.
I'm not having a pop, we've had this discussion many times
but what exactly 'fails' with a decompression plate..??? because to date I've never actually had a decent explanation of what problems are REALLY ACTUALLY occuring. (except for the jokers who are intent on using 2 gaskets,,, that one's doomed to failure 
)
19-01-2005, 07:01 AM
#43
PassionBMW.com Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 3,530
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Read a few people say they have had problems with the ferriday copper gakset/plates, on here not so long ago infact.
As you know I havent had any failures myself with them, due to not using them in the first place
. Each to their own, if propper sealing is availbile then they make a very cheap alternative to low CR pistons!.
I expect I shall be using one in my spare engine though (have a few 1.8s kicking about - I have decided to turn one into a 1.8 16v T as a spare....dont want the downtime I have had in the past.
Tony, spill the beans on that sealant then!
As you know I havent had any failures myself with them, due to not using them in the first place
. Each to their own, if propper sealing is availbile then they make a very cheap alternative to low CR pistons!. I expect I shall be using one in my spare engine though (have a few 1.8s kicking about - I have decided to turn one into a 1.8 16v T as a spare....dont want the downtime I have had in the past
.Tony, spill the beans on that sealant then!
19-01-2005, 07:50 AM
#44
PassionFord Post Troll
Originally Posted by tonypastie
PhilM
hey we never had a problem sealing it up mate depends what you use and nobody to this day has worked it out yet heres a clue it comes from the states
Be a good little project that bud.....I used 1mm machined pistons (7.8:1) in my old ZVH. I'd rather have machind pistons anyday over a spacer plate, at least you have propper sealing between head and block then!.
depends what you use and nobody to this day has worked it out yet heres a clue it comes from the states
19-01-2005, 08:01 AM
#45
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wiltshire UK
Posts: 3,795
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
lol.. so you don't have any experience of plate failures then Phil..
Seriously, provided the plate is suitably prepared, it will behave like an extension to the block - make the plate locate on the block dowels snugly, circular hole on one which is a good fit, and slightly elongated on the other to allow for the small amount of expansion differential between the iron block and steel plate.. this will stop the plate being able to move around.
The plate face and block face need to be flat, so u get an intimate mating surface, the sealing issue really comes down to keeping the fluids in then, the pressure physically cannot "leak" because it's got nowhere to go as the gaps are miniscule if the surfaces are an intimate fit.
The gasket then sits between the plate and the head, and behaves exactly as it would in a normal setup.
The main issue with the plate is that it makes the combustion chamber shape less than ideal, removing the effective squish area wher the piston doesn't get close to the head, but this is no different to skimming the piston..
Seriously, provided the plate is suitably prepared, it will behave like an extension to the block - make the plate locate on the block dowels snugly, circular hole on one which is a good fit, and slightly elongated on the other to allow for the small amount of expansion differential between the iron block and steel plate.. this will stop the plate being able to move around.
The plate face and block face need to be flat, so u get an intimate mating surface, the sealing issue really comes down to keeping the fluids in then, the pressure physically cannot "leak" because it's got nowhere to go as the gaps are miniscule if the surfaces are an intimate fit.
The gasket then sits between the plate and the head, and behaves exactly as it would in a normal setup.
The main issue with the plate is that it makes the combustion chamber shape less than ideal, removing the effective squish area wher the piston doesn't get close to the head, but this is no different to skimming the piston..
19-01-2005, 08:08 AM
#47
PassionBMW.com Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 3,530
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by richm
lol.. so you don't have any experience of plate failures then Phil..
hence I have never siad I have first hand experiance of it . I do things the way I see best for the application, and will generally steer clear of things I dont have 100% confidence in.Rich, with squish, even propper low CR pistons that I have seen that have bowls machined into them, the shape of the bowl to the CC in the head destroys just about all of the squish design in the head!
There are some very nice pistons out there though that retain it!Are you going be at the Bristol meet on tommorow mate?
19-01-2005, 09:30 AM
#50
lol, well it started to whine, and i have just kept driving it, drive it till it breaks like lol
im pretty sure its the input shaft bearing, and its getting worse, and hopefully will last till the weekend, cos i got another one now and it will be going in this weekend
im pretty sure its the input shaft bearing, and its getting worse, and hopefully will last till the weekend, cos i got another one now and it will be going in this weekend
19-01-2005, 04:52 PM
#51
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wiltshire UK
Posts: 3,795
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by PhilM
Originally Posted by richm
lol.. so you don't have any experience of plate failures then Phil..
Phil, u know i am only winding u up a bit here
, but you have got a passionate dislike for the plate without rational reason - machined down standard cast pistons WILL fail long before the plate causes any problem..
Are you going be at the Bristol meet on tommorow mate?
19-01-2005, 06:13 PM
#55
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 4,431
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
pics of my spacer plate
I purchased this off of Tonypastie I beleive a long long time ago now! But my zetec turbo project has long since faded away!
I couldn't choose using the FRST inlet & Injectors or keeping the zetec inlet and buying some beefy sideflow injectors.
In the end ive just given up and going the NA route
I purchased this off of Tonypastie I beleive a long long time ago now! But my zetec turbo project has long since faded away!
I couldn't choose using the FRST inlet & Injectors or keeping the zetec inlet and buying some beefy sideflow injectors.
In the end ive just given up and going the NA route
19-01-2005, 07:02 PM
#56
I'm Finding My Feet Here Now
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What low CR pistons do people use in the 1.8 Zetec to achieve an 8.5:1 ratio? I have a decompression plate on mine, but would like to turn to pistons next year to allow a bit more power and reliability. Are rods necessary too?
19-01-2005, 07:12 PM
#58
I'm Finding My Feet Here Now
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'll only be running at 200bhp, around 10 psi on Rich M's advice, as it is using the standard pistons which would take more power, but I wouldn't be able to use it as much as I'd like...ie under load with high revs. I'd like a strong 250bhp with low comp pistons next year ideally. Good info on the rods there 
19-01-2005, 07:42 PM
#61
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wiltshire UK
Posts: 3,795
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by whitneyd
What model Rover does the inlet come off of that you guys are talking about?
19-01-2005, 07:49 PM
#63
Too many posts.. I need a life!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: International Star can be any where
Posts: 994
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
once again MR philm you piss me off we have sold 5-6 of these decompression plates with no problems ever and you always slag these off !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! my zetec turbo conversion with richm cost me just over Ł600 to do from start to finish including buying the engine and made over 200 bhp with no problems and is still going strong nearly two years later SO THEY DO WORK and skimming piston yes nice until it goes BANG which it will do until you have any proff they dont work SHUT UP!
and how long have you been doing your car ??????????????? does it run yet lol
i could go on but i shall shut up as you no we did it to prove you dont have to buy Ł600 pistons to start with
and how long have you been doing your car ??????????????? does it run yet lol
i could go on but i shall shut up as you no we did it to prove you dont have to buy Ł600 pistons to start with
19-01-2005, 08:18 PM
#65
I'm Finding My Feet Here Now
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Can anyone tell me if the 1.8 block is the same as the 2.0? It's been suggested to me that instead of just getting low comp 1.8 pistons, I get a rebore to 2.0 AND get low comp pistons. Is that doable/safe?
19-01-2005, 08:25 PM
#66
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wiltshire UK
Posts: 3,795
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by JimmyRS2005
Can anyone tell me if the 1.8 block is the same as the 2.0? It's been suggested to me that instead of just getting low comp 1.8 pistons, I get a rebore to 2.0 AND get low comp pistons. Is that doable/safe?
The 2.0 bore is some 4-5mm bigger than 1.8 and the bore castings are siamesed accordingly to allow this bore increase. Boring a 1.8 +4mm is likely to result in wet pistons
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post