Neil@FastFord

Any of the PF legal eagles and tradesmen wanna look at this?

Slight storm brewing, would like to know some facts and if these prices can be beaten, sure as fuck they can!

But anyway.

Views and opinions, thankyou please--------


Gents

After a week of getting quotations from many different tradesman on the issues we have at 96 Ludlow Close I can now inform you of the outstanding costs that will arise from the damages caused.


Firstly the costs of the damage to Neil's bedroom-

The supply and fitting of a carpet to the equivalent value is £320.88
The cost redecorating and repairing the damage caused by the dog to the banisters and kitchen walls will cost a total of £420. This is a very reasonable price considering it includes labour and material costs! These costs are obviously not down to all the tenants and Neil has indicated that he will cover the damages to these areas. Neil would also need to pay £50 for the furniture that he has taken with him from the property. Total amount payable for this damage - £790.88


Secondly the damage to the kitchen worktop. There are five different ring marks on the worktop where somebody has obviously placed a hot pan on the surface on various occasions, which has resulted in markings and a 'raised' ring on the worktop surface. Dougie observed this on Sunday and I have since found out from B & Q that they have stopped production of this design of work surface. We therefore have the issue of changing the worktop in the kitchen but then having a different design in the utility room! This is not ideal, and I don't see why we should have to tolerate this inconvenience due to an individuals total disregard for someone's property. But we feel that we have found a match that will go with the worktop in the utility room and therefore only the kitchen worktops will need replacing. I have had 4 quotes on the removal and fitting of the worktops and the cheapest has been £190. The cost of the worktops themselves (as we need two) total £150.

Finally the tarmac drive at the front of the property. I have had 5 quotes from various organisations on the damage to the tarmac, and all 5 have expressed that the oil has severely penetrated the tarmac and would need to be dug up, rather than just covered with a new layer!
The quotes have varied from £800 to £1500. The £800 quote would just take the top layer off and then replace with a new layer. This method would not guarantee that the tarmac would be in good condition long term but we would be happy to proceed with this as it is a solution to the problem.

The total amount payable is £340 (Deposit of £800 has been deducted) If you would like a copy of all the quotes, please let me know and I will forward them on to you immediately. We are planning to start work on all the repairs next Monday, these problems have obviously meant that we have not been able to move in as planned this week.

As you can imagine, this whole experience has been an unpleasant one for us. We never expected our property to be treated with such disrespect and it has been quite upsetting to see all the damages caused.

I would like to bring your attention particular 1.8.9 in the tenancy contract, which states;

In the event that the total amount lawfully due at the end of the tenancy exceeds the amount of the deposit the Tenant shall reimburse the Landlord the further amount, within 14 days of the request being made.

I'm sure we would all like to move on from this unfortunate situation and would appreciate this being dealt with promptly. Our bank details for a bank transfer are :

Acc Name - Mr Hugh Janus
Sort Code - xxxxx
Acc No - xxxxx


I look forward to a prompt response.

TIFF

I take it you like in this house and the landlord has issued you with this letter.....

TBH the prices are pretty good for what is being said needs to be done.....

Coldo

I read it as you have caused damage to a rented house, thus you are due to pay for it?

If he can provide you copies of legit quotations/prices then i dont think you can argue, up to him who he gets to repair his property, imo.

TIFF

If it was people in a property i owned i would be doing exactly the same thing......

ballin

iTrader: (1)

Speaking from a landlords point of view, it appears your landlord has been reasonable, obtained as many quotes as possible etc and now the ball is in your court.
I would suggest you obtain a copy of the quotes, and if they are all similar then that is the going rate, if you want more quotes done then you better speak quick and suggest a company.

Other than that, not sure what you are asking?

fordsportjay

iTrader: (6)

have you actually caused all the damage?

ie were all the items"as new" and no oil on driveway at all? i had my drive tarmac'd a couple of years ago for £600,so price prob about right.


i had something similar a few years ago but i offered to replace the carpet and repaint the skirting boards(bastard puppies eh!),and they let me do the work.which cost me a lot less than they wanted to charge.

Neil@FastFord

Nah, moved out now.

Shared the house for 3+ years. Basically wants a new drive for oil stains?

The damage by the pooch was repaired, he wants it redone, i am cool with that, can't argue and she was a pup, so shit happens. I'll take that on the chin


Wants a new carpet due to two stains, i think a £40 cleaner hire will sort it. Not accepting any wear and tear at all....this is the grey area i wanna discuss really.

The kitchen burns are a new one to me, i aint accepting the bill for that. But in a nutshell he wants best part of 2k for it.....he makes it sound like we fucked his house, it reaaaaally isn't bad, bar some slight chewing, whoops!

But oil on a driveway, again, that's wear and tear aint it? It is a shite quality tarmac drive that is all coming away and he wants 800 notes for a new one...it wasnt new when we moved in, nor were his shit quality carpet, my old man was a fitter, so i know that the price is a bit much.

I have been real good with him so far, told him to stand on me for anything he wasnt happy with and not blame my housemates as the dog is all down to me, just seems he wants a new house after taking over 3 years worth of £880 a month off us.

Wouldn't mind if i had trashed it asylum seeker style. It's been the most boring house, ever. Neighbours were gutted when we left.

Neil@FastFord

Aye Jay. Not doubt the chewing and stuff were done by the dog and my problem. But we repaired the bannister, looks good IMO

Nothing was intentional. Like i say, not trying to avoid responsibilty, far from it, he actually thanked me when i called to discuss it and stand up to be counted a few week ago.

But i just think he is tryin to fist me a touch, without lube.

Mrs T

when did you move out? did anyone check the place before you leeft letting agents or someone to say it was ok

Rick Astley

Ask yourself, in regards to the work he has suggested be undertaken, would this return the house to the state at which it was first rented to you or would it exceed the standard to which it was originally rented to you in.

If it's the former, bite the bullet mate and pay up. If it's the latter, talk to him about it and explain why you think it's unfair. Offer to go halves?

I have no legal knowledge of this so that is simply what I would do in your situation.

Mrs T

thats one expensive carpet, unless your bedroom was huge
i had my front room and bedroom done for 300 that inclued fitting, and my rooms are big

Neil@FastFord

*t*- I moved out the first week of Jan, offical move out was the other weekend, i didnt go, other housemates did, never got a photo inventory like previous places.

Rick- This is it pal, i totally accept the bulk of it and know the furry Princess has been bad. I did my best to repair everything, i didnt think it was bad, if he wants that sorting, then i'll take it no bother. But it's the wanting a new drive for his old shit, broken tarmac one, and wanting new carpets for is scabby, cheap quality ones.

For me, it's that i have an issue with.

I'll be phoning tonight to discuss, can i send a cleaner etc etc


I just have a vision of him with a mint drive and 3" thick carpets. When we moved in the driveway was already breaking up and cheap, so it's had 3 years of smelly vauxhalls and old fords on it, so it has oil marks....

It's the acceptable wear 'n tear issue i wanna discuss. It's a grey area. To me, a couple of stains after 3+ years is acceptable wear n tear, if it isn't a professional clean or a contribution to buying new is more acceptable.

Not spunking out for new so he has a house better than we did.

If my dog wasn't so cute i'd make her into a handbag for the Mrs,



*joke, the pig is worth every penny,

Markb_s1

snap.. same here.

although in the past I did once split the cost of repairs with the tenants as Rick has suggested since the carpet was kind of on its way out.. just without the massive burn that was the tenants left it with!

ballin

iTrader: (1)

nowwww you give the other side to the story!

after what you have said, i would fight the points you mentioned.
there should have been in a move-in and move-out report done, along with annual (at least) inspections....is this the case?

Neil@FastFord

*T*- I know!! Nope, average size. It was a 3 bed house and my room was the meduim sized room, existing carpet is just cheap beige shit and it wasnt great when i moved in, ok it has two stains but surely a pro carpet clean or £100 or whatever is more like it for wear and tear?

sikora

With regards to the carpet. I'm in the process of moving out of my rented house and the agreement we had was that the carpet is professionally cleaned when we leave. Would definatley be worth you trying to clean it before stumping up for a new carpet

Did you have an inventory done by the estate agent before you loved in? They should of picked up on the state of the tarmac and any stains on the carpet before you moved in.
When i got my inventory when i moved in they went as far as noting sticker marks left on the bathroom door from those stick on hooks.

Neil@FastFord

Nope, fella spent 3 years in Oz.

Never caused an issue, always paid up on time etc.

Annoyingly, i stayed on when instinct told me to go...he gave us a move out date, then contacted saying he wanted to stay out there, asking if we wanted to extend, i should have gone then....he put the rent up then too! Which we paid, and the £880 a month is way OTT compared to simialar, houses for rent on that estate.

I moved out, now in a huge cottage with tons of land for £750 a month

But Ballin, no mate, just a contract on moving in, we signed it, and that was all, no inspections apart from him personally havin a sniff round when he returned.....

I sorta expected him to be giving me a big bill, the dog thing is an arse, i felt it was good enough, he says no, ok i will sort that. The driveway came as a massive shock tho.

Just feel a touch bummed if i have to re-carpet the place at full cost.

Keep sayin it, but none of what's gone on has been intentional and i really have tried to be good and stand up to take the heat, but i can't swallow a couple of things.

Neil@FastFord

I mentioned it about the drive to my housemate, he said "he has pics" i aint seen 'em.

But they are also 3 years old, what is acceptable wear and tear...surely it would be a contribution or percentage to the repair, not a new drive?

Feel like callin' Mick 'n Paddy; let them tarmac is drive

fiend

iTrader: (1)

What is the damage to the carpet?

If its just dirt/stains rent a carpet cleaner from Homebase, for £30 and go clean the carpets - take before and after pictures, and send a copy of the receipt to the Landlord.

As its beige carpet and you have been there 3+ the landlord really does need to take into account wear and tear. (I had this issue in a house I rented last year).

I would also the same applies to the drive way, if it was not brand new when you moved in and its had 3/4 people driving over it in the space of 3 years its not going to look like it did the day you moved in.

"In the event that the total amount lawfully due at the end of the tenancy exceeds the amount of the deposit the Tenant shall reimburse the Landlord the further amount, within 14 days of the request being made."

The landlord can write whatever he likes in the tenancy agreement but it does not make it legal. You do not have to pay it within 14 days if you do not agree with the charges/repairs.

Has your deposit been held in a Tenancy Deposit Scheme? As the company should be dealing with the dispute.

Mrs T

i bet the carpet was thin in the first place always are in rented but thats got to be general wear and tear, tell him your clean it for him
ask to see the marks in the kitchen..
as for the driveway is there alot of oil on it? or just a few spots

sikora

Personally i think this is why proper paperwork, inventorys are best. No arguments then.

I dont think you can get away with the drive is down to wear and tear, but i do think its asking too much for it to be resurfaced. What driveway company is going to turn down the job and say it doesn't need doing?
Maybe try and clean the oil stains as much as possible. Good scrub with degreaser and jetwash.

Neil@FastFord

Good question, will have to check on deposit.

Me and one of the housemates aint that arsed about the 800 deposit, he can keep it so we have an easier time.

But yeah two drink spillages, which i left, i intended to get a pro cleaner but he visited and noticed some damage from the dog chewing, i was already in process of moving so after talking to him i thought, fuck spending time and hassell on a cleaner, because if he just wants my deposit and a few quid extra he can have it.

But bottom line, its a few spillage marks, no cig burns, no "dirty protests" no bald areas, its just an old shite carpet......that apparantly costs nearly £400! Hmmm.

Carpet was defo not brand new on move in, some years back. And to me, it's cheap carpet anyway, going off helping my old man when i was younger.


Same for the drive, we said on move it, its great to have the drive and garage, we all work on mags so we said it would be great to work on cars there, yeah it does have oil marks but, it would, it's a driveway, it is it's job!

The grey area of wear n tear is what is stickin' in my throat.

Fair point about putting what they want in and not making it legal, fuck me, for the rent he wants, a day in court could be cheaper....

Not what i want, i just wanna put the place behind me, but i can't help thinking because i was so good on the phone and so open to pay my way, he has seen a few poundsigns and fancys some axeminster and a bit of crazy paving out of the deal.

H7 CYA

iTrader: (3)

Did you not have to give an extra deposit for having the dog. I guess all thats covered any way. i dont think he can argue if you say you want to get the carpet cleaned. If it comes up good then fine but if it doesnt then your left with no choice but to pay for it.
As for the driveway it really depends on the extent of the oils stains. I mean what do you call wear and tear?
If there are multiple stains and rotting then i really think he is being quite reasonable.
Just got to imagine it if it was your driveway.

Big G

Just seagull the cunt and have done with.

Neil@FastFord

*T*- Yep, it is, thin and crushed, you can see on the stairs were people have been walking for years. Ther driveway does have a fair bit of a stain on, but again, if he has a problem, to me that's a day with a jetwash and some gunk, or a contribution, not a new one, it most certainly was not new when we moved in. Ok it didnt have 3+ years of cavailver and escort bonus oil but still...

Sikora- Agree, i had a place in manc as well as down here for a while, and they charged me £70 for the inventory and move in/move out. But when i saw the pics and book they gave me, it was worth every penny.

smithy20vt

With a landlord with a name like that your gonna get bent over

Neil@FastFord

That's the thing, if it was my driveway, i'd accept it. Or ask for a clean. It wasn't a shining example of driveways to begin with.

Nope, but again, it isn't even slightly about the dog. I have held my hands up and made a big deal out of saying to him "blame me, put it on me, do not blame my housemates and withhold thier deposit cause of this" and like i said he seemed cool and was grateful i called and was that way.



It's a big question mark on the whole new for old thing.

PMSL- Landlord name changed to protect the innocent mate

Ginger Will

In an ideal world the owner would not have to go through the ball ache of changing carpets, worktops etc.... On that basis the costs are reasonable because no additional levy has been made to cover administration costs. Although they might also be able to make any repairs tax deductible for themselves......

Mrs T

carpet is wear and tear and he cant charge you for that, tell him your get the stains out but not paying for a new carpet..


dunno if this helps a bit http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_ad...deposits_cover

tell him your clean up the driveway as goodwill but you are not paying out for him to have a new one due to marks that will come off..

and maybe get him to show you the marks in the kitchen

sikora

If theres no inventory or photos then i think he'd struggle to have a case against you anyway. If he does indeed have photos then i'd ask to see them

Neil@FastFord

We are happy enough to say, you can have the deposit, Neil will pay for the dog damage but you can do one on taking £320 for the carpet and the extra £340.

He gets an £800 deposit payment, plus he takes damage money off me. I actually offered to come and clean if it helped...no reply on that.

Well, if the kitchen has marks, i won't be paying. Key reason for me wanting out was scruffy cunts, i ALWAYS rinse my pots before eating my tea, i think i know which housemate is to blame for that one.

It's tricky because i know some would just bump the fella, but regardless of my laguage, i was brought up right and take pride in standing up when something like this arises. But there is wanting to do right, and being taken advantage of....

Iain Mac

Doggy damage and burnt kitchen units - no arguments, just pay the man.

If the stains come out of the carpet and it is just left looking worn, that's what they call wear and tear and he shouldn't expect you to replace it JUST because of that. BUT... if he's worried about dog-piss or dog-poo having soaked in and become hidden under the carpet I wouldn't say he's wrong to ask for the carpet to be replaced - especially if the keeping of pets wasn't expressly agreed in your tenancy document.

The driveway is a harder one - oil damages tarmac. The time to clean the spillages was when they were fresh, not up to three years later. It's harsh, but if his driveway is in ANY way worse than it was when you moved in (beyond normal wear) I think you should pay.

And if you moved in three years ago, i don't think the deposit money had to go in a separate account back then - though I'm not sure the rule applied to existing deposits or only new ones. Reality is, he has your money and you ain't getting it back!!

CliffRS4

iTrader: (1)

I bought a brand new 3 bed last march and rented it out from the start. The letting agency that I go through are extremely professional. So in that respect I am very lucky. Good initial inspections with well set out rules, tenants deposit in the correct place etc.

I look after the interests of my tenants and in turn they look after my property. Put in sky dish, pay to have the garden done blah blah. Being pro active ensures that they feel looked after and will continue to extend their contract.

In my tenancy agreement it is very strict about animals and every sort of small intricate detail that you could even begin to imagine. They have a cat. It's caused no damage. It's a house cat and never goes out. However we agreed that the carpets would be professionally cleaned in order to get rid of stains and fleas should there be any when they leave. I call that fair. Both parties came to a mutual agreement.

However I do sympathise a little with the the landlord as you have said that all the drive needs is a days clean with a jet washer and degreaser. He probably thinks that you couldn't be bothered to make the effort to clean it and didn't really care.

It'd be a bit like you lending a nice car to a friend and him returning it with no gas and dirty inside and out. You wouldn't like it.

Houses are expensive to run and maintain. It is depressing and down heartening to see something that probably is your largest investment in life not treated with the same respect that the owner would treat it.

However I do believe that you shouldn't be responsible for all the cost of the drive. Especially as it wasn't brand new. Perhaps he wouldn't be so harsh if you had made the effort to clean it. A little effort can go a long way

Maybe you can come to a percentage agreement of the costs.

Best of luck Neil

Neil@FastFord

I agree! I will be happy to pay for the dog and be happy to make whoever burnt the unit pay...it's not me, so i wont go 3's on the burn, but i will make the others cough.

No, no dog piss or whatver, drink spillage, was in my bedroom

Hey, read above, he is WELCOME to the 800 deposit, i'm happy for that, i don't want him with a bitter taste. But likewise, i feel my way on the phone with him, he has felt i wont question whatever bill he sticks under my nose.

Bottom line, this is ONLY really about the wear and tear damage...i keep repeating that.


I just think the carpet replacement is harsh and the price is a lot. The drive is another one, where i feel it could be cleaned off. Ok, it didnt have much stains on it originally, but it WAS a shit drive....wear around the edges.


Anyway, it's pretty much going in circles, just wanted to check if i was actually being out of order for wanting to question the drive and carpet.

Cheers

Neil@FastFord

Aye, cheers Cliff....i'm moving in your gaff next!


I agree with all you put mate, i would have made more effort and had planned to.
I had penciled in a weekend to do my Mr Muscle bit with some hired industrial cleaning gear.
Reason for not doing so was due to our chat, he was saying things like "i have had a look, seen a few things, don't worry, i will look into it" The bit was does stick in my mind however was at one point he said "well, i have see the stains, i think it needs a new carpet in there" i say "right" "he contiuned and said "yeah, i will price everything up, ill do the final check out, and let you know the final costs to sort all this, your bedroom will be for my son so it needs to be decorated"


That rings in my head....

Am i being taken for a mug becuase i called him, i told him i will leave the house as is and wait to hear, he originally was happy with that. Just can't shake the feeling i'll be kitting his soon to be born son out with a room a damn sight tidier than i had.

Rah! Hometime, cheers folks.

DMR

im a pro carpet cleaner, couple beer stains will come out in seconds so £40 for the room will look like new.

http://www.smartseal.co.uk/cleaning-...il-remover.htm best oil remover i have ever used.

any good with a jigsaw? go to b&q buy the work top for kitchen and fit them yaself, not hard as u just remove the old ones and use them as templates.

How can he prove the repairs werent there before u moved in?

Hope u get it sorted

jpfour

your deposit should have been held in a deposit protection scheme

"Tenancy deposit law was introduced on 6th April 2007 and provides protection for tenants by preventing landlords and letting agents from unfairly withholding a deposit. The scheme protects all Assured Shorthold Tenancies in England and Wales (covering most tenancies since 1997)."

see http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TenancyDeposit/DG_066383 if it was not there are implications for the landlord, if they [the DPS] find in your favour you will get your money back simples

CliffRS4

iTrader: (1)

Neil, I have no contact what so ever with my tenants. Have had the chanceto meet them and specifically told the letting agency that I want to keep it at a professional level. I keep the house in good order and they pay the mortgage.

Besides when I am home I can walk past the house and they won't even know who I am

Buying another brand new 3 bed buy to let in August. I would let you rent off of me but you don't sound like my ideal tenant

Write down the main points that you are not happy with. Speak to him on the level like you have and point out that he is getting new blah blah when it wasn't new. He is also getting the opportunity to redecorate etc to his and his sons new tastes at your expense. He has admitted that he was going to redecorate anyway.

Agree that the place wasn't left ideally and that you expected a reasonable bill. However make it quite clearthat you aren't the one that is going to fund it so he can move into a luxury pad.

See what he says. Be polite, firm, but understanding and I am sure he will come round.

Best of luck

Big G

ballin

iTrader: (1)

I haven't read all the replies, but you said there was no move-in/out report.

In that case, he is going to find it VERY hard to pursue you for damages, so I would suggest you politely tell him if he takes the piss which he is doing, then you will withdraw your kind offer to repair the damage you [didn't really!] admit to, and he can take you to court for the lot, which he will lose as he cannot prove it was not like that before you moved in.