How much power to make a rwd cossie run a low 13?
#1
How much power to make a rwd cossie run a low 13?
As subject, just wondering how much power i need out of my cossie before it can compete with the slower of my two novas?
350 do it?
350 do it?
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Re: How much power to make a rwd cossie run a low 13?
Originally Posted by chip-3door
As subject, just wondering how much power i need out of my cossie before it can compete with the slower of my two novas?
350 do it?
350 do it?
NOW to the Cos it's not so much as to wat power u need but to get a very good axle so as to get it off the line with the least amount of traction loss imo
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#12
Lol, its crazy really that Im actaully having trouble getting my cossie to be as quick as my nova, lol, sounds ridiculous when i read it back.
Define "proper rear end" please someone, do you mean changing the diff etc, or just making sure the bushes are all in good nick and the shocks arent knackered?
Define "proper rear end" please someone, do you mean changing the diff etc, or just making sure the bushes are all in good nick and the shocks arent knackered?
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making sure it keeps as mush of the tyre on the floor as possible
they squat like crazy as standard and only the inner edge of the rubber meets the tarmac
they squat like crazy as standard and only the inner edge of the rubber meets the tarmac
#14
i know practically nothing about the rear end of a cossie or how to best set it up, so how do i make sure i get the tyre to stay flat?
firmer suspension to stop it squatting?
different camber in the first place to cancel it out?
firmer suspension to stop it squatting?
different camber in the first place to cancel it out?
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Originally Posted by chip-3door
i know practically nothing about the rear end of a cossie or how to best set it up, so how do i make sure i get the tyre to stay flat?
firmer suspension to stop it squatting?
different camber in the first place to cancel it out?
firmer suspension to stop it squatting?
different camber in the first place to cancel it out?
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I've done a 13.6 with under 300bhp on a standard rear end.
More power doesn't always make you quicker, sometimes it makes it worse.
cheers
Daniel
More power doesn't always make you quicker, sometimes it makes it worse.
cheers
Daniel
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all about grip, only need more power when you can put it on the floor, IIRC mike rainbird does a cheap washer/rear beam de-camber kit that gives good results, and ZOO do a mega jag diff/modded rear beam at much more but is the dogs danglies
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Chip, the main problem with a RWD cossie is squat when you launch. The back end dives and the wheels go in the arch with MASSIVE camber. This leaves you with a smaller tyre contact patch than the average Renualt 5 Campus.
There are a few cheap tricks to solving this. Lee (Tib) uses towing 'spring assitors' to great effect, and has done a 0-60 in the 3 second mark in a RWD Saph. Another great addition is the shims that Mike R sells. Once the car is lowered it always has camber on the rear wheels. The shims basically push out the top of the hub to reduce the camber increase the tyre contact area, although you will still get camber as the suspension rises in its arc, but it is reduced somewhat.
Both of these methods have been tried and tested and will cost you about Ł20!
The next thing to look at is some sticky tyres, i'm sure you know all about those and how important they are.
After that you are looking at getting a new rear beam either Ahmed or Zoo Motorsport type. It will set you back in the region of a grand though!
Either way power has very little to do with it at all. Danny B has run a 12.2 at 114mph with a stage 1 setup (270ish bhp) if I remember correctly - but he has a very special back end on the car!
When my Saph was at its fastest, in the dry at Brunters it could only put full power down in 4th gear, using Koni rear suspension, standard beam and 235 wide Yoko tyres.
EDITED TO ADD: The only problem is, once you get any sort of grip you will blow the diff to peices off the line, even with stage 1 it happens!
There are a few cheap tricks to solving this. Lee (Tib) uses towing 'spring assitors' to great effect, and has done a 0-60 in the 3 second mark in a RWD Saph. Another great addition is the shims that Mike R sells. Once the car is lowered it always has camber on the rear wheels. The shims basically push out the top of the hub to reduce the camber increase the tyre contact area, although you will still get camber as the suspension rises in its arc, but it is reduced somewhat.
Both of these methods have been tried and tested and will cost you about Ł20!
The next thing to look at is some sticky tyres, i'm sure you know all about those and how important they are.
After that you are looking at getting a new rear beam either Ahmed or Zoo Motorsport type. It will set you back in the region of a grand though!
Either way power has very little to do with it at all. Danny B has run a 12.2 at 114mph with a stage 1 setup (270ish bhp) if I remember correctly - but he has a very special back end on the car!
When my Saph was at its fastest, in the dry at Brunters it could only put full power down in 4th gear, using Koni rear suspension, standard beam and 235 wide Yoko tyres.
EDITED TO ADD: The only problem is, once you get any sort of grip you will blow the diff to peices off the line, even with stage 1 it happens!
#24
DEYTUKURJERBS
GOOD tyres and a set of mikeys camber things will be the biggest help for the least money. People talking uprated beams and shit thats running into the 1000s here...
And the LSDs are pretty shit, esp as they get looser as they get older, so fuck it, get the welder out n lock it
And the LSDs are pretty shit, esp as they get looser as they get older, so fuck it, get the welder out n lock it
#28
Phil, that certainly makes sense, at the moment the suspension is very tired and squats loads, when it does so the back just has no grip at all, i swear id struggle to match my 2.2 60ft time from the nova, which is crazy in a car that is driving the right set of wheels!
When fitting coilovers to the rear of a cossie do you need to turret it or are they just bolt on?
Sounds like ill be running quaiffes in 4 of my current cars not just three at this rate, lol, i should be getting frequent buyer discount!
Chip
When fitting coilovers to the rear of a cossie do you need to turret it or are they just bolt on?
Sounds like ill be running quaiffes in 4 of my current cars not just three at this rate, lol, i should be getting frequent buyer discount!
Chip
#30
phil the zoo beam is nothin g like a armeds beam
and there cheaper Ł750 Ł850 fteed set up)
the best way is rear wishbone set up as you can control the camber/wheel travel to parrel (off the line)
or progresive camber for track use
and there cheaper Ł750 Ł850 fteed set up)
the best way is rear wishbone set up as you can control the camber/wheel travel to parrel (off the line)
or progresive camber for track use
#31
just finding my feet
Originally Posted by chip-3door
Phil, that certainly makes sense, at the moment the suspension is very tired and squats loads, when it does so the back just has no grip at all, i swear id struggle to match my 2.2 60ft time from the nova, which is crazy in a car that is driving the right set of wheels!
When fitting coilovers to the rear of a cossie do you need to turret it or are they just bolt on?
Sounds like ill be running quaiffes in 4 of my current cars not just three at this rate, lol, i should be getting frequent buyer discount!
Chip
When fitting coilovers to the rear of a cossie do you need to turret it or are they just bolt on?
Sounds like ill be running quaiffes in 4 of my current cars not just three at this rate, lol, i should be getting frequent buyer discount!
Chip
the car weight fook all a saph aint the lightest thing either and also the size of the turbo for the 2.2 60ft times
get the car set up and see
cant see the relevance though as a saxo is quicker 60ft than my car, bet after that ill rape him,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, scratch that as i did
#33
Originally Posted by Ian3dr
When mine was Stage 3 with a T34, it would run 13.3/13.4 all day long
Nova had a slipping clutch on that run though and dip into the 12s im sure, so might need to go for a little more power on the cossie to stay with it, but at least they will be in the same ball park, just dont want people who have been out in my nova to go out in my cossie and think it feels really slow as that would be a bit embarassing, lol
Getting back to the suspension etc, can anyone fill me in on the fitting of coilovers to the rear of a 3 door, does it require turreting or is it just bolt on fitment, ill get them either way, just need to know what is involved so i know wether or not to comondere my mate who is a far better welder than me, lol
#34
just finding my feet
chip ya nova WILL feel faster than ya cossie anyway even if ya traveling at higherspeeds
trust me on that one
its the power up high in the rev range when the car keeps pulling that people will notice the most 60 to 130mph
trust me on that one
its the power up high in the rev range when the car keeps pulling that people will notice the most 60 to 130mph
#36
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Chip, I just fitted coilovers on mine, and does require some very minor mods to the inner arch where the bottom of the spring will sit. Mine had about 2mm clearance, but after 5 mins with the ball pain hammer, has about 5mm.
My Stage 3 was simply T34, on greens, 7.8:1, about 26psi, on konis, standard rear end and diff/clutch etc. I think the terminals were about 110mph.
My Stage 3 was simply T34, on greens, 7.8:1, about 26psi, on konis, standard rear end and diff/clutch etc. I think the terminals were about 110mph.
#38
Christ, this thread is actually making me realise just how quick my bloody novas actually are, lol
Ive always thought of cossie's as THE (realisticly priced) performance car (im 30 in 6 weeks so have been used to them conquering all for most of the last 2 decades) but to hear that im actually beating the majority of modifed ones is quite weird, obviously i know i kick a standard one's arse, but i always assumed once 20psi+ boost was involved it would be a different story.
Thanks for all on the coilovers advice lads, ill make sure i get enough clearance on the rear when i get a coilover kit and i'll get my mate Sean who is far more handy with a welder than me to seam round the existing joins.
Trouble is, there is another 1/3rd to half a second yet to come off that nova, as the clutch was slipping when i ran the 13.3 on its only pod outing, and my other one is far quicker (well feels it on the road, i havent had it on the strip yet to confirm) so i guess the cossie will never compete in that respect, but the cossie is a damn site more comfortable, can fit 5 in it if i need to and is far more fun on a wet roundabout, so i guess thats more important than out and out speed anyway.
Its going to be weird though if i lose a race to someone in my nice and shiney 3 door cossie that i think is the bollocks and then when i lose i turn round and say:
"wait right there mate i'll be back in a minute for another go in a slightly rusty very tatty c reg nova "
Ive always thought of cossie's as THE (realisticly priced) performance car (im 30 in 6 weeks so have been used to them conquering all for most of the last 2 decades) but to hear that im actually beating the majority of modifed ones is quite weird, obviously i know i kick a standard one's arse, but i always assumed once 20psi+ boost was involved it would be a different story.
Thanks for all on the coilovers advice lads, ill make sure i get enough clearance on the rear when i get a coilover kit and i'll get my mate Sean who is far more handy with a welder than me to seam round the existing joins.
Trouble is, there is another 1/3rd to half a second yet to come off that nova, as the clutch was slipping when i ran the 13.3 on its only pod outing, and my other one is far quicker (well feels it on the road, i havent had it on the strip yet to confirm) so i guess the cossie will never compete in that respect, but the cossie is a damn site more comfortable, can fit 5 in it if i need to and is far more fun on a wet roundabout, so i guess thats more important than out and out speed anyway.
Its going to be weird though if i lose a race to someone in my nice and shiney 3 door cossie that i think is the bollocks and then when i lose i turn round and say:
"wait right there mate i'll be back in a minute for another go in a slightly rusty very tatty c reg nova "
#39
trouble is a nova is a nova thats it nothing to shout about
i done a few 16v conv and there deadly to drive
all over the road dont handle heavy steering
its like sayin a 1.3 nova 50 bhp fit a 150 bhp engine
a 220 bhp cozzy times that by 3 y a got 660 bhp
end of the day ech to there own
i done a few 16v conv and there deadly to drive
all over the road dont handle heavy steering
its like sayin a 1.3 nova 50 bhp fit a 150 bhp engine
a 220 bhp cozzy times that by 3 y a got 660 bhp
end of the day ech to there own