Targeting criminals same as targeting poor people???
25-08-2009, 08:36 PM
#1
Targeting criminals same as targeting poor people???
Ok been having a few problems at work. Ive been mostly on the car park this last week and have had a couple of complaints against me by the public.
The whole car park is a no smoking zone as defined in law because its an enclosed space. It is well signed everywhere except by one area where most people walk in (it is only not signed because the criminal who i caught smoking had ripped down the sign, but still the signage is well within the legal requirements).
Quite often smokers think the law does not apply to them and smoke and usually when told its illegal to smoke there, they apologise and stop.
But this week I have encountered 2 people who became abusive over me telling them to stop smoking. They both had pretty similar complaint that why should they be told where they can and cant smoke and that I'm targeting poor people!! My reply to them is that breaking the smoking laws has nothing to do with being poor! they both became verbally abusive so i told them i would call the PCSO's if they didnt stop smoking. They both stopped smoking, swore at me and walked off before complaining to customer services!!
Now ive had similar reactions from people who have no road tax on thier cars saying that I'm targeting poor people by sticking warning notices on thier cars.
Now i dont understand possibly how targeting criminals is targeting poor people???? yes some criminals may be also poor but they are not being targeted because they have no money but because they are committing a crime!!
I have discussed this with a PCSO and he said that at Bentilee (the local rough council estate) approximately 40% of the vehicles on the road are illegal in some way be it tax, insurance, MoT, license etc but he explained that they cant just keep a load of police cars there to catch the cars and sieze them as it would be seen as targeting a poor community. Yet he couldnt explain why it would be seen as that.
Surely its simply the fact that someone is committing a crime not the fact that they are poor that is relevant??? Im sure theres plenty of middle class and rich people who also commit crime yet you dont hear about them whinging " your targeting the rich" etc
Whats your views??
The whole car park is a no smoking zone as defined in law because its an enclosed space. It is well signed everywhere except by one area where most people walk in (it is only not signed because the criminal who i caught smoking had ripped down the sign, but still the signage is well within the legal requirements).
Quite often smokers think the law does not apply to them and smoke and usually when told its illegal to smoke there, they apologise and stop.
But this week I have encountered 2 people who became abusive over me telling them to stop smoking. They both had pretty similar complaint that why should they be told where they can and cant smoke and that I'm targeting poor people!! My reply to them is that breaking the smoking laws has nothing to do with being poor! they both became verbally abusive so i told them i would call the PCSO's if they didnt stop smoking. They both stopped smoking, swore at me and walked off before complaining to customer services!!
Now ive had similar reactions from people who have no road tax on thier cars saying that I'm targeting poor people by sticking warning notices on thier cars.
Now i dont understand possibly how targeting criminals is targeting poor people???? yes some criminals may be also poor but they are not being targeted because they have no money but because they are committing a crime!!
I have discussed this with a PCSO and he said that at Bentilee (the local rough council estate) approximately 40% of the vehicles on the road are illegal in some way be it tax, insurance, MoT, license etc but he explained that they cant just keep a load of police cars there to catch the cars and sieze them as it would be seen as targeting a poor community. Yet he couldnt explain why it would be seen as that.
Surely its simply the fact that someone is committing a crime not the fact that they are poor that is relevant??? Im sure theres plenty of middle class and rich people who also commit crime yet you dont hear about them whinging " your targeting the rich" etc
Whats your views??
25-08-2009, 08:41 PM
#2
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You go out sticking notices on peoples cars for no tax???? You need a life! No offence like, but why waste your precious life doing that? Use the time to better yourself!
25-08-2009, 08:44 PM
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I think that your totally right!! There are people who are wore off that others who for some reason think that the world owes them something.
What we need is a police chief who dosent take any shit!! send in the calvery to this estate and if a car is illegal in any way, tow the fucker. start issuing fines and making arrests put them in jail. Or just keep reporting every car to the dvla that dosent have any road tax on it. Just do your bit mate.
its a shame that the phrase "Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime" dosent mean anything.
What we need is a police chief who dosent take any shit!! send in the calvery to this estate and if a car is illegal in any way, tow the fucker. start issuing fines and making arrests put them in jail. Or just keep reporting every car to the dvla that dosent have any road tax on it. Just do your bit mate.
its a shame that the phrase "Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime" dosent mean anything.
25-08-2009, 08:45 PM
#6
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why can't they smoke in a car park? Is it in a building? If it's open air I can see their point and I'd be pretty annoyed if someone told me to stop smoking (not that I'm a smoker)
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25-08-2009, 08:56 PM
#8
How is doing my job being a jobsworth??? also these people are comitting an OFFENCE so how is it being a jobsworth to stop them?? its not like im sticking parking tickets on a hearse or ambulance is it???
The car park is an enclosed place for the purposes of the recent smoking laws and therefore it is an offence to smoke here. We allow people to smoke on the roof level of the car park if they throw thier cigarette butts in a bin (another bug bear is litter bug smokers!!!).
25-08-2009, 09:00 PM
#9
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jimbo, if its illegal to smoke there then its the company's responsibility to ensure nobody does, so it is warrens job to stop them!
25-08-2009, 09:07 PM
#14
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Sorry, but a geezer smoking in a car park don't make him a criminal. If I was one of them pcso lot and you rang me reporting this I would think it was a joke.
25-08-2009, 09:14 PM
#16
Also its the PCSO's job to deal with antisocial behaviour, illegal smoking/drinking/littering etc. Theyve made it in many areas that a copper cant even issue a penalty notice for littering and you have to call the PCSO. Guess they have to justify thier existance.
25-08-2009, 09:18 PM
#18
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I won't ever see your point if view on this I'm afraid. Chamging the subject i'm just Reading through your puma cossie resto thread - awesome motor. 
25-08-2009, 09:20 PM
#20
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25-08-2009, 09:23 PM
#21
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I know its the law but I find laughable that you cant smoke in a car park but you can drive your car in there and leave it running churning carcinogens out!
25-08-2009, 09:35 PM
#23
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And up here, our smoking law is slightly different to that in England. It is another offence here to "knowingly permit smoking on the premises" so if you are in charge of a shop/office/carpark and don't deal with a smoker, you can be fined yourself. Now that it is genius!
25-08-2009, 09:56 PM
#25
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I was watching some police program about an estate in Hull the other night and it came across to me that if the residents all came out everytime the police came to do something, the police would more or less back down and the mob rule won
25-08-2009, 09:57 PM
#26
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i really dont think smoking in a car park makes you a criminal................come on be serious ffs sorry Warren but have to really disagree with you here bud imoa in the nicest why to say this.................are you god and do no wrong?because if you do some thing wrong your a criminal for life!!! it will be on your criminal record
25-08-2009, 10:01 PM
#27
I am a smoker, but abide by the law, if you shouldn't be smoking in an area then you shouldn't full stop.
May not be the crime of the century, but if your doing it and someone asks you not to as your not meant to, then you shouldn't be giving them shite for doing their job.
As for claiming to be picking on the poor, its the white mans race card equivalent lol!!
May not be the crime of the century, but if your doing it and someone asks you not to as your not meant to, then you shouldn't be giving them shite for doing their job.
As for claiming to be picking on the poor, its the white mans race card equivalent lol!!
25-08-2009, 10:19 PM
#30
What we need is a police chief who dosent take any shit!! send in the calvery to this estate and if a car is illegal in any way, tow the fucker. start issuing fines and making arrests put them in jail. Or just keep reporting every car to the dvla that dosent have any road tax on it.
25-08-2009, 10:25 PM
#31
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well the law says it does
Also its the PCSO's job to deal with antisocial behaviour, illegal smoking/drinking/littering etc. Theyve made it in many areas that a copper cant even issue a penalty notice for littering and you have to call the PCSO. Guess they have to justify thier existance.
Also its the PCSO's job to deal with antisocial behaviour, illegal smoking/drinking/littering etc. Theyve made it in many areas that a copper cant even issue a penalty notice for littering and you have to call the PCSO. Guess they have to justify thier existance.
you can also tell a PCSO to basically fuck off and walk away if they ask you to stop.
25-08-2009, 10:29 PM
#32
I agree that it isn't something that you should be classed as a criminal in the sense of having a record for it, way to far. It's more penalty offence.
The truth is it is people with a lack of respect, like jumping a que or parking in a disabled bay, if your not meant to do it, then general respect for others should tell you not to.
What grates me is when people get agro for being asked not to.
Where I park at work there is a cross hatched bay, it is there so that people parked up are able to back out, yet everyday people park their cars in the hatched bay making reversing out a nightmare.
If you ask them not to they look at you like shite and walk off if not give you gob. But those same people kick off when they get clamped "what the harm, why have I got claimed"
They have no respect for others and so the odd penalty works wonders, sadly there is always another pr*ck to follow them the next day.
The truth is it is people with a lack of respect, like jumping a que or parking in a disabled bay, if your not meant to do it, then general respect for others should tell you not to.
What grates me is when people get agro for being asked not to.
Where I park at work there is a cross hatched bay, it is there so that people parked up are able to back out, yet everyday people park their cars in the hatched bay making reversing out a nightmare.
If you ask them not to they look at you like shite and walk off if not give you gob. But those same people kick off when they get clamped "what the harm, why have I got claimed"
They have no respect for others and so the odd penalty works wonders, sadly there is always another pr*ck to follow them the next day.
25-08-2009, 10:31 PM
#34
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Warren, get it together!
Where a person can / cannot smoke and untaxed cars are not criminal matters.
Crime is stuff like sex offences, assaults, buglary, robbery, theft etc.
Around Sussex, the respective councils deal with breaches of smoking law. As for untaxed cars, the council send out a representative along with a PCSO in a van and they just lift stuff that's been untaxed for one month plus.
When I read the title of the thread, I thought you had a written an essay on how the lower socio-economic groups (who typically have little or no money) are always in trouble with the law. I was going to reply "because most of them are bored, immoral recidivists".
Where a person can / cannot smoke and untaxed cars are not criminal matters.
Crime is stuff like sex offences, assaults, buglary, robbery, theft etc.
Around Sussex, the respective councils deal with breaches of smoking law. As for untaxed cars, the council send out a representative along with a PCSO in a van and they just lift stuff that's been untaxed for one month plus.
When I read the title of the thread, I thought you had a written an essay on how the lower socio-economic groups (who typically have little or no money) are always in trouble with the law. I was going to reply "because most of them are bored, immoral recidivists".
25-08-2009, 10:38 PM
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All the multi storey car parks that you have been in are open air?
Dunno if its different from england up there with the classification, but we have this:
Dunno if its different from england up there with the classification, but we have this:
What is the definition of 'enclosed' and 'substantially enclosed'?
The Health Act 2006 sets out that premises that are open to the public, or are used as a place of work (by more than one person or where members of the public might attend to receive or provide goods or services) are to be smokefree in areas that are enclosed or substantially enclosed. This includes both permanent structures and temporary ones such as tents and marquees. A roof includes any fixed or movable structures, such as canvas awnings.
The Health Act 2006 sets out that premises that are open to the public, or are used as a place of work (by more than one person or where members of the public might attend to receive or provide goods or services) are to be smokefree in areas that are enclosed or substantially enclosed. This includes both permanent structures and temporary ones such as tents and marquees. A roof includes any fixed or movable structures, such as canvas awnings.
25-08-2009, 10:50 PM
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chip there is a roof above obvcourse but its not completely sealed fucking air tight thats going to kill you isnt itffs come on this thread when i first read it thought it was going to be something more criminal than smoking!!!whats next farting is a crime because its toxic fucking smells?
ffs come on this thread when i first read it thought it was going to be something more criminal than smoking!!!whats next farting is a crime because its toxic fucking smells?
25-08-2009, 10:55 PM
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I despise smoking in public full stop. Even in the open space, like the town centre for example. There should be enclosed shelters they have to cram in and smoke. If I was to walk round with a T-shirt on which read 'I hope you get Cancer' everyone would hate me and people would attack me. But people are knowingly allowed to increase your risk by passive smoking?
It's a dirty habbit and it should be banned in public... Completely! I have nothing against it at all, it's the fact that I have to breathe it in which annoys me.
Benni.
It's a dirty habbit and it should be banned in public... Completely! I have nothing against it at all, it's the fact that I have to breathe it in which annoys me.
Benni.
25-08-2009, 10:56 PM
#40
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chip there is a roof above obvcourse but its not completely sealed fucking air tight that's going to kill you isnt itffs come on this thread when i first read it thought it was going to be something more criminal than smoking!!!whats next farting is a crime because its toxic fucking smells?
ffs come on this thread when i first read it thought it was going to be something more criminal than smoking!!!whats next farting is a crime because its toxic fucking smells?