vehicle exhaust finefine - where do i stand?
20-08-2009, 09:11 PM
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vehicle exhaust finefine - where do i stand?
back in may i was stopped by the local plod in my mk2 polo i was using while the escort was off the road for a re-spray, the car was standard apart from a lowering kit and a side exit exhaust already on the car when i bought it.
i had it Db checked and it was 101Db at my work at the time so i believe thats in the limit for the law which i believe is 102 or 105Db??
upon stopping me however, they accused me of having no insurance (even though im fully comp and the policy was running for a long time) this was cleared up after a so called "computer fault" and they saw i had fully comp insurance.
then they said "your cars missing a silencer and thats an illegal exhaust, you have 7 days to remove it or we'll fine you and take your car from you."
after telling them i would not be paying the fine due to the car having all original silencers and they were the correct sizes, and that the car was legal on Db readings, would they read it themselves as proof? "we can hear it from here, its louder than legal mate its all the proof we need" was the reply. clearly not interested in doing things the proper way, i agreed and said fine if you dont want to check it its your choice but i know the car is legal or i wouldnt be driving the thing to and from work every day.
sold the car abou 5 days later just before the MOT ran out, notified the officers that i had sold it as i was sick of the hassle (and never getting over speed bumps with the thing without either cracking a sump or bursting wheel bearings and bottom arms to buggery)
no letter to show that they got my notification that i wouldnt be taking the car to them to be checked as i no longer owned the car and that it had been sold on to another owner.
now recieved a letter demanding i pay £30 fine for Road Traffic Act 1988, sections 75 & 76 in regards to not having a rear silencer on the car....... where do i stand??
i offered the police to to a Db check, they refused.
the car had the correct silencers, and the exhaust was safely attached to the side of the car from a support welded on for an exhaust rubber.
should i just pay the fine which i find a joke or appeal against it? feel like the police are really taking the piss with this with me letting them know about it and them not doing the proper checks on the car to prove it was above what they called an "illegal" noise limit!
i had it Db checked and it was 101Db at my work at the time so i believe thats in the limit for the law which i believe is 102 or 105Db??
upon stopping me however, they accused me of having no insurance (even though im fully comp and the policy was running for a long time) this was cleared up after a so called "computer fault" and they saw i had fully comp insurance.
then they said "your cars missing a silencer and thats an illegal exhaust, you have 7 days to remove it or we'll fine you and take your car from you."
after telling them i would not be paying the fine due to the car having all original silencers and they were the correct sizes, and that the car was legal on Db readings, would they read it themselves as proof? "we can hear it from here, its louder than legal mate its all the proof we need" was the reply. clearly not interested in doing things the proper way, i agreed and said fine if you dont want to check it its your choice but i know the car is legal or i wouldnt be driving the thing to and from work every day.
sold the car abou 5 days later just before the MOT ran out, notified the officers that i had sold it as i was sick of the hassle (and never getting over speed bumps with the thing without either cracking a sump or bursting wheel bearings and bottom arms to buggery)
no letter to show that they got my notification that i wouldnt be taking the car to them to be checked as i no longer owned the car and that it had been sold on to another owner.
now recieved a letter demanding i pay £30 fine for Road Traffic Act 1988, sections 75 & 76 in regards to not having a rear silencer on the car....... where do i stand??
i offered the police to to a Db check, they refused.
the car had the correct silencers, and the exhaust was safely attached to the side of the car from a support welded on for an exhaust rubber.
should i just pay the fine which i find a joke or appeal against it? feel like the police are really taking the piss with this with me letting them know about it and them not doing the proper checks on the car to prove it was above what they called an "illegal" noise limit!
20-08-2009, 09:19 PM
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back in may i was stopped by the local plod in my mk2 polo i was using while the escort was off the road for a re-spray, the car was standard apart from a lowering kit and a side exit exhaust already on the car when i bought it.
i had it Db checked and it was 101Db at my work at the time so i believe thats in the limit for the law which i believe is 102 or 105Db??
upon stopping me however, they accused me of having no insurance (even though im fully comp and the policy was running for a long time) this was cleared up after a so called "computer fault" and they saw i had fully comp insurance.
then they said "your cars missing a silencer and thats an illegal exhaust, you have 7 days to remove it or we'll fine you and take your car from you."
after telling them i would not be paying the fine due to the car having all original silencers and they were the correct sizes, and that the car was legal on Db readings, would they read it themselves as proof? "we can hear it from here, its louder than legal mate its all the proof we need" was the reply. clearly not interested in doing things the proper way, i agreed and said fine if you dont want to check it its your choice but i know the car is legal or i wouldnt be driving the thing to and from work every day.
sold the car abou 5 days later just before the MOT ran out, notified the officers that i had sold it as i was sick of the hassle (and never getting over speed bumps with the thing without either cracking a sump or bursting wheel bearings and bottom arms to buggery)
no letter to show that they got my notification that i wouldnt be taking the car to them to be checked as i no longer owned the car and that it had been sold on to another owner.
now recieved a letter demanding i pay £30 fine for Road Traffic Act 1988, sections 75 & 76 in regards to not having a rear silencer on the car....... where do i stand??
i offered the police to to a Db check, they refused.
the car had the correct silencers, and the exhaust was safely attached to the side of the car from a support welded on for an exhaust rubber.
should i just pay the fine which i find a joke or appeal against it? feel like the police are really taking the piss with this with me letting them know about it and them not doing the proper checks on the car to prove it was above what they called an "illegal" noise limit!
i had it Db checked and it was 101Db at my work at the time so i believe thats in the limit for the law which i believe is 102 or 105Db??
upon stopping me however, they accused me of having no insurance (even though im fully comp and the policy was running for a long time) this was cleared up after a so called "computer fault" and they saw i had fully comp insurance.
then they said "your cars missing a silencer and thats an illegal exhaust, you have 7 days to remove it or we'll fine you and take your car from you."
after telling them i would not be paying the fine due to the car having all original silencers and they were the correct sizes, and that the car was legal on Db readings, would they read it themselves as proof? "we can hear it from here, its louder than legal mate its all the proof we need" was the reply. clearly not interested in doing things the proper way, i agreed and said fine if you dont want to check it its your choice but i know the car is legal or i wouldnt be driving the thing to and from work every day.
sold the car abou 5 days later just before the MOT ran out, notified the officers that i had sold it as i was sick of the hassle (and never getting over speed bumps with the thing without either cracking a sump or bursting wheel bearings and bottom arms to buggery)
no letter to show that they got my notification that i wouldnt be taking the car to them to be checked as i no longer owned the car and that it had been sold on to another owner.
now recieved a letter demanding i pay £30 fine for Road Traffic Act 1988, sections 75 & 76 in regards to not having a rear silencer on the car....... where do i stand??
i offered the police to to a Db check, they refused.
the car had the correct silencers, and the exhaust was safely attached to the side of the car from a support welded on for an exhaust rubber.
should i just pay the fine which i find a joke or appeal against it? feel like the police are really taking the piss with this with me letting them know about it and them not doing the proper checks on the car to prove it was above what they called an "illegal" noise limit!
20-08-2009, 09:23 PM
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never thought about that, but unfortunately they want to see the car and have an MOT station stamp the ticket to say that you did the work on it... and i dont have the ticket or i'd be taking it up the road to the boy who does all our MOT's at our coachworks for us 
i couldnt ask for a copy of the ticket now mate.
should i pay it and be made a fool of because of some cocky mouthed pig fuckers, or should i appeal against it and tell them to get stuffed and im not paying due to them not having evidence to prove that the car was illegal when it clearly wasnt?
i couldnt ask for a copy of the ticket now mate.should i pay it and be made a fool of because of some cocky mouthed pig fuckers, or should i appeal against it and tell them to get stuffed and im not paying due to them not having evidence to prove that the car was illegal when it clearly wasnt?
21-08-2009, 08:11 AM
#6
Sounds like bollocks to me. Unlikely it will go to court as they have no proof of it. Write a letter to the chief inspector and send it recorded delivery with basically everything you have written here, I bet you get a letter back saying that they will not be persuing the matter any further!
I got a parking fine a little while back, I knew there was nothing they could legally do about it, so I ignored it, I also ignored about 4 or 5 threatening letters I got saying I'm going to court etc, and I havent heard a peep since!
I got a parking fine a little while back, I knew there was nothing they could legally do about it, so I ignored it, I also ignored about 4 or 5 threatening letters I got saying I'm going to court etc, and I havent heard a peep since!
21-08-2009, 08:20 AM
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Drunk on power springs to mind!!! 
They have no evidence of the Db. With out an official test I cant see how "well mr judge it just sounder...errrr.....loud.....so must be illegal"
And as for rear scilencer or not, Im 100% that is bollocks.
As long as your system has scilencers which make the db legal it dont matter, if it 1 or 5 surley!
And as far as im aware there is no law against rerouting the exhaust.
The only thing i can think is you may need an SVA or IVA what ever it is these days? and maybe theyre thinking as you dont have this "mod declared" for example theyre hitting you with it? If the exhaust is protuding in such a way which it could cause harm (ie burn) a pedestrian?
Get some pictures up as this thread is usless with out, then we can see if they had cause for concern or not.
All i can think is either get a soliciter involved who specialises in automotive cases.
Or maybe go to a Vosa or good MOT gararge and ask them their opinion as they will/should know where the legality and law falls with this sort of thing.
As said GET SOME PICS UP!!!
They have no evidence of the Db. With out an official test I cant see how "well mr judge it just sounder...errrr.....loud.....so must be illegal"
And as for rear scilencer or not, Im 100% that is bollocks.
As long as your system has scilencers which make the db legal it dont matter, if it 1 or 5 surley!
And as far as im aware there is no law against rerouting the exhaust.
The only thing i can think is you may need an SVA or IVA what ever it is these days? and maybe theyre thinking as you dont have this "mod declared" for example theyre hitting you with it? If the exhaust is protuding in such a way which it could cause harm (ie burn) a pedestrian?
Get some pictures up as this thread is usless with out, then we can see if they had cause for concern or not.
All i can think is either get a soliciter involved who specialises in automotive cases.
Or maybe go to a Vosa or good MOT gararge and ask them their opinion as they will/should know where the legality and law falls with this sort of thing.
As said GET SOME PICS UP!!!
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21-08-2009, 08:52 AM
#8
............
There is NO legal exhaust noise limit
Regulation 54 of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986
provides for the fitting and use of an exhaust system , including a silencer , to all vehicles propelled by an internal combustion engine.
(2) Every exhaust system and silencer shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not after the date of manufacture be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases. ( An aftermarket exhaust wouldnt contravene this provided you hadnt modified it )
And from the MOT:
http://www.ukmot.com/manual/6-3.htm
reason for rejection.
"b. a silencer in such a condition, or of such a type, that the noise
emitted from the vehicle is clearly unreasonably above the level expected from a similar vehicle with a silencer in average condition ( this is the ambiguous part )
Regulation 54 of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986
provides for the fitting and use of an exhaust system , including a silencer , to all vehicles propelled by an internal combustion engine.
(2) Every exhaust system and silencer shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not after the date of manufacture be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases. ( An aftermarket exhaust wouldnt contravene this provided you hadnt modified it )
And from the MOT:
http://www.ukmot.com/manual/6-3.htm
reason for rejection.
"b. a silencer in such a condition, or of such a type, that the noise
emitted from the vehicle is clearly unreasonably above the level expected from a similar vehicle with a silencer in average condition ( this is the ambiguous part )
21-08-2009, 09:52 PM
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Lee i will try and get pics of the exhaust that was on the car if i can find any of it, not sure i ever took any of just that tbh was only a couple weeks i had it and it wasnt exactly a car worth taking pics of! 
cheers for clearing some of that up folks, looks like i have got a case to stand for then in this matter, i'll be sending a nice letter in on monday after some research to the PF's!
cheers for clearing some of that up folks, looks like i have got a case to stand for then in this matter, i'll be sending a nice letter in on monday after some research to the PF's!
21-08-2009, 10:09 PM
#10
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I thought the legal noise limit was 80something decibels?
101 is very loud and definately not legal afaik.
The mongoose on my Gtir is loud, but I checked it in the high 80s. 101db is more than twice as loud as that.
101 is very loud and definately not legal afaik.
The mongoose on my Gtir is loud, but I checked it in the high 80s. 101db is more than twice as loud as that.
22-08-2009, 08:31 AM
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I don't know of any legal db limit for a road car exhaust...... I took my mk3 Polo with a single box Powerflow system on it to Elvington to get the db level checked for a trackday and it was 105.1 db lol
Got pulled for speeding while this system was on and the officer said the exhaust was a "bit loud"...... then he let me off for speeding...... really nice guy
As for having to have the correct amount of silencers....... never heard that one either
My brother & I have removed loads of centre boxes off our (& mate's) car's & no-one's had bother from the police
My brothers got no silencers on his Caddy TDI..... my dad helped him when they were removed & I'm sure my dad won't let either of us do something that is illegal or against the MOT regulations cos he's an MOT tester
Got pulled for speeding while this system was on and the officer said the exhaust was a "bit loud"...... then he let me off for speeding...... really nice guy
As for having to have the correct amount of silencers....... never heard that one either
My brother & I have removed loads of centre boxes off our (& mate's) car's & no-one's had bother from the police
My brothers got no silencers on his Caddy TDI..... my dad helped him when they were removed & I'm sure my dad won't let either of us do something that is illegal or against the MOT regulations cos he's an MOT tester
22-08-2009, 09:00 AM
#12
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Do you really think in this day and age of nanny states and big brother they won't be telling you what you can do on something?
See Rule 66 here (scroll down abit for the table of noise values.)
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/sr/sr1999/19990454.htm#66
Legal noise limit for an SVA test is 101dB
Legal noise limit for pretty much any other car is 89dB, though I am not sure if this is on the date of registry or at any time when the car is on the road.
Only bike exhausts need a kite mark.
Silencers - general
65. - (1) Subject to paragraph (3) a vehicle propelled by an internal combustion engine shall be fitted with an exhaust system including a silencer and the exhaust gases from the engine shall not escape into the atmosphere without first passing through the silencer.
(2) Exhaust systems and silencers shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not after the date of manufacture be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases.
Legal noise limit for pretty much any other car is 89dB, though I am not sure if this is on the date of registry or at any time when the car is on the road.
Only bike exhausts need a kite mark.
Silencers - general
65. - (1) Subject to paragraph (3) a vehicle propelled by an internal combustion engine shall be fitted with an exhaust system including a silencer and the exhaust gases from the engine shall not escape into the atmosphere without first passing through the silencer.
(2) Exhaust systems and silencers shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not after the date of manufacture be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases.
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/sr/sr1999/19990454.htm#66
22-08-2009, 09:07 AM
#13
Sounds like they were being a bunch of arseholes to me .
I had a couple of instances recently where they were being being bellends.
I just popped my car in front of someones drive a few weeks ago in my mates road as there was nowhere else to park and as soon as a space became free, I moved it over the road (a matter of a few yards). Anyway, a copper watched me move my car and as soon as I parked up she pulled right behind me and proceeded to talk to me like a cunt and gave me a ticket for not putting my seatbelt on!!! WTF!!!! I only moved over the road!!!! She then asked if I had tax, insurance and MOT and I replied 'well you've got the information, you tell me!'. Fucking cow! I know it's against the law to not wear a seatbelt on the public highway but all that for just moving from one side of the street to the other!!
I only ever get grief off the 'normal' coppers, everytime I have to deal with traffic coppers they have always been sound with me. Maybe the normal ones are just bitter and wish they were traffic coppers!! LOL!
I had a couple of instances recently where they were being being bellends.
I just popped my car in front of someones drive a few weeks ago in my mates road as there was nowhere else to park and as soon as a space became free, I moved it over the road (a matter of a few yards). Anyway, a copper watched me move my car and as soon as I parked up she pulled right behind me and proceeded to talk to me like a cunt and gave me a ticket for not putting my seatbelt on!!! WTF!!!! I only moved over the road!!!! She then asked if I had tax, insurance and MOT and I replied 'well you've got the information, you tell me!'. Fucking cow! I know it's against the law to not wear a seatbelt on the public highway but all that for just moving from one side of the street to the other!!
I only ever get grief off the 'normal' coppers, everytime I have to deal with traffic coppers they have always been sound with me. Maybe the normal ones are just bitter and wish they were traffic coppers!! LOL!
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