How far will Cosworth tuning go?
10-11-2004, 10:43 AM
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How far will Cosworth tuning go?
We got 780bhp YB high comp (8.6-1!!!) engines about in the Rally X scene obviously in trick cars that can handle it that would cost a fortune...but now these cars are gonna be limited to 500bhp i beleive next year...is that as far as it will go?????
We know 650bhp is easy to acheive now and how bullet proof you want it depends on your wallet size!.......Unfortunately there is no way round having more than this for a road car is there????As most tuners will want lo comp and the turbo wouldnt spin up till a fiestas redline
so drivability is crap........i reckon tuners will realise that to advance you gotta up the comp ratio...so you can atleast have drivability.
Forget NOS that is false power and is not considered real unless you constantly run it like fuel...imo.
BTW to MAD/Rod....as you understand my posts i know you wont get offended...but do a top speed run without NOS....remember Dingy claims Karls has done 220 mph without NOS and less BHP!!!!!!!(looking at dingys sig...even if he is fooling around he still claims over 200mph seen)...So we will then be able to establish roughly what karls can do as we have more chance of me proving my car than Karl!!!!!..
We know 650bhp is easy to acheive now and how bullet proof you want it depends on your wallet size!.......Unfortunately there is no way round having more than this for a road car is there????As most tuners will want lo comp and the turbo wouldnt spin up till a fiestas redline
so drivability is crap........i reckon tuners will realise that to advance you gotta up the comp ratio...so you can atleast have drivability.Forget NOS that is false power and is not considered real unless you constantly run it like fuel...imo.
BTW to MAD/Rod....as you understand my posts i know you wont get offended...but do a top speed run without NOS....remember Dingy claims Karls has done 220 mph without NOS and less BHP!!!!!!!(looking at dingys sig...even if he is fooling around he still claims over 200mph seen)...So we will then be able to establish roughly what karls can do as we have more chance of me proving my car than Karl!!!!!..
10-11-2004, 10:53 AM
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No way Rudey...just interested to see what rod can do without NOS as it does take a little away from his record imo..and that aint to cause a war...its my opinion 
I wanna know how far will it/can it go.......
I wanna know how far will it/can it go.......
10-11-2004, 10:59 AM
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Rod did 200mph and stopped with in the small confines of Brunters. GAS or no gas its an awesome achievement.
That car also has very usable mid range punch and great power band... and a low comp ratio of 7.2-1
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10-11-2004, 11:12 AM
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Super unleaded only should be used for any record unless it isnt a road going car!
BUT that aint the question
....everyone only reads the paragraphs which could provoke trouble 
BUT that aint the question
....everyone only reads the paragraphs which could provoke trouble
10-11-2004, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Bosch Man
Porkie are you not interested to see how it goes with no nos at brunters? 
Rod HAS done 200mph at Brunters and he did it in a car that can be used easily on the road.
I really think this post is just to cause more arguments
10-11-2004, 11:17 AM
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I really think this post is just to cause more arguments
Trouble with the likes of you is...your too narrow minded...sorry mate..but you can only reply that to me..are you on auto pilot????Well fooking switch it off
10-11-2004, 11:19 AM
#20
Testing the future
doing 200 at brunters bears no relation whatsoever to doing 220 on a long road.
to acheive the 200 in a 'short' distance like brunters requires gearing especially tailored to do that. to do it on a long road is much less involved.
however, back to the point of the post. the amount of power available will always be a function of the size of your wallet. to get more power you just need to increase the speed. to do that will require lighter pistons, stronger rods, crank etc. to fit the original bore/stroke, that will mean using more exotic materials that will cost more money.
certain things will filter down so that eventually you will maybe get a t4 sized compressor for the price of a current t3 or something like that maybe?
to acheive the 200 in a 'short' distance like brunters requires gearing especially tailored to do that. to do it on a long road is much less involved.
however, back to the point of the post. the amount of power available will always be a function of the size of your wallet. to get more power you just need to increase the speed. to do that will require lighter pistons, stronger rods, crank etc. to fit the original bore/stroke, that will mean using more exotic materials that will cost more money.
certain things will filter down so that eventually you will maybe get a t4 sized compressor for the price of a current t3 or something like that maybe?
10-11-2004, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Bosch Man
I really think this post is just to cause more arguments
Trouble with the likes of you is...your too narrow minded...sorry mate..but you can only reply that to me..are you on auto pilot????Well fooking switch it off All I ever do on here is create havoc and argue with almost everyone and think I am right 101% of the time and diss professionals whilst having absolutely no genuine experience of the subject matter. Sorry guys..
10-11-2004, 11:26 AM
#23
Phil,
As per usual you are totally missing the point - you are the architypal number chasing bullshitter
.
If you wish, I could get you almost any power figure you want out of the YB engine. The question should be would it be reliable (no), would it be driveable (no).
In my mind, people should be wanting engines that are nice to drive (and don't leave them wanting 10 speed boxes) - i.e. responsive and reliable. In view of this, I think that on road fuel, 600bhp is around the limit of a responsive reliable engine. Above that, the turbo required is going to be dismally unresponsive (like your closed mind to everyone elses suggestions, yet you try to hoik your own down everyone's throat ).
Wake up and smell the coffee - the high comp rally-cross engines are running "rocket fuel" (which is something you clearly don't agree with, yet boast about these figures ) .
As per usual you are totally missing the point - you are the architypal number chasing bullshitter
. If you wish, I could get you almost any power figure you want out of the YB engine
. The question should be would it be reliable (no), would it be driveable (no). In my mind, people should be wanting engines that are nice to drive (and don't leave them wanting 10 speed boxes) - i.e. responsive and reliable. In view of this, I think that on road fuel, 600bhp is around the limit of a responsive reliable engine. Above that, the turbo required is going to be dismally unresponsive (like your closed mind to everyone elses suggestions, yet you try to hoik your own down everyone's throat
).Wake up and smell the coffee - the high comp rally-cross engines are running "rocket fuel" (which is something you clearly don't agree with, yet boast about these figures
) .
10-11-2004, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Phil,
As per usual you are totally missing the point - you are the architypal number chasing bullshitter .
If you wish, I could get you almost any power figure you want out of the YB engine. The question should be would it be reliable (no), would it be driveable (no).
In my mind, people should be wanting engines that are nice to drive (and don't leave them wanting 10 speed boxes) - i.e. responsive and reliable. In view of this, I think that on road fuel, 600bhp is around the limit of a responsive reliable engine. Above that, the turbo required is going to be dismally unresponsive (like your closed mind to everyone elses suggestions, yet you try to hoik your own down everyone's throat ).
Wake up and smell the coffee - the high comp rally-cross engines are running "rocket fuel" (which is something you clearly don't agree with, yet boast about these figures ) .
As per usual you are totally missing the point - you are the architypal number chasing bullshitter
. If you wish, I could get you almost any power figure you want out of the YB engine
. The question should be would it be reliable (no), would it be driveable (no). In my mind, people should be wanting engines that are nice to drive (and don't leave them wanting 10 speed boxes) - i.e. responsive and reliable. In view of this, I think that on road fuel, 600bhp is around the limit of a responsive reliable engine. Above that, the turbo required is going to be dismally unresponsive (like your closed mind to everyone elses suggestions, yet you try to hoik your own down everyone's throat
).Wake up and smell the coffee - the high comp rally-cross engines are running "rocket fuel" (which is something you clearly don't agree with, yet boast about these figures
) . Phil, this is what your FRIENDS think and say to you....
Just imagine what I think and want to say to you!
As well as running Rocket fuel, these high comp cars also don't have to get held flat out for any great length of yime as they only do 130mph in their very short races.
10-11-2004, 11:41 AM
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Well tell that to a certain tuner who no longer does under 8-1 now on all road engines!!!!!!...Whilst running his own car at 540bhp at 9.2-1 on road fuel!
Mike...so you have just agreed with me 650 ish is the limit on a drivable road car.
Porkie...mike can say what he likes to me and vice versa...as i get along with him and could never wind me up cause i feel he is genuine,same goes for many others too.....
Mike...so you have just agreed with me
650 ish is the limit on a drivable road car.Porkie...mike can say what he likes to me and vice versa...as i get along with him and could never wind me up cause i feel he is genuine,same goes for many others too.....
10-11-2004, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Porkie
You are right, I am narrow minded All I ever do on here is create havoc and argue with almost everyone and think I am right 101% of the time and diss professionals whilst having absolutely no genuine experience of the subject matter.
Sorry guys..
All I ever do on here is create havoc and argue with almost everyone and think I am right 101% of the time and diss professionals whilst having absolutely no genuine experience of the subject matter. Sorry guys..
Originally Posted by boschman
WHY THE FUCK HAS PORKIE GOT A BEARING ON THIS POST OR DOUG
They are both nobodys with lots of cash in the car world
NOBODYS being not pros like myself and the majority of people here
They are both nobodys with lots of cash in the car world
NOBODYS being not pros like myself and the majority of people here
===============================================
10-11-2004, 11:46 AM
#29
Phil,
No, I said 600bhp NOT 650bhp.
Also, the tuner you mention - it hardly matters to a tuner how long the engine lasts does it? He has the resources etc to rebuild it every 10k or what-ever.
Would love to see the boost / ignition curve on the 9.6:1 engine
. I think it would be like you - hugely retarded 
.
No, I said 600bhp NOT 650bhp
.Also, the tuner you mention - it hardly matters to a tuner how long the engine lasts does it?
He has the resources etc to rebuild it every 10k or what-ever.Would love to see the boost / ignition curve on the 9.6:1 engine
. I think it would be like you - hugely retarded .
10-11-2004, 11:49 AM
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Mike....10k miles is fabolous for the amount of sheer torque/drivability that would give But if used as a road car 30k miles i'd expect youd see!!!!
But if used as a road car 30k miles i'd expect youd see!!!!
10-11-2004, 11:49 AM
#33
Hi
May try without Nitrous if the chance arrises next time at Brunters,
The 183 was set without Nitrous then with a 75shot it did three runs in the 181/182 & 183 proved out of reach so it aint all about Power the conditions count for so much.
Will use Race Fuel next time to upset you a bit more, No rules about Nitrous so you exploit the rules to the full.
Rod
May try without Nitrous if the chance arrises next time at Brunters,
The 183 was set without Nitrous then with a 75shot it did three runs in the 181/182 & 183 proved out of reach so it aint all about Power the conditions count for so much.
Will use Race Fuel next time to upset you a bit more, No rules about Nitrous so you exploit the rules to the full.
Rod
10-11-2004, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Would love to see the boost / ignition curve on the 9.6:1 engine
. I think it would be like you - hugely retarded . I think I have a new favourite EVER post! 
Yes Phil, all me and Doug do is pick holes. We never go to meets, drinks, shows or organise events and try to put stuff back into this site at all...
Doug, lets start our own site. www.passionnobodys.com
We could be the owners, admin, mods and everything!! we could pick holes to our hearts content!!!!
Daz, there are some better smilies now mate...
or the all time classic 
10-11-2004, 11:53 AM
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Martin H acheived 192mph was it??????Was that on race fuel or nos????....If on super unleaded i am sure Rod's could beat it due to more power on the tarmac and better areodynamics!!!
That will reflect the true top speed as a road car.
That will reflect the true top speed as a road car.
10-11-2004, 11:55 AM
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Porkie...i am a payed up trader and do users good deals..so yes i am inputing ..Have been to meets,not shows though as i aint into cars THAT much ...plusi always have a threat of some jealous haters ganging up on me because the likes of YOU fuel them.
..Have been to meets,not shows though as i aint into cars THAT much ...plusi always have a threat of some jealous haters ganging up on me because the likes of YOU fuel them.
10-11-2004, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Porkie
I think I have a new favourite EVER post! Yes Phil, all me and Doug do is pick holes. We never go to meets, drinks, shows or organise events and try to put stuff back into this site at all...
Doug, lets start our own site. www.passionnobodys.com
We could be the owners, admin, mods and everything!! we could pick holes to our hearts content!!!!
10-11-2004, 12:01 PM
#40
DEYTUKURJERBS
Re: How far will Cosworth tuning go?
Originally Posted by Bosch Man
lo comp and the turbo wouldnt spin up till a fiestas redline
compression ratio doesnt have that much to do with when the turbo spins up at all, well not compared to cam/head/turbo spec.
WILL make it less powerful and nice to drive before the boost, but the rpm vs boost will not be drasticly different