Stavros

Just tried offering up the Holset turbo and my manifold and the bolt holes didnt quite line up.

So, presuming the cheap ass stainless manifold was out, I checked it versus the usual T4 flange dimensions...



The manifold is spot on, perfect, the turbo is the one with the bolts in the wrong place! But its been dileberatly done like this it seems

Basically the one direction the hole to hole is spot on, 2.75in, but the
other direction its further apart, 3.5in rather than 3.25!

As far as I can see it I can just about, if im REALLY lucky, elongate the holes on the turbine housing until it fits, which may or may not work, and if it doesnt ive fucked it totally

The other option is elongate the holes on the manifold flange slightly, but there is only 5mm either side to cut, and id need to cut 6mm, so it will be near enough open ended then, and surely that will make the turbo able to move around and blow?

Anyone got any ideas/opinions, etc?

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

pics of both!

rsnissan

iTrader: (9)

weld the holes up on the turbo and re drill to correct positions

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

IMO id elongate the turbo flange if there is enough meat, when its all clamped up tight it shouldnt move anyhow

Stavros

Well TBH, if my thinking is right, if i make the holes on the turbo bigger, the turbo still wont be able to move, as the holes are on the inside, so no need to weld em up?

Not 100% if there enough meat on the inside to do that tho, its fucking close to the actual meat of the housing.

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

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Stavros

There you go



They identical on the horisontal axis, but the turbo has .25in wider than standard on the vertical axis...

All other things, like port sizes, are identical.

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

if you do enlarge the holes on the turbo, is there clearance for the nuts etc?

Stavros

Deffo on the inside (ie the bit closest to the snail), but looks fucking fucking close on the outside, so hard to be sure.

DazC

iTrader: (1)

How about making a template of the turbo flange, get a new flange laser cut and get it swapped over on the manifold. Permanent solution.

Stavros

True, true... need a different flange welded on to the wastegate part of the manifold anyhow, so no big deal I guess.

DazC

iTrader: (1)

Got more engineering companies round here than I can crimp logs off in a year with IBS so I find getting things made relatively easy. Wasn't sure how easy it is down your way though.

The Rapid 1

One reason I'd NOT do it that way is, it is the TURBO at fault, and the manifold that is ok, so IF in the future for any reason you change your turbo, for the same, maybe next time that turbo WILL be RIGHT, so you will be back to square one again and need to make ANOTHER flange to suit the holes being in the right place

Personaly if was me, and was looking for the cheapest way, I'd slot the holes in the turbo, and if really worried OR it PROVES a problem with the turbo moving, just weld plates on to your manifold holding it central .

THE best way is take it to a machinist who could elongate your holes and do it acurately and still leave meat on your turbo, not much but enough to hold it central .

Any ideas WHY it would have been made "special" like that

Steve

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

stav, if you can get the flanges, ill tell you where i got my manifold done to, well actually i may as well post it lol

angel engineering in westbury, a couple of units down from where caged used to be, by the car auction place.

DazC

iTrader: (1)

Or just keep the proper flange so you can swap back in the future?

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

even if the holes are elongated, the turbo still shouldnt move as the bolts will still be near the inner edges of the holes.

personally, thats what id do if there was enough room for the nuts.

Stavros

Fudgey- I can get it welded anywhere im sure, but not sure who can cut me a flange to my drawings, or can that place do that?

As im not sure if there will be room for the nuts, I dont wanna risk modding the housing.

The Rapid 1

If you taking it somewhere good enough to make a flange and weld it on, would be damn sure they good enough to elongate the holes, gotta be cheaper to, and as i said before keeps the manifold all correct as it should be


Steve

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

dunno if they got a lazer cutter, but a mill do the same job. im sure if you give them a drawing, ie what you posted, they can make a flange.

Stavros

Mill, yeah, whatever cheapest, dont give a fuck, just want this big turbo on, lol.

The Rapid 1

Hmmm "breathe" on four holes, OR make a hole new plate, machine to big openings in the midle AND THEN drill four holes, now wonder what would be cheapest/quickest/EASIEST OH and forgot cutting the old one off and welding the new one on !


Steve

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

i got a file if you want to pop round tomoz steve lol

The Rapid 1

Probably the BEST/CHEAPEST answer and will work the best

And by the time you booked it in somewhere waited etc etc, would also be quickest, just need a little effort lol


Steve

DazC

iTrader: (1)

I'd have said laser cutting it would be cheapest.

Could get a flange cut with elongated holes like stated so a normal turbo will fit back on as well.

Stavros

How cheap is cheap? I know nothing about all this malarky, lazer cutting sounds like something expensive from Starwars, milling dont, but I know fuck all

Deffo need to get a new flange made, not worth the risk modding the turbo.

DazC

iTrader: (1)

Well I went into my local cutters a couple of years ago and asked them to cut me a couple of wheel spacers in 2mm ally. When I asked how much they started rambling on about minimum charges which then came out as Ł20.

That flange is only as complex as a wheel spacer so can't see it being any more than Ł40 bearing in mind cost of materials going up since I had them cut.

A lazer cutter will cut that in about 15 seconds from setting the machine off.

Stavros

And what do i need to do? Go there with a drawing with measurments on it?

I presume it dont need to be 3D, just tell them how thick it needs to be.

DazC

iTrader: (1)

Pretty much yeah. Just make a flat drawing of the turbo flange with all the measurements, or when I got my spacers made, I took them a spacer and said copy that in 2mm ally. You could just leave them the turbo and point the bit out you want copying in 8/10mm stainless or how ever thick it is.

It'll take them longer to write the program to cut it than actually cut the thing.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

"theygotmetoo" on here can do you a flange if you go that route.

Personally my advice would be:
Drill and tap the manifold to take a helicoil
Studs into manifold
Slot the turbo rallyslag stylee
Nuts the other side (assuming there is enough clearance)




If there isnt enough clearance to do that, then do the opposite and slot the manifold, the nuts might only 3/4 overlap it but fuck it not like they are going to pull through anyway so who cares?

Stavros

Aah poo, a stainless manifold to normal turbine needs a gasket doesnt it? Due to differing expansion rates?

Anyhow, when I thought that I realised I had a T4 flange gasket, and also realised if I made a custom flange id also need a custom gasket

BUT I reckon, aside from the possible issue of getting a bolt on the end with 2 of the holes once ive elongated it, modding the housing is the best option.

Heres some pics which roughly demonstrate what I mean, though not ideal as I was struggling to keep the gasket steady while taking a pic! In reality the gasket holes sit perfect with the manifold...

Manifold


Turbo


Tons of room


Worrying lack of room

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Stud the turbo and cut the manifold (and gasket) looks best option with that clearance to me, but if it looks different in real life then go for it with cutting the housing I guess.

Stavros

How do I stud the 2 holes on the turbo that are just normal holes?

2 are stud already tho, 2 are just much bigger holes.

EDIT- I looked it up, a helicoil! But the kits dont look cheap, esp as only need to do it once. Can I take it to someone to do it??? I know nowt about this sorta thing.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Yeah your local engineering firm should be able to helicoil it for you, its dead easy.

or you can buy just the helicoil on its own if you can borrow a tap the right size

Chip

iTrader: (3)

PS

or actually to look at that, on the two you have just holes for, it looks like you have the clearance to just poke a 40mm long bolt up through the turbo housing anyway to stick out like a stud?

Stavros

Cheers mate, the more I look at it the more thats the best idea. Nice one, ill get it done ASAP

EDIT- Yeah, TBH there plenty of room to do that, spose that'd work ok.

Only problem is, wont this give the turbo the ability to move around? Or will doing it up reeeal tight just be ok???

Chip

iTrader: (3)

At least if it goes horribly wrong the worst that can happen is you get a new flange cut for the manifold thats 3.5" apart and get it tigged on, pain in the arse but beats the hell out of scrapping the turbo housing potentially.

Ive just thought of one other TRUE bodge, use M6 bolts, they will fit through where the holes half line up, it would at least do for a few test drives, lol

Stavros

I want it to stay where it is.

So even tho the turbo could move if was loose enough due to elongating the manifold holes, if the bolts are done up ok it should sit tight and seal ok?

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Yep, if its clamped up properly its not going anywhere, hence the rally cars are ok on housings like the one I posted.

foreigneRS

i would go with 4 x M6 bolts if you can get them through. one M6 bolt will hold the weight of an old mini, so 4 to hold on a turbo is plenty. virtually everything in this world (except racing machines) is made twice as strong as it needs to be.

you obviously need all metal locknuts though, but if they do work loose you haven't lost anything

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

PF at its best with the help and advice. Top work