Magnex20011

I was talking to a colleague today and I was saying it’s only matter of time before we see the end of the combustion engine. Rising oil prices, taxes, depleted oil resources, global warming, war and all the other factors will mean in ten years time
(Or less) we WILL start to see the end of mechanical engines in favour of electric cars motors , FACT!

I honestly believe the electric car makes perfect sense. NO more oil, pollution, heavy gearboxes, clutches diffs and all the other parts needed to move a car can simply be replaced with x4 electric motors in each wheel.

I honestly believe the electric car will be FASTER than the mechanical cars we use today. Permanent 4 WD, in car mapping, instant torque will outpace the mechanical counterpart. No more heavy metal, wasted energy needed to convert up and down movements into round and round movements at the wheels, no more flywheels, heavy manifolds and clunky gearboxes.

The technology is coming quick, batteries have now been developed that charge quick, hold lots of energy and are light weight / fire proof.
My colleague thought my theory was laughable, although I think he will 110 % be eating his words in ten years or less!!!!!

The only thing holding electric cars back is Battery technology. However the technology has moved on ten fold. We are now seeing safe, long lasting batteries that will drive the electric motors for substantial periods of time and charge quick.
It is also a FACT that GM invented 1200 electric cars a few years ago although they were DESTROYED to safe guard the multi billion pound industry that relies on the combustion engine.

Think of it this way - no need to walk into a dirty garages and get ripped off buying parts , no more clutches, gearboxes etc… the electric car has been HELD BACK by automotive companies that depend on YOU buying parts, having your car serviced etc.... HOWEVER time is running out, they now have no OPTION but to start looking at alternatives.

There will be HUGE benefits: Goodbye rip off garages, goodbye BP, goodbye sitting on the side of the motorway waiting for the AA, oh and diagnostics YEA RIGHT! why not diagnose your car from the inbuilt Screen!

I have a close friend who works in automotive consultancy and he knows of many confidential projects under way by car manufacturers who are developing electric cars, and from what I have heard it is VERY close.

I admit the soul of cars is in DANGER of being lost... the noise etc... But when we start seeing electric cars that can and WILL outpace the BUGATTI veyron, I say BRING IT on ASAP.


I can tell you for a FACT this is the answer! I know for a FACT this is how R + D budgets are being spent at Automotive companies.
Those of you banging on about BIO FUEL have TOTALLY 100% missed the point. The combustion engine has moving parts. Moving parts = wasted energy.
All those parts can be replaced by motors. No need for diffs, pistons , or conversion of movement from UP AND DOWN to round and round.
No More inefficiencies, no more cost of manufacturing hundreds of parts.

Ok so you think electric cars are for Plebs?? Wait till they look like the cars in I robot and outpace anything Cosworth has ever made. Electronics are the way forward!
Ever heard the term ECU???? (ELECTRONIC control unit)
It is an intelligent way to control a mechanical engine!
Ever heard of the concepts analogue / digital ?


Ten years of less people, remember this post !

jameswrx

These sort of theories about manufacturers having developed everlasting things and answers to problems then destroying them has gott be bollox?! I mean the other favourite is the everlasting razor blade.

A quick google about the GM car that was DESTROYED to safeguard the industry revealed this..

>In the 90's GM produced a line of electric cars called the EV1
>that had a following of hard core fans in California, Tom
>Hanks and Mel Gibson among them. These cars had no trouble
>accelerating and keeping up in California traffic, and once
>they went from lead-acid to NiMH batteries, the range between
>charging was 130 miles. None of these cars were sold, however,
>only leased. Once US Automakers managed to defeat California's
>"zero emissions" requirement, GM quit renewing leases, repossessed
>the cars, and destroyed them. A bunch of fans of the cars offered
>GM $1.9 million for the last 78 used EV1's that were sitting in a
>lot, but they were taken away and crushed. GM kept insisting
>that no one wanted to buy the cars.


Some facts about the EV1, the research and development of which
was produced by _my_ division of GM, Hughes Electronics:

General Motors lost two billion dollars on the project, and lost
money on every single EV1 produced. The leases didn't even cover
the costs of servicing them.


The range of 130 miles is bogus. None of them ever achieved that
under normal driving conditions. Running the air conditioning or
heater could halve that range. Even running the headlights
reduced it by 10%.


Minimum recharge time was two hours using special charging
stations that except for fleet use didn't exist. The effective
recharge time, using the equipment that could be installed in a
lessee's garage, was eight hours. Home electrical systems simply
couldn't handle the necessary current draw for "fast" charging.


NiMH batteries that had lasted up to three years in testing were
failing after six months in service. There was no way to keep
them from overheating without doubling the size of the battery
pack. Lead-acid batteries were superior to NiMH in actual daily
use.


Battery replacement was a task performed by skilled technicians
taking the sorts of precautions that electricians do when working
on live circuits, because that's what they were doing -- working
on live circuits. You cannot turn batteries "off." This is the
reason the vehicles were leased, rather than sold. As long as
the terms of the lease prohibited maintenance by other than a
Hughes technician, GM's liability in the event of a screw-up was
much reduced. Technicians can encounter high voltages in hybrid
vehicles. In the EV1, there were _really_ high voltages present.


Lessees were complaining that their electric bills had increased
to the point that they'd rather be using gasoline.

jameswrx

In any case, how do they charge.. electricity.. how do we get electricity..

foreigneRS

why the new topic? why not continue the discussion on the original topic?

GTechR

Well in the future it could be hydro, nuke, solar, wind... so the need for fossil fuel powering the electric car, in theory 'could' be floored.

But in general I do agree, I really can't see the battery powered car being the answer.

My guess would be bio fuel... as in Ethanol85 or soming like that.

GTechR

I didn't know there was one

nickscunny

iTrader: (1)

if the world "ran" out of oil as such how they hell will they produce Grease and lubricants for bearings and moving parts?????

jammy86

Is this the same thread as lastnight?

JAmes

Jimmyc

Animal greases?, or oils made from crops etc. or keep a reserve of crude for such things as lubricants and plastics.

Turbocabbie

Your are incredibly deluded
Ok simple scenario based on what you have said.. your electric car develops problems 500 miles away from home while you are on holiday. The car is not retaining charge or energy, the same stuff used to power your internal diagnostic which means you can not find out what the problems is, the fact that your car has no power ensures that you can not get it to the garage for them to inspect, are you going to get your mother to push it there or call the AA, Once repaired the car will still need filling with energy which although not being provided by BP will be provided by an equally as powerful company such as Southern Electric.

Your belief is simply far from reality

This is simply not true, a ECU is not a manner in which to control a mechanical device, proof of this can be found on early cars which run mechanical carburettors.. the fact that these cars still run without a ECU clearly shows for a FACT that the ECU is not required to control a mechanical device.
The ECU is an advancement of technology used to control the timing and fueling of a mechanical device with greater accuracy, it is a development of technology and nothing more, I dare say it will be surpassed by even greater technology as our knowledge increases.

your arguments are simply flawed and not thought out imho

the biggest change we will see in our life times is the fact that greater networks and better communication will allow people to work, shop and communicate from home.. the need to drive will start to change as online services will change the way we live.

TurboShed

Last thread was better

dojj

iTrader: (3)

the greatest change in our lifetime was the invention and subsequent mass marketing and freedom of the internet

in some cases, populated by peole who think they know everything there is to know about how much oil there is left when most reports state that there is enough for at least the next 40-80 odd years depending on who you listen to, and much more than these enviro-mentals who say it's going to run out in 4 years

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

surely this applies to conventional cars too lets face it the aa recover most modern cars to a garage why should an electric one be any different.an elctric car is much simpler

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

I remeber IBM saying in the 80's welcome to the paperless office I'm not sure who is deluded here (to use your quote)

Magnex20011

The point is the combustion engine has a limited life. If people like turbo caddie believe it will be with us forever then who is ‘deluded’?

Did you think we would never see a computer, fly to the moon etc etc

If you honestly believe the electric car won't be produced and that we will be taking our cars to backstreet garages for servicing tuning etc in the next few years,
Then IMO you have a very small minded view.

My arguments are FACT. A close friend works in automotive consultancy and has worked along side Ford, Fiat and VW. Believe me the question being asked is NOT
“how do we make the combustion engine more efficient?”

rostill2007

hydrogen is the way forward and ecu are not intelligent they are fed info by sensors they then check a table and correct the fuelling/ timing to read as close to the tables it has built in to it

Turbocabbie

very true.. im obviously deluded as well

but lets face it I never excluded myself from the possibility

Turbocabbie

Agreed and a fair point, but the internet is not a discussion it is already changing how we are shopping and allowing a larger number of people to operate businesses from home, this is without mentioning the ever increasing number of people able to work away from the office.

Im pretty certain im not deluded on this point, and can personally state the internet has effected my working life greatly with regard to location

XRT_si

iTrader: (2)

Ive been working at Autocar magazine fot he last week and I honestly think int he next few years cars WILL be changing.

Every kind of car you can think of is beginning to revolve around hybrids/electric. Supercars/4x4s everything. SUVs and 4x4s in America have droped in sales over 3% in one month, which is totally unheard of.

The guys at the mag seem to think the industry will not recover from this. Of course older cars will still survive, but the future is defo looming.

I went through about 30 press releases int he last week regarding hybrids or electric partnerships and intended uses. VW has just started a venture with Sanyo to devlop lithium ion batteries that have much better capabilities in terms of charge time and power. Sanyo is investing $769million. VW hasnt disclosed how much it is spending.

Turbocabbie

At NO point did I state that I believed that the internal combustion engine would be with us forever or state that I believed garages would cease to exist. In fact you came closer to suggesting this than I did with the following statement:
If there is money to be made fixing it, there will be rip off garages just as there will be quality garages.
If BP is not making vast profit from fuel then someone else will be such as southern electric.
it will break down and get involved in accidents, as such you will still require breakdown services, which may require you to sit the motorway waiting for the AA

It was you who stated Goodbye to things such as garages, powerful fuel company's, and suggested that we could diagnose all our cars problems from the side of the road, not me

I just believe that you are wrong and all the things you said goodbye to will still exist, not only this but once we move to electric vehicles the increase in demand for the fuel which powers them will make it more valuable and quickly increase the price just the same as the demand for grain and oil effect the prices charged for them today.

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

if as you say everyone is working at home then why is there so much congestion and rush hours, what it does allow is home traders and the here today gone tomorrow types.I for one think that the internet has increased commuting as we travel between work at work and work at home.No matter what you buy or sell on the net somewhere along the line a car truck or van will be used which will probably increase traffic and fuel useage. what we need are mud huts and spears.
Your wife now cannot walk past a shoe shop now, when she gets home she can also buy some more online.we will still go out leisure pleasure hobbies work or shopping we need to get out .

dojj

iTrader: (3)

100 years ago did anyone think there would be the advancement of technology that we had witnessed?

and go back 200 years, where they were still locking people up for being witches

all this talk of this and that being the future, if we already know what we are going to be doing then someones not looking far enough forwards

foreigneRS

believe me it is. variable compression ratio, variable vane turbo's for petrol, combinations of 2 and 4 stroke cycles - the list is endless.

it is not the only question though.

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

the good old days these so called witches were nothing more than women having pmt

foreigneRS

as for paperless offices, it is perfectly feasible in a lot of cases if the morons that worked there were educated in how to use computers and software. the number of mongs that print out emails and the like

G2RSR

electric cars will never work they have been trying to build them for years now

it needs to be convenient has the internal combustion engine not stopping at a garage for a half hour recharge

they have spent billions over the years to produce a convenient electric car but they have never built one

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

they have spent billions stopping it's production

foreigneRS

have you got a hat? if so, you better start eating it chap they do work, and they are here. hydrogen powered electric cars such as the honda fcx are the future as refilling instead of recharging is quick and similar to current practice.

but do not underestimate development of battery power once all of the major vehicle manufacturers get involved.

Jimmyc

Bit of a shitter, but the technologies already on the market £7K and a range of 40 miles:http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PEUGEOT-106-EL...QQcmdZViewItem

G2RSR

yes i believe they can build them but will they ever catch on they have built them in the past but it was all a waist of money because not many people bought them

all this about the oil is running out is bollocks yes its supply and demand there's more demand than they can supply but this is because the oil company's have not built any new oil refineries in 29 years the reason being they want to keep making a profit and building refineries cost them millions plus them not building any new refineries keeps the price high of the barral

so what will happen when the demand is far to high they will be forced to build more refineries and suddenly we will have more oil

dojj

iTrader: (3)

Originally Posted by G2RSR
electric cars will never work they have been trying to build them for years now there is no problem building them w ehave had trains and trams etc for decades


they have little wires for the electricity to go to all the way along the lines

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

roflol it was the technology I was pointing out not the wires lol, but now you come to mention it just hook your leccy car on them and away you go for free just watch out for oncoming trams