Ollie MK5 Turbo

Re: My Matt Lewis Motorsport topic i am still looking for a new 3 bar map sensor.
I have phoned up all the shops I can think of and all are out of stock.
One of the shops told me that marelli are going to make 1000 more then thats it.
Has anyone got a new 3 bar for sale or know any shops that have them in stock.

Thanks

Ollie

GUZZLER

iTrader: (3)

sold a new one for £60 last week, should have held on & ebay'd it in a few months

stevecossy

Try GS Motorsport on 01482860019 Graham maybe have 1 and i know he has a used 1 that been on a car 6months and works.

Dan

Stu @ MSD sold me mine mate Has Matt not got any in stock?

Matt Lewis

iTrader: (2)

As i said on the the phone that i would refund your money and send i free of charge when they land this week i have 50 on back order

Matt

Turbocabbie

Seems a fair enough gesture to me.

Seems like a genuine effort to put things right, and to be honest if my brother passed away the whole world could go to hell for as long as it took !!
Sorry to hear about your loss fella

Dingy

5 bar - the way forward

Matt Lewis

iTrader: (2)

5 bars and looms on the shelf

Dingy

THere you go problem solved

Dan

Yup, nice one Matt as usual!

Ollie MK5 Turbo

Yep all sorted with Matt now. Top

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

Just to clarify in case people dont know you can NOT use this on a normal map written for a 2, 2.5 or 3bar and you will have to buy a map for a 5 bar map sensor instead. If you tried, your engine would melt as you would be multpiple load sites too low when flat out!

Dingy

Surely people realise that you change any sensor type on the engine you need the map to suit.

TurboShed

Well, those of us with off-the-shelf chips probably don't realise, myself included

Dingy

Pretty sure Karl will do you an off the shelf chip for a 5 bar.

The off the shelf thing doesn't really mean a great deal.

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

If only...

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

Not everyone does mate. Same applies when people turn the boost up and wonder why it melted. Not everyone is clued up and Stu was just trying to help

Dingy

Rich, am not saying he isn't.

am I

foreigneRS

can the 5 bar and loom not be sold with a little box of tricks to match the output of the 5 bar to what a 3 bar chip would expect to see? then it would be a drop in replacement

Ollie MK5 Turbo

I wasn’t even thinking of buying a 5 bar map sensor.

pa_sjo

Yeah great idea. Lets run a sensor with less resolution than a 3 bar. Way to go.*


* assuming less than 2 bar of boost + headroom for a boost cut

Dingy

So my 3bar read to 2bar and my 5 bar reads to 4bar....

Lost me

pa_sjo

Dingy- as I said to you in the injectors thread, if you don't understand it's best to ask your tuner (as he's the only person you believe).

Dingy

Are you a complete idiot ?

since when has 5 been less than 3 - preschool maths taught me that

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

easier to write a 5 bar chip and cheaper however resolutions would be the problem if you only ran 2 bar of boost there is a 3 bar bosh sensor u can use instead of the webber one

pa_sjo

Oh dear, I thought you were a computer guy? Obviously not a very good one.

Let's have a brief educational moment (for you):-

1. Analogue inputs on ECU's are 0-5v, typically.
2. An 8-bit ADC (analogue-to-digital converter) has 256 iterations of measurement, a 10-bit one has 1024 and a 12-bit one has 4096. Remember binary?
3. A 3 bar MAP sensor thus has the resolution of 0.17, 0.04 and 0.01 psi/bit respectively (depending on ADC).
4. A 5 bar MAP sensor has 0.28, 0.07 and 0.02 psi/bit.
5. Summary = 5 bar MAP sensor has less resolution than a 3 bar. It's basic stuff.

Have a nice day now

foreigneRS

i don't think the difference in resolution is a big deal.

and anyway, the resolution of the sensor is not an issue, it's the resolution of the ADC using that sensor just me being pedantic as usual

that could be overcome if a converter was used as i suggested anyway if it was entirely analogue

Dingy

Right gotha.....

That makes perfect sense how ever running over 2bar of boost is needed to the map sensor needs to measure it.....

So its not the perfect fix but its better than not having the scope :P

And doesn't it depend on the type of 5bar that is used ?

Turbosystems

iTrader: (5)

the webber 3 bars will be landing shortly easiest option is to wait

pa_sjo

No, as foreigneRS said, it depends on the ADC resolution.

And as I said, yes you only need a MAP sensor with greater range than 3 bar when your application warrants it. Otherwise, technically, you'd have less resolution (in every circumstance) if you ran one 'bigger' than necessary.

It is rather pedantic though

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

So me running over 2 bar of boost with my 3 bar is just as bad yes?

pa_sjo

Worse.. it's shocking how many people actually do this.. a 3 bar can only measure to 29 psi.. if you run more than this, then the ECU just sits at the 'top line' of the map.. So say you run 35 psi (which i've seen people do), then the top line has to be rich enough for this boost, but then when the engine is inbetween 29 and 35 psi it will be varying rich to super-rich.. Not a very good solution

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

see my sig for the boost i hit as a peak value lol.

Dingy

Peak boost is not so bad rich (as in spike), its held boost over 2bar that you need to be concerned with even though its still not brilliant.

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

Ok Ding. Cheers mate

pa_sjo

It doesn't matter if you're holding 2 bar or peaking at 40 psi, the ECU is going to give you the same amount of fuel if you're running a 3 bar..

Dingy

Typo ?

Shouldnt that be 2 bar and dont people get over this by mapping more fuel based on thottle position ?

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

so my ecu injects the same amount of fuel at 2 bar as it does at 2.5 bar yes? Meaning it is very rich at 2 bar and not so rich at 2.5 bar? Or have i got that completely wrong

pa_sjo

No typo.. i'm sure people hack their way through the self-induced problem a gazillion cowboy ways, depending on the management being used.. Personally i'd just use the appropriate sensor for the application

pa_sjo

On the money.. (in theory)... I have no idea what your respective tuner would do to overcome the problem, or would I like to suggest otherwise that you actually have a 'problem'