JjCoDeX75

Hi all

Hope one of the web wise may be able to help. I am trying to find a website that can provide me with the history of petrol pump prices and diesel pump prices over say the last few years.

I am trying to prove theories relating to the comparable prices.

Thanks all!

JJ

focusv8

There is no theory in the oil price.
Arabs want more for their oil,,, the price goes up at the pump.
The U.K Government need more money to fund anything but road renewals & repairs,,,the price goes up.

End of..

.

Iain Mac

Try the fuel price reports in this. They go back to 2000...

http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/fuel/

JjCoDeX75

Thanks Iain

found them - not as conclusive as I had expected to be honest, but we will see!

My theory goes that the Diesel price is being forced up by an unsustainable increase in demand, which is continuing to expand beyond the supply rate.

This is in turn leading to an acclerated increase in the price of Diesel, and is not being reflected in the global overall fuel increase. it is my theory that the diesel price will continue to increase beyond the price of Petrol, which will lead to some instability in the market.

This will be exacerbated by the massive increase in the number of cars, which is being driven by the current Government Taxation policy for both VED and company car tax.

The question is, if my theory is correct (and it is not an original one I dont believe), when the government realise that Petrol is being left behind, will they simply tax petrol more, and leave diesel alone?

Interesting (albeit expensive) times are ahead.........




JJ

fuzzy

so your theory is that due to supply and demand the price will go up?

Ginge !

but like a TRUE analyist,,,, hes gone the LONG way round to discover it,,,,,,, we all KNOW fuels gonna go up in price,,,,,, why not find out when its gonna come down

Iain Mac

Also, take a look at LPG.

When unleaded was introduced it had certain tax advantages over 2 and 4 star. Those were eroded to the point that who knows how much those fuels would cost today and I believe LPG is destined for the same fate, with its taxation advantage already starting to disappear.

JjCoDeX75

In order.....

fuzzy - What I am saying is that the fact that there are loads more diesels on the road is pushing demand up for Diesel at a rate higher than can be maintained, which means that the Diesel price will rise even faster than petrol.

Ginge - No analysis required to see that the fuel prices are going up - I am looking beyond that for trends within that between diesel and petrol. As far as the price going down........ Fuck all chance of that in my opinion.

Iain - I recall that - apparently the Govt are tied into an agreement with the lpg bods that prevent them from allowing LPG to be taxed at same rate as other fuels until 2010. With that said, note that they increased the price of petrol and diesel fuel in october by 2p, and lpg will go up by 2.5p! When considered as a %, that is pretty much double the rate!

The main trouble with LPG is the fact that almost all of the manufacturers seem to have totally ignored it. This means that it is not well adopted. With that said, as you state, if it was, the Government would simply tax the fuck out of it!

They have to pay for all those people that dont want to work somehow!

JJ

focusv8

Only one other thing to say...Biodiesel is on it's way to the U.K.

.

JjCoDeX75

Probably true matey, but the cost of production at the mo is far from ideal

JJ

iansoutham

It is already here. There is a place near Walsall that sells it for 95p per litre. Somone I know lives a couple of miles from the place and fills his old Sierra Diesel up with it all the time.

What is interesting though is the number of new cars that CANNOT run on the stuff. Had a brand new BMW 535d M-sport in work the other week and it actually had a warning on the unscrewable fuel filler cap itself stating "no biodiesel".

Graceland

It may well be

But have you seen how much a loaf of bread has risen by to sustain the production of bio-diesel fuel?

well over a quid a loaf now

Graceland

My E39 Diesel has that warning on the fuel cap aswell, also in the owners manual

JjCoDeX75

Biodiesel is not sustainable as a substitute for Fossil fuels - there aint enough fields in the country, though for the first time, at least its price now works. For the first time, 95p sounds cheaper than the pump price.

As far as which cars can and cant run on it - I would like to know the reason for that - The LPG is another one - is it really as bad as some would have us believe?

JJ

captiva

I am afraid you are all in for a shock as this summer you will be paying somewhere around 1.35 British pounds for a litre of gas (petrol). We are the second largest oil producer here in Canada and a barrell of crude hit 110 USD this week and is still going further, great for our economy but we still have to pay the market price at the pumps (currently 55 pence) Our biggest customer is USA and get this they pay less at the pumps than we do and we sold it to them. You are probablt right about diesel as it is now finally taking off here and people are ditching their big V8 gas engines.

Rhys

Is Diesel differently refined oil to petrol?

JjCoDeX75

I don't doubt your predictions in reference to the uk petrol prices. My hope is that the Diesel burners will take the brunt, and the consequential relief on the demand for Petrol will keep the price just a little lower. this is wishful thinking of the highest order!

JJ

JjCoDeX75

Hi matey - yes it is. It is actually cheaper to refine Diesel than Petrol apparently!

JJ

Rhys

Strange if cheaper and easier you think now there would be more refinaries set up. I certainly do hate the price of Diesel. But in other countries diesel is still cheap than petrol, so think it might just be supply and demmand issues in this country?

JjCoDeX75

Comes back to my original point

JJ

Graham S1

Any help?



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/...sis/933648.stm

Loads of stuff here.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/...d_fuel_crisis/

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

rhys, crude oil make petrol, diesel, and gases, heated to diff temps to produce each product irc from my days iin science class lol

JJ if it helps, in 1998 when i first started driving it was 63.9p/litre of petrol

now its nigh on fucking doubled...

yesterday it cost Ł88 to fill up my citroen dispatch to 78 litres. still, at leas i aint fucking paying for it...

but today it cost Ł67 to fill up the pug 406 i got

Graceland

The production is all in the "Cracking" of the crude oil

JjCoDeX75

Thanks for the info guys! The graph is quite helpful, but the main point of the exercise is to compare Diesel to Petrol. What I have discovered is basically that up until a few months ago, the biggest difference in price between the two was about 5.5pence!

Currently it is working on a difference of as much as 9p. Over the last six months, it has increased on a month by month basis.

To be fair, I have found that for a petrol car of equivalent standard and performance to the diesel, the difference in cost needs to rise to about 35odd pence, but with the current trend, that is not entirely without possibility.

I will try to post the graph that I created with Excel and post.

Dan - you are making me feel old mate - when I started driving in the early nineties, fuel was 54.9 pence for 4*!

How times have changed!

JJ

JjCoDeX75

JJ

Stu.H

Get a diesel
Get chipfat

JjCoDeX75

Chip fat is an interesting one, but again, not sustainable on the macro scale - we would need to eat an awful lot of fish and chips!

This is kinda bio-diesel by a different name though isnt it?


JJ

PastyKing

Do you think if prices keep rising at the current rate it will increase the number of people using the likes of red diesel and fuel theft?

Graham S1

just to note, normal veg oil for cooking, had gone up to 97p from 48p last week for a litre. cheaper to buy fookin olive oil.

KW-rscos

Had a guy in Tesco where I work the other day, wanted 300litres of the stuff, when one of the girls joked and asked him why, he said to put in his car.

JjCoDeX75

Red diesel is on the way up at a frightening rate, but with the government doing little or nothing to aid the fuel costs, using Red illegally in cars is inevitable.

Gordon Brown is currently doing his level best to bypass the problem by allowing the whole rest of the economy to collapse instead!

Good distraction, mate - people losing their houses lets them forget that one of the main drivers of inflation (specifically the cost of stuff going up, and wages not matching this) is the silly cost of fuel.



JJ

foreigneRS

James, can I have your data in Excel please? I would use it to make a calculation of how a fuel economy improvement on a diesel motor gained by an Evolution Chips remap could pay for itself after x miles (and getting a shorter distance every week).

If you don't mind, please send it to me at nick@dealer.evolutionchips.com thanks

AlexF

remember that in the last 10-20 years the percentage of diesels has more than doubled.

The refinaries are geared up for a petrol consuming market and the trends for more and more diesels are not just driven by tax but also the fact they are becoming as good if not better than petrol models.

JjCoDeX75

On its way as we speak! Forgive horribly messy sheets!

JJ

JjCoDeX75

This is kinda the point - the growth in demand outweighs the supply, which is in part driven by exactly the above.

The debate over which is better (petrol or diesel) to my mind still has some mileage though - I have friends with very impressively fast diesel cars, but generally, the petrol equivalents are significantly nicer cars to drive. Also, notwithstanding the lemans audi (an endurance race), the elite cars where endurance is less of an issue still burn petrol

JJ

RobCarden

i started driving in 94 and i'm sure it was around 53p per litre....