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Swedish inlet on standard head.

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Old 30-03-2008 | 09:07 PM
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Throttle response I guess. I have heard that a ST Escos plenum will flow just fine. I want one of these cos they look cool!
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Jay.
prey tell ?
The manufacturers should be able to answer this as they will have done the tests And it isn't throttle response..
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by martin-reyland
The manufacturers should be able to answer this as they will have done the tests And it isn't throttle response..
LOL
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:13 PM
  #44  
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b9kos runs one with no issues on a standard head
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:16 PM
  #45  
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was live mapped though.....

id of thought the problem must air flow related, like no 4 geting more air than no 1? this problem maybe amplified by small ports?
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:18 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by JTECHSAFF
was live mapped though.....

id of thought the problem must air flow related, like no 4 geting more air than no 1? this problem maybe amplified by small ports?
aye mine will be live mapped to so i aint panicing lol
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:21 PM
  #47  
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mine to on the new engine!
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:21 PM
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will the size not give you shit loads more lag?
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:22 PM
  #49  
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sweede inlet is a FOOOOOOOOOOOKIN pain to make to fit properly with throttlecable and hose for intercooler..
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:23 PM
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i didnt notice any lag increase fitting one....i did however cure my surge issue
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by JTECHSAFF
mine to on the new engine!
hows the build goin chap?
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:28 PM
  #52  
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well, its a time issue at the mo,

but i have a few major components, like turbo etc etc, just the engine bits i need to get, but cant till ive had the bore inspected to see id i can stay .5 or not. if not its being linered back to standard.

than its off to martin for longstudding....
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by JTECHSAFF

id of thought the problem must air flow related, like no 4 geting more air than no 1?

The plenum is tappered to create equal air flow into each cylinder. The problem with a straight shape is that air has a momentum as it enters the plenum and this will tend to mean it bypasses the first cylinder and favours the later cylinders.

The tapering of the plenum creates a higher pressure area at the far end when compared to the TB end. The higher pressure discourages some of the air from rushing to the end and the lower pressure area slows it down enough to enter the closer cylinders.
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:39 PM
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i can only speak from my personal experience with these plenums, and i had a major air flow issue with mine before stu revised my chip, cylinder 1 was very rich, but cylinder 4 was dangerously weak....it cost me an engine as it melted no 4 piston.

its hard to spot as a wideband gives an average, which was fine,

Last edited by JTECH James; 30-03-2008 at 09:40 PM.
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:44 PM
  #55  
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heres the plugs from the engine that died



stu manahed to sort this issue, by playing with the fuelling, but.....there must be an air flow issue for it to need playing with.... the standard one never gave these issues for me.

Last edited by JTECH James; 30-03-2008 at 09:48 PM.
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Garage19
The plenum is tappered to create equal air flow into each cylinder. The problem with a straight shape is that air has a momentum as it enters the plenum and this will tend to mean it bypasses the first cylinder and favours the later cylinders.
Seeing as the original Swedish plenum is tapered then the cheaper copies should be too if the product is to be sold as a Swedish copy plenum. I buy my Swedish plenums from Sweden as I don't like copies. My original comment was based on a tapered version.
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:46 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by JTECHSAFF
well, its a time issue at the mo,

but i have a few major components, like turbo etc etc, just the engine bits i need to get, but cant till ive had the bore inspected to see id i can stay .5 or not. if not its being linered back to standard.

than its off to martin for longstudding....
nice mate

you going central day ?
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:49 PM
  #58  
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this is why my new engine is having one from mr rainbird!
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:49 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by JTECHSAFF
heres the plugs from the engine that died



stu manahed to sort this issue, by playing with the fuelling, but.....there must be an air flow issue for it to need playing with.... the standard one never gave these issues for me.
ill be monitoring egts and will dial in more fuel to a weaker cylinder
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:50 PM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by Jay.
nice mate

you going central day ?
not sure if the car will be, but im sure i will be there somehow, we must catch up for a chat!

Last edited by JTECH James; 30-03-2008 at 09:51 PM.
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Jay.
ill be monitoring egts and will dial in more fuel to a weaker cylinder

thats the best answer, and what stu wanted to do...
Old 30-03-2008 | 09:54 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by JTECHSAFF
not sure if the car will be, but im sure i will be there somehow, we must catch up for a chat!
we have a stand mate pop over
Old 30-03-2008 | 10:35 PM
  #63  
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I don't recommend these types of inlet for two major reasons.

1. Un-uniform air flow to each cylinder

2. Lazy throttle response.

Whilst many will argue one version is better than another, I have tested virtually all types on the market today and none flow uniformly. Some show EGT spreads as wide as 200DegC on full boost which can spell disaster when the engine is mapped on average AFR/EGT alone.

I now advise that all cars being mapped with this stlye plenum should have individual EGT monitoring.

Lastly remember that turbo charged cars running a single throttle body should have a plenum design that allows air to enter in as uniformly central position as possible, otherwise the effect of forced air velocity will have a substantial impact on individual cylinder air flow.

Last edited by Karl; 30-03-2008 at 10:36 PM.
Old 30-03-2008 | 10:47 PM
  #64  
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still like liking the idea of chopping my intercooler andf re welding, i just bought new boost hoses for the bloody thing aswell and then this come up lol
Old 30-03-2008 | 10:48 PM
  #65  
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What about the Rainbird ones, Im sure I was told somewhere his flow really well??

I could be wrong but Im sure his were mentioned as being good.
Old 30-03-2008 | 10:56 PM
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I've refrained from mentioning whose are worse than others, but I would NEVER fit one to any engine of mine. None flow uniformly enough to justify using one.

If you require a plenum to flow 500bhp use an EEC4 item, otherwise use a genuine RS500 item for power beyond 500bhp. (You can add a small spacer to the 500 plenum for extra flow if required without upsetting individual cylinder flow, should your aim be 600bhp+.)

There are other manifolds out there that flow well but are considerably more expensive than those mentioned above.
Old 30-03-2008 | 10:58 PM
  #67  
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whats a eec4 item
Old 30-03-2008 | 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by R5FORD
whats a eec4 item
Small turbo item ... No need to go mad on the plenum sizes, spec to what you need and nothing more.
Old 30-03-2008 | 11:07 PM
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will do you think i may need one? or should a standard 2wd plenum with a spacer do?
Old 30-03-2008 | 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by R5FORD
will do you think i may need one? or should a standard 2wd plenum with a spacer do?
As far as I am aware a 4x4 manifold with a spacer should do 500ish,but again I cannot say for sure, more of a question for the pro's ... Or cut and weld the 2wd items like jenspeed
Old 30-03-2008 | 11:13 PM
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il ask Stu or someone alike
Old 30-03-2008 | 11:33 PM
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All I want is 420 ish out of mine max. Playful but not silly
Old 31-03-2008 | 07:19 AM
  #73  
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there are several cars runing these maifolds with no issues , as long as the cars is setup right then itll be fine
Old 31-03-2008 | 07:57 AM
  #74  
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Hmmm, well having had 2 of the most respected cos tuners say don't use one I think I won't use one!! Even though it looks good its not worth melting pistons etc to look good.
Old 31-03-2008 | 08:02 AM
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Originally Posted by bigchez
Hmmm, well having had 2 of the most respected cos tuners say don't use one I think I won't use one!! Even though it looks good its not worth melting pistons etc to look good.
well to my knowledge stu sets them up fine did a really nice job on b8kos's car, i also ordered a off the shelf chip for a car with a gt30 and a swedish which the turbo alone isnt the easiest thing to do on a shelf chip and thts still in one piece
Old 31-03-2008 | 08:36 AM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by Jay.
well to my knowledge stu sets them up fine did a really nice job on b8kos's car, i also ordered a off the shelf chip for a car with a gt30 and a swedish which the turbo alone isnt the easiest thing to do on a shelf chip and thts still in one piece
I'm not knocking anyone that uses them - I'd quite like one myself. But I can't afford to risk a rebuild again. I don't really need one for my power level (I'm nowhere near needing a GT30 yet ) so I'll stick with the stock item for now.
Old 31-03-2008 | 10:34 AM
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As taken from the R&B website:

"This manifold removes the restrictive elbow, and due to it's unique design, it has been flow tested and at 2 bar of boost there is only a 2% disparity accross the cylinders. This is considerably better than the OE manifold."

Proof that a tapered swedish plenum can work well.

Mikes tapered swedish plenum design has been run on successfully on many big power cars.
Old 31-03-2008 | 11:02 AM
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It has been flow-bench tested as well as on the engine dyno with individual EGT probes per cylinder.

This manifold is on AndyG's Focus and numerous other big power cars without issue.

Last edited by Mike Rainbird; 31-03-2008 at 11:03 AM.
Old 31-03-2008 | 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Garage19
As taken from the R&B website:

"This manifold removes the restrictive elbow, and due to it's unique design, it has been flow tested and at 2 bar of boost there is only a 2% disparity accross the cylinders. This is considerably better than the OE manifold."

Proof that a tapered swedish plenum can work well.

Mikes tapered swedish plenum design has been run on successfully on many big power cars.
And there is your answer .... Flow bench tested, not made in someones back garden .

Mike, does this provide any useful gains anywhere over an EEC IV plenum up to 550ish bHP? and would it be useful on a 400BHP engine?
Old 31-03-2008 | 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
It has been flow-bench tested as well as on the engine dyno with individual EGT probes per cylinder.

This manifold is on AndyG's Focus and numerous other big power cars without issue.
nah not buying that as a weally weally big tuner says no cheers mike for ur reply


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